# Political pardoning in the past - perspectives? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [June 9, 2018, 9:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745 "2018-06-09T09:33:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2018, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/21 "2018-06-09T18:36:20Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > A 60 year old woman gets to go home… Having received a life sentence for a drug case. No violence no suggestion she was anything more than an intermediary. > You’d think Trump had pardoned Bernie Madoff. Don’t give him any ideas! 🙂 Seriously, though, sometimes being a hypocrite is a good thing. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2018, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/22 "2018-06-09T18:59:42Z")
Please, I’m NOT INTERESTED in Trump in this thread. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2018, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/23 "2018-06-09T19:14:36Z")
Well, Clinton got a lot of (Well deserved IMO) crap for pardoning Marc Rich, and Ford got crap for pardoning Nixon, though I think that was a wise move, much as I dislike Nixon. The Iran-Contra pardons were also controversial. But mostly pardons go under the radar. If Obama pardons some low level non-violent drug offender, why would anyone care? ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2018, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/24 "2018-06-10T14:28:29Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > Please, I’m NOT INTERESTED in Trump in this thread. Then WTF did you mention \*\*trump \*\*twice in your OP? ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2018, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/25 "2018-06-10T16:22:13Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > Then WTF did you mention \*\*trump \*\*twice in your OP? Which bit of the word ‘Background’ did you miss? ---
**Author:** ![jasg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f0a364/32.png) [@jasg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jasg)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2018, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/26 "2018-06-10T16:28:54Z")
IIRC, there was a fair bit of public criticism to the Iran-Contra and Marc Rich pardons - that led to some changes to de-politicize the process in the Office of the Pardon Attorney. Here is an [analysis](https://www.vox.com/cards/obama-presidential-pardons-clemency-commutations/under-bush-less-presidential-discretion-more-power-for-the-pardon) of Obama’s clemency changes in his second term. (Although it was written a year before he left office.) It also includes a bit of history of the pardon process and the changes implemented by George W. Bush. The outrage over the last minute Clinton pardon for Marc Rich fed into this. Also, As noted Bush Sr. got a lot of flack for his pre-trial pardons of Reagan era Iran-Contra figures. > [@](#): > > Clinton left office with a huge pardon controversy — and Bush changed the process as a result > > Under the George W. Bush administration and the first years of the Obama administration, the president relied almost exclusively on the recommendations of the pardon attorney — rather than evaluating each case individually. President Bush started this practice in reaction to the controversial way President Clinton had used pardons at the very end of his presidency. In his second term, Obama implemented a change to the process that led to significantly higher numbers of commutations. His pardons were roughly equal to Bush’s - 212 & 189 over both terms. He commuted 1715 - more than any other president. > [@](#): > > 1. The Justice Department issued a set of new criteria for commutation petitions. In April 2014, Deputy Attorney General James Cole unveiled a new set of standards for “prioritizing” clemency petitions. The guidelines called on prisoners who fit certain conditions to apply to get their sentences commuted: > > [ul] > [li]Nonviolent offenders “who would have received a substantially lower sentence if convicted of the same offense(s) today.” Most of the prisoners to whom this would apply were drug offenders, who were convicted under laws that were later changed or according to federal standards that were later loosened.[/li][li]People who had already served at least 10 years in prison.[/li] > [li]People serving a sentence for their first crime, or without much criminal history.[/li] > [li]The standards also blocked anyone with “significant ties” to gangs or cartels — which would exclude a lot of people. After Attorney General Holder issued a memo in 2013 setting a similar set of criteria to exempt people just being charged with drug crimes from mandatory minimums laws, one lawyer estimated that only 2 percent of drug offenders would benefit.[/li][/ul] ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2018, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/27 "2018-06-10T16:29:20Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > Please, I’m NOT INTERESTED in Trump in this thread. Your OP clearly indicates differently. The second paragraph shows that you are interested in minimizing Trump’s actions in comparison to other presidents. You can’t introduce the subject in the OP, and then try to dictate that other posters not bring it up. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2018, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/28 "2018-06-10T18:57:12Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > Tell me, how were the (relatively) mass pardonings by Reagan, Carter, LBJ, Ford, et al received by the public? > > Background: Dopers are getting vexed over Trump’s pardoning in [this thread](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=856242). The official statistics [here](https://www.justice.gov/pardon/clemency-statistics) show that to date Trump has pardoned more in the same period than Obama or Dubya, but far fewer than many earlier presidents. Seems like a storm in a teacup to me, but hurricanes start with little ripples. > [@Quartz](#): > > Which bit of the word ‘Background’ did you miss? Why do you think writing “Background” gives you immunity to discuss Trump and then expect no one else to chime in? Especially when you include non-Background stuff like the part I underlined. That’s not background-- that’s your opinion of the issue as it relates to Trump. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2018, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/29 "2018-06-10T19:41:07Z")
I would point out Clinton’s pardoning of Susan McDougal and Roger Clinton, Jr. Both done on the last day and very controversial as they appear to be no more than pardoning a business partner and a sibling(?!). The first seems to be par for the course for Presidents but pardoning your own brother for no apparently good reason? Pretty scummy if you ask me and a legal abuse of power. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2018, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/30 "2018-06-10T19:54:49Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Why do you think writing “Background” gives you immunity to discuss Trump and then expect no one else to chime in? Especially when you include non-Background stuff like the part I underlined. That’s not background-- that’s your opinion of the issue as it relates to Trump. No kidding. Let me try to illustrate one version of the OP that he could have written, but didn’t: “How often did prior Presidents generate controversy with their pardons?” ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2018, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/31 "2018-06-10T20:01:18Z")
> [@Larry\_Borgia](#): > > If Obama pardons some low level non-violent drug offender, why would anyone care? It shows he is “SOFT ON CRIME!!!” A lot of conservative governors have a policy of not pardoning or commuting sentences for this reason. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2018, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/32 "2018-06-10T20:44:43Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Yep. And this is also true: > > Clinton issued about 40 pardons/commutations in his first 2 years in office. Trump has issued 5. > > Nothing incorrect about that, but it’s certainly misleading. The exact figure is forty-two. Clinton issued forty-one pardons and one commutation in his first two years in office. All on the same day: November 23, 1994 (which was fifteen days after the mid-term elections). Trump has issued five pardons and two commutations. We obviously don’t know what his two year total will be. I’m not sure what point you think you’re making but there are the facts. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2018, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745/33 "2018-06-10T20:49:39Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > The exact figure is forty-two. Clinton issued forty-one pardons and one commutation in his first two years in office. All on the same day: November 23, 1994 (which was fifteen days after the mid-term elections). > > Trump has issued five pardons and two commutations. We obviously don’t know what his two year total will be. > > I’m not sure what point you think you’re making but there are the facts. Why would you be uncertain about the point I was making when I spelled it out explicitly for you? The facts, as presented are misleading. Are you clear now? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-pardoning-in-the-past-perspectives/815745.md?page=1)