# Poll: Sauron vs Voldemort **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [August 20, 2001, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poll-sauron-vs-voldemort/77191 "2001-08-20T17:48:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2001, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poll-sauron-vs-voldemort/77191/1 "2001-08-20T17:48:17Z")
OK, you’ve heard your Darth Vader vs whomever. Try this one. Inspired by that fact that I’m re-reading _The Lord of the Rings_ and Lady Chance is re-reading _Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire_ I give you this match up: **Sauron, aka The Enemy** vs **Lord Voldemort, aka You-Know-Who** In this corner we have Sauron, of Middle Earth: Pros: Supremely evil conquering wizard Created own race of ne’er do wells Owns entire block of geography in Middle Earth Can be killed and come back Has army Has kick ass Dark Tower Can corrupt the strong Cons: Has been killed in the past Can be taken out of his game by someone less than 4 feet tall Sometimes overlooks the glaringly obvious Doesn’t appear to have long-term plan for despotic rule other than crush his enemies Relies on magic object for much of his power Prone to losing said object And over here, in the Union Jack trunks we have Lord Voldemort, of England: Pros: Supremely confident evil wizard Has followers loyal to him past all reason Can be killed and come back On second thought, may no longer be mortal at all Controls snakes, even really big scary ones Battles against the glaringly foolish Ministry of Magic Scares the living crap out of all whom know him Cons: Not confident enough to go mano-a-mano with old teacher Can be taken out of his game by someone less than 3 feet tall No army No tower Relies on magic object for a big chunk of power Prone to relying on followers rather than doing the job himself Last seen in residence in Albania So how about it, folks? Who’s going to win this star-studded, too-good-to-truly-be, astonishly grudge match of supreme evil magic users? ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2001, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poll-sauron-vs-voldemort/77191/2 "2001-08-20T17:51:15Z")
Sauron vs. Voldemort? Millenia-old Fallen angel vs. trumped-up wizard not even 200 years old? One who rules entire territories and races vs. a guy who can only express himself through turbans, old memo-books, and the like? C’mon, no contest. Sauron wouldn’t even have to blink. ---
**Author:** ![Rosebud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ea666f/32.png) [@Rosebud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rosebud)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2001, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poll-sauron-vs-voldemort/77191/3 "2001-08-20T18:18:45Z")
Yeah, I’m gonna have to go with Sauron. Voldemort’s a baddie alright but Sauron is Evil Incarnate. Not a hijack, I hope, just a question: it’s been a while since I tried to read _The Silmarillion_, so I’m not clear on what Sauron’s connection to Morgoth is. Hope I’ve got the name right… anyway, the one who was essentially the Lucifer of Middle Earth. Voldemort, though a badass, doesn’t seem to have quite the same level of badassness that Sauron does. ---
**Author:** ![Fiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e274bd/32.png) [@Fiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiver)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2001, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poll-sauron-vs-voldemort/77191/4 "2001-08-20T18:33:28Z")
I’m with the others. Voldemort would be like dry leaves in an angry wind before Sauron’s power. Although this seems like the wrong “versus.” Voldemort an Sauron are on the same side! Shouldn’t this be “Voldemort & Sauron vs. the Ministry of Magic and Gondor?” How about Sauron vs. the Dursleys? Would the Dursleys make Sauron live in a cupboard under the stairs? ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2001, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poll-sauron-vs-voldemort/77191/5 "2001-08-20T18:38:30Z")
Saying that Sauron is taken out by someone under 4 feet tall is a bit of a stretch. Remember he had an entire ARMY in the field laying siege to a city and then in a huge battle at his own gates meanwhile a commando team of 7 specialist in their fields working covertly against him. Plus he had several races teaming up against him. Meanwhile Moldvont can’t deal with a non trained whiny little boy and couple of zany friends. No Contest Sauron in about 2 seconds. ---
**Author:** ![missdavis102](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7feea3/32.png) [@missdavis102](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/missdavis102)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2001, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poll-sauron-vs-voldemort/77191/6 "2001-08-20T18:45:39Z")
Is this a remake of Henry Rollins vs. Glen Danzig? Same premise - Sauron (in the role of Rollins) is a proven badass with the clout to back it up, while Voldemort (as Danzig) looks okay in the trunks but lacks any real authoritative ‘oomph’ and has the additional burden of lesser writing and plot devices. No contest - Sauron in the first round. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2001, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poll-sauron-vs-voldemort/77191/7 "2001-08-20T18:56:23Z")
You see, I’m just not sure any of that is true. I think Voldemort is badder than you’re giving him credit for. Some facts: For all his supreme badness, Sauron still only managed to carve himself out some of the lesser desired real estate on middle earth as his own. And he did it with huge armies and the Nazgul and every other evil thing in creation backing him up. Voldemort, on the other hand, with essentially a handful of followers (really, from the evidence there were never more than 100 death eaters) managed to get within a hairsbreadth of conquering a world in which a significant number of others were powerful witches and wizards. In the end, Sauron never had to array himself again magical odds of 1000s to 1. Voldemort did it without a second though. So, even though it appears that Sauron is the early favorite in the clubhouse, I’d have to say that it’s not as simple as you’re making it out to be. ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2001, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poll-sauron-vs-voldemort/77191/8 "2001-08-20T19:05:08Z")
Sauron will win in the Swimsuit competition. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2001, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poll-sauron-vs-voldemort/77191/9 "2001-08-20T19:48:48Z")
**JC** Do you think Harry, Ron and Hermione could deliver the ring to Mt. Doom? No way! ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2001, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poll-sauron-vs-voldemort/77191/10 "2001-08-20T19:50:11Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Jonathan Chance \* > \*\* In the end, Sauron never had to array himself again magical odds of 1000s to 1. Voldemort did it without a second though._\* Sauron began alone after the overthrow of Morgoth. He eventually managed to dazzle and beguile the high Noldorin elves of Eregion. And he did this despite the misgivings of Elrond, Gil-Galad, and Galadriel. Sauron was taken by the Numenorians as a captive, and all by himself, Sauron subverted the people of Numenor, and sent them off to rebel against the Valar themselves. He was the only one to survive the wreck of Numenor, except for those few faithful who were already at sea. Sauron came from these origins to within a hairs-breadth of taking over all of middle-earth when he fought the Last Alliance of Elves and Men to a standstill. He slew Elendil and Gil-Galad himself, and if Isildur had not gotten fortunate and cut the ruling ring off, Sauron would have reigned supreme. ---
**Author:** ![NaSultainne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/8797f3/32.png) [@NaSultainne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NaSultainne)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2001, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poll-sauron-vs-voldemort/77191/11 "2001-08-20T19:56:49Z")
Nahh, guys, I gotta go with Lord V on this one. His magic and follower’s alike against all other magic? And he was thisclose to winning? And even when he lost _still_ found a way to come back new and improved? And the numero uno reason I like Voldy? Tolkien was entirely too long winded. While I’m here, can I offer another interesting match? How 'bout Sethra Lavode v. Sauron? ---
**Author:** ![Maeglin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@Maeglin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maeglin)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2001, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poll-sauron-vs-voldemort/77191/12 "2001-08-20T19:59:57Z")
Word wrap is your friend. It wants to be used. Clearly Sauron is preeminent. Yet he _was_ only Morgoth’s lieutenant, an ex-Vala of staggering power. For those still firmly in the Voldemort camp, how do you think your little wizard would survive against the first child of Iluvatar? ---
**Author:** ![Myrr21](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Myrr21](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Myrr21)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2001, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poll-sauron-vs-voldemort/77191/13 "2001-08-20T20:07:08Z")
_humph_ Sauron wins, while enjoying a grisly mockery of a tea-party at the same time. Also, he probably poisons all the land for three hundred miles around him, just for good measure. ---
**Author:** ![slortar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6bbea6/32.png) [@slortar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/slortar)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2001, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poll-sauron-vs-voldemort/77191/14 "2001-08-20T20:11:29Z")
Dear God. Sauron was older than the Earth itself. He was the most trusted lieutenant of a being so powerful he could hammer Mt. Everest into the Grand Canyon in one blow. He could assume a form described by Tolkien as “fell”–by inference it was intimidating enough even to give a Noldor Prince the willies. Voldemort would make a nice snack, assuming Sauron didn’t just snap his will and keep him as a court jester. ---
**Author:** ![katiekilldare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/838e76/32.png) [@katiekilldare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/katiekilldare)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2001, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poll-sauron-vs-voldemort/77191/15 "2001-08-20T20:33:44Z")
Now, I’m not saying **Lord Voldemort** is not a bad ass. Because he IS. But **Sauron** would mop up with you-know-who’s slimy Slytherin butt. ---
**Author:** ![Joe\_Cool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ecb155/32.png) [@Joe\_Cool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joe_Cool)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2001, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poll-sauron-vs-voldemort/77191/16 "2001-08-20T21:10:15Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Jonathan Chance \* > \*\*In this corner we have Sauron, of Middle Earth: > > … > > Cons: > Relies on magic object for much of his power > Prone to losing said object > > …\*\* You make it sound like Sauron just left the Ring on the coffee table and wandered off to smell flowers. At the end of a battle, his finger was cut off of his hand, with the ring attached. Quite a difference, say I. Oh, and the Ring wasn’t the _source_ of his power. The Sauron 's power was put into the Ring when it was forged. To be fair though, I haven’t read anything Harry Potter, so I can’t comment on the battle. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Zero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c4cdca/32.png) [@Saint\_Zero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Zero)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2001, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poll-sauron-vs-voldemort/77191/17 "2001-08-20T21:14:14Z")
Sauron, without needing a deep breath. Now, more interesting would Saurman vs Lord V ---
**Author:** ![Balance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ccd318/32.png) [@Balance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balance)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2001, 1:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poll-sauron-vs-voldemort/77191/18 "2001-08-21T01:25:22Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by NaSultainne \* > How 'bout Sethra Lavode v. Sauron? I’m with the “Sauron would squash Voldy like a bug” camp, but _this_ sounds like an interesting match. Sethra has taken out godlike beings before, with minimal damage to herself–she was visibly fatigued, but unhurt, after destroying one of the Jenoine. Notably, the Jenoine essentially created races of sentients for their own purposes (an interesting parallel with Sauron’s orcs, trolls, and such). Sethra has the advantages of Orb-sorcery (lots of it), pre-Empire sorcery (which is some nasty $#!^), and Dzur mountain in her pocket. If Iceflame is strong enough to eat Sauron, and Sethra has access to the Orb, I give it to her in Round 4. If Iceflame isn’t up to it, it gets dicier–probably Sethra by decision. **Saint Zero** ’s “Saruman vs. Voldemort” match might be interesting, too. We’ve got two very different styles of evil wizard here. Saruman is a charmer/enchanter for the most part, and his direct offensive magic is likely to be on the order of elemental evocation (fire, lightning, etc). His defensive abilities are unclear, but he managed to hold Gandalf prisoner, which argues for strong defenses against magic of his own school. His ability to resist or defend against curses is unknown, but he’s likely to shrug off most direct-damage assaults. Voldemort is something of a general practitioner, a speller for all seasons. He’s top-notch on curses, skilled in apparation (a major tactical advantage), and…er…talks to snakes. Well, the snakes probably won’t be much help, but the other abilities are definitely at issue. He presumably has some evocation skills of his own, but he doesn’t seem to use them much–they probably won’t be a major factor. Unless Saruman has some defense against the Killing Curse (perhaps Maiar can’t be killed that way?), Voldemort can take him down quickly. If Saruman can’t be killed by the curse, stand by for a long knock-down drag-out fight. In the end, Voldy’s apparation will be the key. Voldemort by knockout in Round 7. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2001, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poll-sauron-vs-voldemort/77191/19 "2001-08-21T03:29:45Z")
Saruman is also an Ainur, who participated in Ainulindale, and dwelt for countless ages in Valinor before moving to Middle-Earth, and being corrupted. I don’t think Voldemort would be a challenge.