# Polyamorous couples with kids **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [September 4, 2006, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polyamorous-couples-with-kids/371344 "2006-09-04T00:49:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Antinor01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecae2f/32.png) [@Antinor01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antinor01)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2006, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polyamorous-couples-with-kids/371344/141 "2006-09-07T22:27:23Z")
[QUOTE=Hamadryad] Also, people keep saying that they wouldn’t give another adult authority over their kids. Especially in their own HOUSE. Well, when another mother comes over to visit, with her kids, she gets some authority over my kids and I get some over hers. I can tell them to wash their hands before they come to the table, and she can tell them not to play in the giant mud puddle at the end of the driveway. And somehow, the kids all seem fine with this. [/QUOTE] That struck me also. It’s not unusual to have other adult authority figures in the home, any home. My grandmother lived with us for most of the time I was growing up and was certainly a third adult authority in the home. In large families or families with large age gaps in the kids the older siblings often take an at least partial authority role, my SO grew up with his grandparents across the street and his aunt living next door and they were certainly authority figures in his life. ---
**Author:** ![fisha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@fisha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fisha)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2006, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polyamorous-couples-with-kids/371344/142 "2006-09-07T22:27:23Z")
“Okay, I’m not even going to continue discussing this with you, as you are ignoring the fact that all the poly people who contributed to the thread said they aren’t PARADING anyone anywhere. And you have yet to prove that any of the downfalls of a poly relationship couldn’t also happen in a traditional family.” So if I don’t agree, you quit talking? What a way to make your point. Or mine. ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2006, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polyamorous-couples-with-kids/371344/143 "2006-09-07T22:32:16Z")
[QUOTE=dahfisheroo] “Okay, I’m not even going to continue discussing this with you, as you are ignoring the fact that all the poly people who contributed to the thread said they aren’t PARADING anyone anywhere. And you have yet to prove that any of the downfalls of a poly relationship couldn’t also happen in a traditional family.” So if I don’t agree, you quit talking? What a way to make your point. Or mine. [/QUOTE] No, I’ll continue the discussion, just not with you. You are ignoring facts that don’t support your opinion. ---
**Author:** ![Antinor01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecae2f/32.png) [@Antinor01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antinor01)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2006, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polyamorous-couples-with-kids/371344/144 "2006-09-07T22:34:29Z")
[QUOTE=dahfisheroo] Well, actually it makes no difference to me, I’ll just keep plodding along in my little life. I just felt that someone should throw out the absolutely scandalous idea that to have a sequence of strangers parade through children’s lives and homes, only because of their desirablility of a romantic nature to the parent(s), might be problematic in the children’s life. Not to mention the time and energy it takes to find, woo, and develop serial emotional relationships. Seems like a common sense point to me. [/QUOTE] I totally agree with you. My parents have a neighbor who has 6 children by 5 different men, who she dated at different times and married none of them. Last I knew she had a new man living with her and her children, and he wasn’t the first new boyfriend she had moved in to her home with her children. It is a very sad and very disfunctional situation. Fortunately, none of those issues seem to apply with any of the poly people that have posted here. ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2006, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polyamorous-couples-with-kids/371344/145 "2006-09-07T22:38:56Z")
[QUOTE=Antinor01] I totally agree with you. My parents have a neighbor who has 6 children by 5 different men, who she dated at different times and married none of them. Last I knew she had a new man living with her and her children, and he wasn’t the first new boyfriend she had moved in to her home with her children. It is a very sad and very disfunctional situation. Fortunately, none of those issues seem to apply with any of the poly people that have posted here. [/QUOTE] And I’ll bet none of those neighbors of yours considered themselves “poly” anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Lissa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/85f322/32.png) [@Lissa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lissa)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2006, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polyamorous-couples-with-kids/371344/146 "2006-09-07T22:41:10Z")
[QUOTE=dahfisheroo] Kalhoun- just because 2 people anecdotally say it’s wonderful for children doesn’t make it necessarily so. I posited that there are no reliable studies either way, at least that I’ve found. [/QUOTE] I don’t think we should be relying on “studies” as the definative answer to this issue. According to studies, I should be very fucked up. My mother took medication while she was pregnant with me which caused severe birth defects. I went through a lot of stuff when I was a kid which studies have shown should make me socially maladjusted. A “statistically higher chance” doesn’t mean “a vitrual certainty” because there’s a million different factors which goes into what makes us the people we are. Secondly, studies are only as good as the people doing them. To paraphase what Jack McCoy once said in _Law and Order_: "If a study shows that most juvenile delinquents chew gum, should we assume that gum-chewing cause delinquency? Studies are sometimes seeking to confirm what the funders already “know.” Even researchers who believe themselves unbiased can turn out bad data if all of the variables weren’t taken into account. It boils down to this: no matter what a study says is statistically more likely to occur, the end result lies with the individual. Parents-- good ones, that is-- should know their own kids well enough to see if they’re being harmed by the parents’ lifestyle. Children show it when they’re not getting what they need. They act out, seem depressed or scared, withdrawn or hostile. It varies with every kid, but when a kid is being neglected or mal-treated, a person who works with kids (or has them) can almost always tell. They haven’t learned to hide their feelings like adults have. Whether it’s multiple partners or spending time rollerskating, if the parent’s activities are causing harm or neglect to their children, they have a duty to stop it even if it’s what makes them happy. The kids come first. If the parent, who knows the child better than anyone in the world, can see that the child is happy and well adjusted, they should go on doing what works for them. ---
**Author:** ![Antinor01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecae2f/32.png) [@Antinor01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antinor01)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2006, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polyamorous-couples-with-kids/371344/147 "2006-09-07T22:43:45Z")
[QUOTE=Kalhoun] And I’ll bet none of those neighbors of yours considered themselves “poly” anyway. [/QUOTE] No, she isn’t poly. She was a serial dater. My point was that parading a line of people through your house and saying ‘this is your new dad!’ is a bad thing for kids. I was also pointing out that no poly person here or any other poly family mentioned does this. Sorry if I wasn’t clear that I’m on your side **Kalhoun**. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![fisha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@fisha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fisha)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2006, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polyamorous-couples-with-kids/371344/148 "2006-09-07T23:31:19Z")
Ok, ok, ok, let’s slow down here a little. I am not so sure I am anti-poly, don’t make assumptions. Kalhoun, other than repeating that the two anecdotes on this thread by posters who say it is a positive, you have not provided any facts, or links yourself to prove _your_ point. My points are these. Poly is inherently a selfish act by the parents, it is not foremost in their mind to begin a poly lifestyle because they think it will be beneficial to their children. It also takes time, effort, and emotional energy, that perhaps could be spent on the primary relationship, or the kids. It may have some inherent qualities not found in other relationships that would be additionally taxing on children in their own household. (See previous links.) It also has potential benefits not normally found in conventional marriages. There are additional risks to poly relationships not found in marriages. Does that make them wrong? That’s a moral debate. But it _does_ make them harder. That was the only reason I jumped into this thread, to point that out. Kinda like having 5 kids makes things a little harder than one or two… Antinor, I think we can all agree that that is horrendous behavior on the mother’s part. Hamadryad, thank you for replying to me, and explaining it a little bit better. And Whynot, I think you summed it up best in #135. ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2006, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polyamorous-couples-with-kids/371344/149 "2006-09-07T23:51:42Z")
[QUOTE=Hamadryad] - False dichotomy. Are those the only two choices? - This is called a false dichotomy. Are those my only two choices? - Boy. You guys are way keen on those false dichotomies. Although none of those quotes specifically state “you are seeing things in black and white,” it is implied that those are the only two options the poster (other than YOU, of course) has thought of or left room for. [/QUOTE] For starters, I asked you for examples of me _accusing_ other posters of seeing things as black or white. You do understand that an _implication_ is not an _accusation_, don’t you? Now, as to whether my questions were even implications that the posters saw everything as black or white? Strike two. My response was to a \*specific \*comment, not to _everything_ said by the poster. Finally, my comment about a false dichotomy referred to the \*choices \*I was offered, not to the \*philosophy \*of poster. Strike three. Take your seat. ( **Kalhoun** , this is exactly what I mean by people reading into comments what they want, and not taking the time to read closely.) > [@](#): > > As far as saying “poly is bad, mmkay?” no, you haven’t. However, your statements lead a casual reader to that conclusion. I have been accused of it, however, over and over. Why in the world should I care what a casual reader concludes? Perhaps casual reading is something you should avoid. It is generally a waste of time and can lead to false conclusions. > [@](#): > > Which implies that giving another adult authority over the children is a Bad Thing. It is entirely possible for you to\* infer\* what is not _implied_. See above: close reading. Also see: Stating that a thing is bad in one instance is not the same as stating it is bad in avery instance. See above: Viewing the world as black or white. > [@](#): > > The implication, particularly with the Pretty Big IF, is that the children will be effected. We are using different definitions of “imply.” The word “if” signifies a _conditional_ relationship, not an implicatory one. > [@](#): > > Also, you deliberately misunderstood the point being made about a step-parent being another adult with whom a parent can become sexually involved, and also give authority over the children without the child’s consent or approval. I didn’t misunderstand it at all. As I pointed out, the comparison given between divorce and polyamoristoligism was shallow, weak, and insufficient. It gave neither light nor heat. > [@](#): > > Worded in a way which implies that New Guy is automatically a Bad Thing. Also, insults the heck out of WhyNot’s husband with the word “abdicate,” which implies a deliberate surrender. Was it **WhyNot** ’s husband, or was it the husband of **WhyNot** ’s friend? Remember, close reading is your friend. [QUOTE] Chose examples which compare a polyamorous family with incest, kidnapping, rape and murder. If you don’t understand > [@](#): > > how one could take that as a clue that you are against polyamory, then I don’t think you’re in touch with reality. I chose extreme examples to point out the weakness of the _analogy_,as stated, of divorce to polyamifamiliasm. Actually, if anything, they plead the poly case. Close reading … > [@](#): > > Both of which imply that the needs of the children are, in this type of situation, not being met. See: If vs. Imply. > [@](#): > > You fail to mention which of the child’s needs are not being met if you HAD had sex with her. This is just bizarre. If I had had sex with her I should be arrested. > [@](#): > > You never answered my question. It was incoherent as presented. You don’t get to present a laundry list and demand that if I did not mean said list, I must have meant something else. This all came about because of your equivocations. Keep them to yourself, please. ---
**Author:** ![Lightnin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lightnin/32/180_2.png) [@Lightnin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lightnin)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2006, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polyamorous-couples-with-kids/371344/150 "2006-09-07T23:52:04Z")
[QUOTE=Contrapuntal] Then you should think twice before bandying about such gems as this – \*I suspect that Contrapuntal’s entire argument can realistically be boiled down to “I don’t like polyamory, and I will brook no argument that it should be allowed”. \*You only embarass yourself. [/QUOTE] Yeah. I _suspect_. I’m not embarassed- care to explain why I should be? In your first post, you stated that you have no problem with the poly lifestyle… but then you repeatedly imply that you DO have problems with it, as **Hamadryad** has pointed out. [QUOTE=Contrapuntal] Yes. Those are my words. Congratulations. Now all you have to do is show where those words say the relationship is bad, and then somehow extrapolate that into a statement about _all_ poly relationships. Happy hunting! [/QUOTE] BZZT! Wrong! _You_ get to explain how the casual reader isn’t supposed to read that as a blanket condemnation of the poly lifestyle. That’s not my responsibility. If you’re unable to make yourself clear, it’s not my problem. ---
**Author:** ![Hamadryad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/6de8d8/32.png) [@Hamadryad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamadryad)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2006, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polyamorous-couples-with-kids/371344/151 "2006-09-08T00:07:14Z")
[QUOTE=Contrapuntal] For starters, \ please.\*\* [/QUOTE] You know, you seem to be far more interested in picking apart the semantics of others’ posts than you are in actually addressing anyone’s points. Congratulations; YOU WIN TEH INTARNETZ! Because this isn’t a dialogue; this is you mistaking IMHO for GD, which is where you should probably be. \*\* NOTE: This is not a direct quote, and is merely meant to represent the amount of actual meaning in the post in question. ---
**Author:** ![Jamaika\_a\_jamaikaiake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/7993a0/32.png) [@Jamaika\_a\_jamaikaiake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jamaika_a_jamaikaiake)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2006, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polyamorous-couples-with-kids/371344/152 "2006-09-08T00:08:53Z")
[QUOTE=Contrapuntal] Except I never said that, despite what numerous posters in this thread would have you believe. I said IF it is bad for the children, the parents are irresponsible in engaging in such behavior. [/quote] > [@](#): > > That’s just it. The child did not sign up for it. Why did this father abdicate his reponsibility? > > If it had happened to me I would have left home. It’s tough enough to be a teenager as it is. Now New Guy has moved into your house, is screwing your mother, and coming down harder on you than your father? The needs of the children should be foremost, IMHO. Maybe I misunderstand… * * * > [@](#): > > Also, as I noted, being held hostage by a serial killer/rapist has the same property. Comparisons made at such a superficial level, with no background information, are rarely useful. I don’t think my analogy was only superficial. I think I explained it quite well, actually. Do you disagree with this logic: > [@me](#): > > Remarriage has the same property. Therefore, if you think remarriage is okay, then this property alone isn’t enough to call something bad. Like I said before, I don’t neccesarily disagree with you. I just think that the interloper argument is particularly weak. ---
**Author:** ![Sarahfeena](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sarahfeena/32/519_2.png) [@Sarahfeena](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sarahfeena)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2006, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polyamorous-couples-with-kids/371344/153 "2006-09-08T00:35:01Z")
[QUOTE=Kalhoun] I never said you were shitty. I said IT’S shitty. You used the analogy. You can take a little part of the blame, can’t you? [/QUOTE] I have to admit that I regret how I phrased that. However, I don’t think I deserve “blame” for pointing out the flaws in this rather dubious analogy. I am not necessarily condemning the poly lifestyle. Frankly, I’m not sure if there really is a “poly” lifestyle, as there seems to be many different ways to define it. I hesitated to get involved in this discussion because I didn’t want to directly insult anyone (especially **WhyNot** , who I respect as a person and who has always shown herself to be a sensible individual). However, I had to address the roller skating analogy, because I think it IS a very serious thing to embark on such a lifestyle. I, personally, am very cautious when it comes to children. I think parents have a serious obligation NOT to enter into situations that run a high risk of causing irreparable harm to themselves or their children. You are right that life is risky, but it is the responsibility of the parents to do what they can to lessen the risk. As far as I can see, the poly lifestyle has a lot of risks involved that I, personally, would not want to subject my family to. Frankly, I question whether the rewards of such a lifestyle are at all worth these possible risks. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2006, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polyamorous-couples-with-kids/371344/154 "2006-09-08T00:38:53Z")
[QUOTE=Hamadryad] > [@Contrapuntal](#): > > For starters, \ please.\*\* You know, you seem to be far more interested in picking apart the semantics of others’ posts than you are in actually addressing anyone’s points. Congratulations; YOU WIN TEH INTARNETZ! Because this isn’t a dialogue; this is you mistaking IMHO for GD, which is where you should probably be. \*\* NOTE: This is not a direct quote, and is merely meant to represent the amount of actual meaning in the post in question. [/QUOTE] Please review the new [FAQ - Rules for Posting at the Straight Dope Message Boards](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=7697048) Text inside [QUOTE] tags is sacrosanct. Normal editorial rules apply: that is, you may indicate omitted portions of a quote by the use of ellipses “…” and you may add text to clarify a word using square brackets (e.g., “her [the sister’s] friend”), but you may not add editorial comments or edit a quote so as to change the substantive meaning; nor may you substitute text such as “some blather” or “more nonsense” inside the [QUOTE] tags. Do not do this again. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2006, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polyamorous-couples-with-kids/371344/155 "2006-09-08T00:42:22Z")
For a couple of days now, I’ve been wavering between moving this to GD or to the Pit. I don’t believe it is suitable for either at this point, but neither do I believe it is suitable for IMHO at this point. Feel free to start a new thread in either GD or the Pit, as appropriate for your perspective. Thread closed. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polyamorous-couples-with-kids/371344.md?page=7)