# Political pardoning in the past - perspectives? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [June 9, 2018, 9:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745 "2018-06-09T09:33:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2018, 9:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/1 "2018-06-09T09:33:24Z")
Tell me, how were the (relatively) mass pardonings by Reagan, Carter, LBJ, Ford, et al received by the public? Background: Dopers are getting vexed over Trump’s pardoning in [this thread](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=856242). The official statistics [here](https://www.justice.gov/pardon/clemency-statistics) show that to date Trump has pardoned more in the same period than Obama or Dubya, but far fewer than many earlier presidents. Seems like a storm in a teacup to me, but hurricanes start with little ripples. ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2018, 10:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/2 "2018-06-09T10:05:17Z")
That thread seems pretty sedate for a Trump thread. With regard to it, he seems to be listening to celebrities (Kim K and Sly Stalone) without having much personal knowledge about any potentential rifhting of wrongs. Jack Johnson is overdue of course, regardless of motivation. The main issue right now is that he is claiming he has the power to pardon himself, in a very hypothetical “I’m not saying I did anything wrong, but I’d be clear if I did” way. And it’s very disputable if he can. Democrats (and Justin Amash) say he cannot. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2018, 10:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/3 "2018-06-09T10:29:26Z")
> [@thelurkinghorror](#): > > The main issue right now is that he is claiming he has the power to pardon himself, in a very hypothetical “I’m not saying I did anything wrong, but I’d be clear if I did” way. And it’s very disputable if he can. Democrats (and Justin Amash) say he cannot. That’s best left for another thread. I’m interested in what I asked in my OP, about past presidents, not the current one. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2018, 11:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/4 "2018-06-09T11:06:11Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > That’s best left for another thread. I’m interested in what I asked in my OP, about past presidents, not the current one. > [@Quartz](#): > > Seems like a storm in a teacup to me …from the original thread, courtesy of jasg: > [@](#): > > Originally Posted by Obama pardon process > It’s worth putting this in contrast with what President Obama did. When he decided to use his clemency powers to decrease the number of people imprisoned for nonviolent drug crimes, he did not just call up his buddies to figure out whom he should grant relief or pick out a single sympathetic, high-profile case. > > Instead, he took on a systematic approach that avoided any signs of favoritism or nepotism. He asked federal inmates to submit applications for clemency, receiving, as of January 19, 2017, more than 36,000 requests, which was more than the previous eight administrations combined. Those applications were systematically reviewed by the Office of the Pardon Attorney. After this review, Obama granted pardons or commutations to more than 1,900 people — the most of any president in decades. > [@](#): > > Originally Posted by Trump pardon process > Trump, on the other hand, seems to be doing whatever rewards his friends and allies, with no real systematic process whatsoever. As Ashley Parker, Robert Costa, and Josh Dawsey at the Washington Post reported, Trump has even taken to “asking friends who else he should pardon” — perpetuating a system in which only those closest to Trump seem to get a voice. Can you not see and understand the difference in process, and why people are “vexed” and concerned? Ya don’t think that “knowing the President personally” is a pretty shit criteria for determining who and shouldn’t get a presidential pardon? It isn’t about numbers. Its about the process. It certainly isn’t a “storm in a teacup.” And what is happening is not comparable with anything past presidents have done. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2018, 11:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/5 "2018-06-09T11:10:41Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > It isn’t about numbers. Its about the process. It certainly isn’t a “storm in a teacup.” And what is happening is not comparable with anything past presidents have done. Petitioning the Government is an [expressly protected right](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_to_petition_in_the_United_States). ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2018, 11:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/6 "2018-06-09T11:17:44Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > Petitioning the Government is an [expressly protected right](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_to_petition_in_the_United_States). …“and what is happening is not comparable with anything past presidents have done.” ---
**Author:** ![Fleetwood](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fleetwood/32/271_2.png) [@Fleetwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fleetwood)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2018, 11:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/7 "2018-06-09T11:32:53Z")
But…Trump! ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2018, 11:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/8 "2018-06-09T11:45:07Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > Can you not see and understand the difference in process, and why people are “vexed” and concerned? That is for the other thread. I am asking after people’s perspectives on the pardonings of previous presidents. If you can’t resist mentioning Trump, I suggest you post in that thread, not this one. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2018, 11:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/9 "2018-06-09T11:55:14Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > That is for the other thread. I am asking after people’s perspectives on the pardonings of previous presidents. If you can’t resist mentioning Trump, I suggest you post in that thread, not this one. …you stated you thought it was a “storm in a teacup.” I was addressing that point. I’m well aware of the other question you were asking. Perhaps if you wanted a “General Questions” response then perhaps the forum to post in is “General Questions”. But we are in IMHO, and I had a humble opinion about something you stated in your OP, so I expressed my humble opinion. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2018, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/10 "2018-06-09T12:59:41Z")
Which bit of the word ‘Background’ did you miss? And this is in IMHO because different people will have different perspectives. Oh, and reported. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2018, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/11 "2018-06-09T13:17:01Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > Which bit of the word ‘Background’ did you miss? > > And this is in IMHO because different people will have different perspectives. > > Oh, and reported. …reported for what exactly? My response directly addressed your OP. The “background” was clearly an opinion, not objective fact. What you claim is a “storm in a teacup” is most certainly not a storm in a teacup in my, most humblest of opinions. You posted your opinion in this thread, not in another thread, IMHO this is the correct thread to express my opinion, not some other thread. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2018, 1:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/12 "2018-06-09T13:33:37Z")
Other than the pardons of Nixon, Marc Rich, and the Iran Contra perpetrators, and maybe a couple others along the way, we are seeing far more controversy about the substance of the pardons today than has been the case in a long time. That’s because granting a pardon to some schmo convicted of a crime, but with extenuating circumstances, is one thing. Pardoning for pretty clear political motives is another. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2018, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/13 "2018-06-09T15:06:31Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Other than the pardons of Nixon, Marc Rich, and the Iran Contra perpetrators, and maybe a couple others along the way, we are seeing far more controversy about the substance of the pardons today than has been the case in a long time. There was also Carter’s general pardon of Vietnam draft dodgers. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2018, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/14 "2018-06-09T15:26:13Z")
To answer the OP’s question, Trump is pardoning more people than recent Presidents have. Clinton, Bush, and Obama did not issue any pardons in their first year in office. Trump has issued five. > [@AK84](#): > > Petitioning the Government is an [expressly protected right](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_to_petition_in_the_United_States). The idea of it being a right is that it’s open to everyone. Kings and emperors always did favors for their courtiers. If common people wanted a royal favor, they needed to get access by asking one of those courtiers to pass along their request. This meant you usually had to offer the courtiers something in exchange. The American system is supposed to be different. Anyone is allowed to request a presidential pardon to the Office of the Pardon Attorney without the requirement of knowing somebody. Trump appears to be changing this policy. None of the pardons he has issued went through the Office of the Pardon Attorney. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2018, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/15 "2018-06-09T16:03:46Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > To answer the OP’s question, Trump is pardoning more people than recent Presidents have. Clinton, Bush, and Obama did not issue any pardons in their first year in office. Trump has issued five. Incorrect. Trump only issued one in his first year in office. (Arpaio). ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2018, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/16 "2018-06-09T16:13:27Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > Incorrect. Trump only issued one in his first year in office. (Arpaio). You missed that the punctuation is a full stop, not a semi-colon. But I’m really not interested in discussing Trump in this thread. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2018, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/17 "2018-06-09T17:08:09Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > Incorrect. Trump only issued one in his first year in office. (Arpaio). I said “Trump has issued five.” There’s nothing incorrect about that. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2018, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/18 "2018-06-09T17:32:19Z")
nm ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2018, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/19 "2018-06-09T17:36:45Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > I said “Trump has issued five.” > > There’s nothing incorrect about that. Yep. And this is also true: Clinton issued about 40 pardons/commutations in his first 2 years in office. Trump has issued 5. Nothing incorrect about that, but it’s certainly misleading. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2018, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/20 "2018-06-09T18:30:25Z")
A 60 year old woman gets to go home… Having received a life sentence for a drug case. No violence no suggestion she was anything more than an intermediary. You’d think Trump had pardoned Bernie Madoff. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745.md?page=2)