# Poorly conceived movie and/or SF inventions/technology **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 25, 2006, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poorly-conceived-movie-and-or-sf-inventions-technology/377916 "2006-10-25T23:45:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Enter\_the\_Flagon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Enter\_the\_Flagon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enter_the_Flagon)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2006, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poorly-conceived-movie-and-or-sf-inventions-technology/377916/21 "2006-10-26T05:20:56Z")
Virtually all the science fiction in “The Matrix”: Using people as batteries. Uh-huh. Cause we all know that people generate more energy than they consume. They’re good like that. The need for a homing device to find somebody in the Matrix. Everywhere he goes, every time he turns a doorknob, the Matrix has to create that particular reality just for him, but the Matrix can’t find him. It’s like a spider not being able to find a fly in the spiderweb. No, it’s worse than that. It’s like a spider building the web around the fly, yet not being able to find him. They erased Neo’s mouth at the beginning of the movie, and then when they want him dead, they can’t think to erase his nose **and** his mouth, so he can’t breathe? Hell, why not erase his whole head! Stupid, stupid movie. Liked the characters, though. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![marshmallow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@marshmallow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marshmallow)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2006, 6:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poorly-conceived-movie-and-or-sf-inventions-technology/377916/22 "2006-10-26T06:57:35Z")
[QUOTE=t-bonham@scc.net] Look at human history, for example: anybody who dealt with the Roman Empire had to learn to speak Latin. That’s the way Empires work. But _Star Wars_ ignored this. [/QUOTE] The Empire didn’t have much time to convert everyone over to English in the movies. Besides, there would presumably be a lot of aliens that simply **couldn’t** speak anything resembling a human language, just due to their anatomy. ---
**Author:** ![Critical1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3e96dc/32.png) [@Critical1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Critical1)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2006, 7:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poorly-conceived-movie-and-or-sf-inventions-technology/377916/23 "2006-10-26T07:38:06Z")
[QUOTE=msmith537] Any race that uses edged weapons for anything other than ceremonial purposes - Dune , etc, etc. Cinema doesn’t quite capture how useless a sword is against an enemy that can hit you from 300 yards away. [/QUOTE] well in the Duniverse they had personal shield tech that rendered voirtually all projectile wepons useless. but you point is well taken, the only people who should be using a blade are friggin ninjas ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2006, 8:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poorly-conceived-movie-and-or-sf-inventions-technology/377916/24 "2006-10-26T08:17:34Z")
[QUOTE=Enter the Flagon] Virtually all the science fiction in “The Matrix”: Using people as batteries. Uh-huh. Cause we all know that people generate more energy than they consume. They’re good like that. [/quote] No argument there. [QUOTE=Enter the Flagon] The need for a homing device to find somebody in the Matrix. Everywhere he goes, every time he turns a doorknob, the Matrix has to create that particular reality just for him, but the Matrix can’t find him. It’s like a spider not being able to find a fly in the spiderweb. No, it’s worse than that. It’s like a spider building the web around the fly, yet not being able to find him. [/quote] Then why does my computer have such a hard time ditecting viruses? Why can a skilled hacker break into my system undetected and steal my credit card nymber? Because that’s exactly what they were doing. A skilled hacker can make a computer respond to his commands without actually noticing he’s there, and that’s what Neo et al were doing - hacking. [QUOTE=Enter the Flagon] They erased Neo’s mouth at the beginning of the movie, and then when they want him dead, they can’t think to erase his nose **and** his mouth, so he can’t breathe? Hell, why not erase his whole head! [/QUOTE] When they erased his mouth he was still hardwired into the system and completely under their control. Later, he was hacking in, and they had to use less direct methods (i.e. shooting him). God knows, those movies have some mind-boggling flaws, but those two points have logical explanations (to a given amount of “logic”). ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2006, 9:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poorly-conceived-movie-and-or-sf-inventions-technology/377916/25 "2006-10-26T09:48:07Z")
[QUOTE=RealityChuck] Also, for that matter, why is it easier to activate than to turn off? [/QUOTE] If the purpose is to prevent the ship from falling into enemy hands, this does make sense. You don’t want them to easily hit a Big Red Stop Button after they board the ship. As far as inertial dampeners - maybe they’re tied to the navigation system and essentially counter-act the programmed accelerations, but outside forces like explosions or collisions don’t fall under that. Of course, that’s no excuse not to have seat belts.. ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2006, 10:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poorly-conceived-movie-and-or-sf-inventions-technology/377916/26 "2006-10-26T10:31:39Z")
[QUOTE=Terrifel] Guns vs. swords = guns win. I’m sorry, but that’s how it works. I don’t care how glowy the swords are. [/QUOTE] Guns vs. magic = magic wins. I’m sorry, but that’s how it works. I don’t care how many rounds per millisecond your gun fires. (This only works in Star Wars, however. Dune, on the other hand, has the personal shield technology which _would_ render guns useless.) > [@Enter the Flagon](#): > > The need for a homing device to find somebody in the Matrix. Everywhere he goes, every time he turns a doorknob, the Matrix has to create that particular reality just for him, but the Matrix can’t find him. It’s like a spider not being able to find a fly in the spiderweb. No, it’s worse than that. It’s like a spider building the web around the fly, yet not being able to find him. Software is always designed with multiple units that talk to each other using as little data as possible each time. It’s the only way humans can even hope to understand the system as a whole once it passes a certain (relatively small) level of complexity. If the original human designers of the Matrix didn’t imagine (or want to allow) people tracking others down, this becomes much more understandable. > [@](#): > > Using people as batteries. Uh-huh. Cause we all know that people generate more energy than they consume. They’re good like that. I always thought of Morpheus’ ‘explanation’ to Neo in the first movie as being his regurgitation of the crap he was fed by the Matrix itself. Obviously, the Matrix needs both Zion and a Neo every so often, and what better way to motivate everyone than to have them think human beings have been reduced to AAs? > [@](#): > > They erased Neo’s mouth at the beginning of the movie, and then when they want him dead, they can’t think to erase his nose and his mouth, so he can’t breathe? Hell, why not erase his whole head! Because Agent Smith is arrogant almost to the point of complete psychosis even that early in the movies. What could a mere _monkey_ do to the most powerful computer system in the Universe, anyway? (I’m aware there are simpler, plot-driven explanations for all of these things. But they aren’t as fun. So there!) > [@SenorBeef](#): > > If the purpose is to prevent the ship from falling into enemy hands, this does make sense. You don’t want them to easily hit a Big Red Stop Button after they board the ship. I still don’t quite buy this. I’m aware real ship’s captains can order their vessel scuttled if capture is obvious, but there isn’t (to my knowledge) a single, specialized system for doing so. They order their crew to damage the existing systems, instead. Why would that be changed in the future? Wouldn’t they worry about someone going crazy or comitting sabotage or a simple flaw in the software? ---
**Author:** ![chrisk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@chrisk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chrisk)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2006, 10:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poorly-conceived-movie-and-or-sf-inventions-technology/377916/27 "2006-10-26T10:53:57Z")
[QUOTE=brianjedi] Isn’t it, though. Of the Galaxy-class ships we saw on the show, only the Enterprise didn’t explode within minutes of appearing on-screen. The Galaxy and the Yamato were toast, and I seem to recall at least one other that didn’t make it past the second commercial break (Challenger, maybe?) [/QUOTE] Erm… I’m sorry, but I don’t think we ever saw the ‘Galaxy’ on-screen, did we? (Or if you didn’t mean to imply that we did, then I’m sorry for misunderstanding.) ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2006, 11:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poorly-conceived-movie-and-or-sf-inventions-technology/377916/28 "2006-10-26T11:22:41Z")
On another dimension, battle androids in anime that have the appearance of very cute teenage girls – like [Nuku Nuku](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/All_Purpose_Cultural_Cat_Girl_Nuku_Nuku) or [Mahoro Ando](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahoromatic). They are clearly designed for fanservice: not for effectiveness in battle. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2006, 12:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poorly-conceived-movie-and-or-sf-inventions-technology/377916/29 "2006-10-26T12:05:15Z")
[QUOTE=SenorBeef] As far as inertial dampeners - maybe they’re tied to the navigation system and essentially counter-act the programmed accelerations, but outside forces like explosions or collisions don’t fall under that. Of course, that’s no excuse not to have seat belts.. [/QUOTE] They could be like shock absorbers. They reduce the bumps that would otherwise pulp the contents of the ship. How about fighter-sized spacecraft in general. Oh I can see a purpose in having them for recon or attacking ground targets. But it seems like nonsense in Star Wars or Battlestar Galactica to have capital ships several miles long blasting away at each other while fighterplanes zip in and out like fleas assisting their host dog in a fight. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2006, 12:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poorly-conceived-movie-and-or-sf-inventions-technology/377916/30 "2006-10-26T12:18:52Z")
[QUOTE=msmith537] How about fighter-sized spacecraft in general. [/QUOTE] Depends. If a small ship is capable of carrying a weapon capable of destroying a large ship, I’d say it’s even more practical. I mean, it’s like saying, “Who needs infantry when you’ve got tanks?” ---
**Author:** ![Khan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3ab097/32.png) [@Khan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Khan)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2006, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poorly-conceived-movie-and-or-sf-inventions-technology/377916/31 "2006-10-26T12:29:49Z")
[QUOTE=chrisk] Erm… I’m sorry, but I don’t think we ever saw the ‘Galaxy’ on-screen, did we? (Or if you didn’t mean to imply that we did, then I’m sorry for misunderstanding.) [/QUOTE] [Here’s a list of all the Galaxy class ships that appeared in Star Trek.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Odyssey) The first one to go was the [Yamato](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Yamato_%28Star_Trek%29), which went pop after its computer was infected by an ancient alien computer virus that made it drop its warp core containment field. The second was the Odyssey, which was [destroyed](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/ce/USS_Odyssey_Destroyed.jpg) during the ill-fated first encounter with the Jem Hadar. In fairness to the Galaxy class, though, those were some pretty special cases. Plus, considering how other starship classes fared fighting the dominion, the Galaxy class seems straight-up rugged: [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:USS\_Majestic\_hit.jpg](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:USS_Majestic_hit.jpg) [http://images.wikia.com/memoryalpha/en/images/0/04/Sacrifice\_of\_Angels\_17.jpg](http://images.wikia.com/memoryalpha/en/images/0/04/Sacrifice_of_Angels_17.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2006, 12:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poorly-conceived-movie-and-or-sf-inventions-technology/377916/32 "2006-10-26T12:42:07Z")
[QUOTE=SenorBeef] If the purpose is to prevent the ship from falling into enemy hands, this does make sense. You don’t want them to easily hit a Big Red Stop Button after they board the ship. [/QUOTE] So you set the timer so the ship is dust before they get aboard. All the more reason to put the control near the escape pod. ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2006, 12:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poorly-conceived-movie-and-or-sf-inventions-technology/377916/33 "2006-10-26T12:51:23Z")
Only one elevator to the bridge of NCC-1701A. No other way out. Why would you build a flying motorcycle and then fly it down inside the forest? If you went up 20M you could just fly over the trees. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2006, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poorly-conceived-movie-and-or-sf-inventions-technology/377916/34 "2006-10-26T13:50:40Z")
> [@](#): > > \*He/it was referred to as a 'droid, though appearing to be completely a robot rather than an android. Actually, one time in the entire Star Wars movie cycle (I take no responsibility for novels/comic strips/cartoon series/TV movies/Christmas Specials) they referred to R2D2 and C3PO as “Robots”. It was in the first movie (or fourth, depending opn how you number them. The one that came out in '77), just before Luke realizes that the Imperial Stormtroopers will probably get to Uncle Owen and Aunt Beroo. “That means they’ll trace the _robots_ from the Jawas to Uncle Owen and Aunt Beroo, and that will lead them …back home!” Obi-Wan: “No, Luke. It’s too dangerous!” But he’s off. I agree with you on the robots vs. androids thing. SF usage when I grew up would call C3PO and R2D2 robots, but the terms “robot” and “android” ahave been slippery, as we’ve shown in many past discussions here. And Star Ward uses “droid”, giving them even more wiggle room. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2006, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poorly-conceived-movie-and-or-sf-inventions-technology/377916/35 "2006-10-26T14:04:36Z")
Don’t remember the name of the episode in Star Trek TOS, but Kirk is split into Good Kirk, who is an ineffectual wimp, and Evil Kirk, who is a lech. Sulu _et al_ are freezing their asses off on the planet, nobody can beam them up because the transporter isn’t working. Good Kirk is also an idiot - send down a shuttle craft! And Matrix would have sucked somewhat less if they used people for processing power instead of energy. That I could believe. But once you need to drag out “the villian makes fundamental mistakes because he is so arrogant” you have lost me. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Shoeless](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shoeless/32/7099_2.png) [@Shoeless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shoeless)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2006, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poorly-conceived-movie-and-or-sf-inventions-technology/377916/36 "2006-10-26T14:16:21Z")
[QUOTE=Dewey Finn] Also, the bridge on the Enterprise appeared to be at the center of the top level of the saucer section. Why not bury the bridge in the ship’s interior, where it would be less vulnerable? [/QUOTE] Well, they did have the “battle bridge” which was down in the lower section somewhere and was used after the saucer section separated. But yeah, why not just make that the primary bridge in the first place? ---
**Author:** ![HPL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/3da27b/32.png) [@HPL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HPL)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2006, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poorly-conceived-movie-and-or-sf-inventions-technology/377916/37 "2006-10-26T14:50:55Z")
[QUOTE=RealityChuck] Also, the self-destruct device in that movie (and, for that matter, in many other films). It’s on the bridge. Why not put it near the escape ship? That way you can set it and get the hell out of there before the ship blows up. Also, for that matter, why is it easier to activate than to turn off? [/QUOTE] Ripley had plenty of time to reach the escape shuttle. She even had enough time to run all the way back and try to turn it off and then run all the way back to the shuttle to escape. Also, it wasn’t particulary hard to turn off, it just had to be done before the countdown had progressed too far and the process couldn’t be reversed. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2006, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poorly-conceived-movie-and-or-sf-inventions-technology/377916/38 "2006-10-26T15:02:06Z")
Imperial Stormtrooper armour. One blaster hit and you’re dead. What’s the point? ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2006, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poorly-conceived-movie-and-or-sf-inventions-technology/377916/39 "2006-10-26T15:05:47Z")
[QUOTE=Derleth] (This only works in Star Wars, however. Dune, on the other hand, has the personal shield technology which _would_ render guns useless.) [/QUOTE] With the slight caveat that if you hit a Dune shield with a laser (the most common ranged weapon depicted), both the laser and the shield generator _exploded_. Kind of a deal-breaker, I would think, as to whether or not the troops would either (a) use the shields or (b) shoot anywhere _near_ one. ---
**Author:** ![Raguleader](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/258eb7/32.png) [@Raguleader](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Raguleader)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2006, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poorly-conceived-movie-and-or-sf-inventions-technology/377916/40 "2006-10-26T15:31:01Z")
Some thoughts on Star Trek: The Battle Bridge is located in the neck of the Galaxy class starships, in the part that locks into the saucer section. This doesn’t seem THAT much safer than where the normal bridge is, but supposedly that portion of the neck is one of the most ruggedly built parts of the ship (since it has to hold the whole saucer section onto the rest of the ship). Me, I’d stick it nearish to Engineering, but whatever. On an unrelated note, I was highly amused to find that modern warships have battle bridges, but they’re called “Combat Information Centers” (IIRC), and ARE located deep in the guts of the ship. The Captain sits on the Bridge, the XO sits in the basement, was how it was explained to me when I was 11 and visiting Pearl Harbor. The Galaxy class wins more battles than it loses, even counting the USS _Yamato_ (which has the dubious distinction of being destroyed on screen twice in the same season) and the USS _Oddessy_ (and honestly, the thing was effectively forced to fight without sheilds, had been heavily damaged fighting multiple enemy ships, and then was _rammed_ in a kamikazi attack by one of the enemy ships. FIND me a non-cube-shaped ship that would have fared better in the ST universe. I think the USS _Galaxy_ actually shows up later in DS9, taking and dishing out severe punishment but surviving while fighting the Dominion. In the DS9 episode “Sacrifice of Angels”, we see a pair of Galaxy class starships bulldogging their way through a Cardassian formation, knocking down ships left and right with phaser broadsides at point-blank range :eek: We see a number of Galaxies doing various things on DS9, for example, I think the USS _Venture_ (a somewhat more heavily armed version of the Galaxy) is the flagship of 9th Fleet. Most Galaxies that we’ve seen destroyed were lost either because their sheilds were rendered ineffective (USS _Oddessy_, USS _Enterprise_) or else were lost in non-combat situations (USS _Yamato_) There’s various fanwank speculation about whether the Galaxies shown later in DS9 have extra hull protection, because they have a slightly different color scheme, or if that’s just a quirk of the CGI they used on DS9. In case you’re wondering, there is much fanwank amongst Star Trek fans. And there are liability lawyers in the ST universe. They were all tragically lost in a suspicious (some would even say contrived) series of transporter accidents soon after they graduated law school though. ☹ As for Independence Day, the big saucer ships didn’t really take all that much damage from the air-to-air missiles fired by the fighters. If anything, the humans should get slapped on the wrists for thinking the missiles would have done much of anything to the ships. The only time an air-to-air missile had any success was when it was flown directly into the ship’s superweapon before it was about to fire (presumably releasing all that energy inside the ship instead of it being focused on Area 51) Oh, and the Dune sheilds didn’t only make high-velocity projectile weapons useless (they did use short-range low-velocity dart guns), but they also made beam weaponry (somewhat common, at least in the militaries of the early DUNE books) VERY dangerous. If you fired a laser and hit a sheild, you (and possibly the sheildbearer, I can’t remember) would find youself at the epicenter of a subatomic explosion, which is presumed to be an impressive sight to behold from afar. ( **Ethilrist** has beaten me to this point, I see) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poorly-conceived-movie-and-or-sf-inventions-technology/377916.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poorly-conceived-movie-and-or-sf-inventions-technology/377916.md?page=3)