# Pop-culture heroes who have turned into villains **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [May 27, 2009, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-culture-heroes-who-have-turned-into-villains/497758 "2009-05-27T01:19:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2009, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-culture-heroes-who-have-turned-into-villains/497758/41 "2009-05-29T04:06:22Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > In the series “Rome,” Octavian. He starts out as a kid you sympathize with, even if he is a bit haughty - his intelligence is admirable and he seems the most modern of them all, the easiest to identify with. By the end he’s an utterly sociopathic tyrant. Actually, that was one of the things I admired about the “Rome” series- they didn’t make the all-too-common mistake of presenting ancient peoples as if they were “just like us.” Even the most sophisticated, liberal, progressive Roman was NOT a modern Canadian in a toga. He had attitudes we’d find horrifying. Things that strike us as barbaric seemed routine to him. Some of the characters on “Rome” did change for the worse… but some of them didn’t really change so much as gradually reveal who they really were. And who they really were was NOT what a modern viewer expected. ---
**Author:** ![jackdavinci](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackdavinci/32/3259_2.png) [@jackdavinci](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jackdavinci)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2009, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-culture-heroes-who-have-turned-into-villains/497758/42 "2009-05-29T04:24:42Z")
> [@YamatoTwinkie](#): > > See the [tvtropes](http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/FaceHeelTurn) list [See also](http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TookALevelInBadass) ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2009, 12:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-culture-heroes-who-have-turned-into-villains/497758/43 "2009-05-29T12:25:44Z")
Lex Luthor started out as a good guy and friend to Superboy, but ended up hating him and turning evil after losing his hair. ---
**Author:** ![JThunder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e95f7d/32.png) [@JThunder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JThunder)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2009, 12:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-culture-heroes-who-have-turned-into-villains/497758/44 "2009-05-29T12:39:49Z")
You could also mention Jericho from DC’s Teen Titans. ---
**Author:** ![Kal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9de053/32.png) [@Kal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kal)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2009, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-culture-heroes-who-have-turned-into-villains/497758/45 "2009-05-29T13:31:01Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > Every face might have at least one heel turn, but aren’t there plenty of heels who never turn face? Very few, actually. While a wrestler may be nothing but a heel (or face) during a run with one promotion, I don’t think there are many who remained heel (or face) throughout their career. Steamboat, Magnum TA, Jim Brunzell and Tito Santana never had heel runs in any promotion, far as I know. Can’t think of any heel who wasn’t a face at some point. > [@Wilson](#): > > Rey Mysterio? He was heel (or at least a tweener) for a short time in WCW, as part of the Filthy Animals. ---
**Author:** ![Calatin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/439d5e/32.png) [@Calatin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Calatin)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2009, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-culture-heroes-who-have-turned-into-villains/497758/46 "2009-05-29T14:08:26Z")
Pretty much one of the “key” supporting characters in every Dan Brown novel. The man knows only one formula for his books. ---
**Author:** ![Intergalactic\_Gladiator](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/intergalactic_gladiator/32/112_2.png) [@Intergalactic\_Gladiator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Intergalactic_Gladiator)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2009, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-culture-heroes-who-have-turned-into-villains/497758/47 "2009-05-29T14:30:05Z")
> [@thwartme](#): > > When the TV series “Mission Impossible” was transformed into the first of a Tom Cruise trilogy, the old series good-guy character of Jim Phelps turned out to be the bad guy. Which is an outrage, and I’m sure Peter Graves was spinning in his grave … what? Really? Still? Wow. I’m with you on the “Outrage” comment. I wasn’t the biggest fan of MI, but I have watched it here and there. Seeing it on the big screen and having the whole thing end up with Phelps explaining away his evil actions by saying “Well, gosh, I want money” was really stupid and pointless on the filmmakers’ part. I haven’t seen any of the sequels and I’m in no hurry to either. Don’t the sequels have members of the Impossible Mission Force turning heal as well? Can’t that agency keep a few good men? Is it their recruiting or do they just pay the agents crap? What’s up with that? ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2009, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-culture-heroes-who-have-turned-into-villains/497758/48 "2009-05-29T15:39:25Z")
I wasn’t bothered with the Jim Phelps being a bad guy because, as far as I was concerned, he didn’t lead the IMF. Dan Briggs did. ---
**Author:** ![Dan\_Norder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4af34b/32.png) [@Dan\_Norder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dan_Norder)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2009, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-culture-heroes-who-have-turned-into-villains/497758/49 "2009-05-29T16:46:18Z")
> [@The New and Improved Superman](#): > > Suddenly, Metallica ARE “the man” - fighting change, opposing youth culture, greedily sucking money out of their audience’s pockets, even though they’re already loaded. Being against theft is not “opposing youth culture”. Maybe someday someone robs you of your rightful belongings and then when you complain about it that other people just as clueless as you accuse you of being greedy and trying to smack down youth culture. It might help you get some much needed perspective on reality instead of this self-serving greediness _you_ apparently have that people like the members of Metallica rightly oppose. ---
**Author:** ![Don\_Draper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b2d939/32.png) [@Don\_Draper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_Draper)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2009, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-culture-heroes-who-have-turned-into-villains/497758/50 "2009-05-29T18:58:14Z")
> [@Dan\_Norder](#): > > Being against theft is not “opposing youth culture”. Maybe someday someone robs you of your rightful belongings and then when you complain about it that other people just as clueless as you accuse you of being greedy and trying to smack down youth culture. It might help you get some much needed perspective on reality instead of this self-serving greediness _you_ apparently have that people like the members of Metallica rightly oppose. This is exactly the type of statement that convinced a lot of Metallica’s former fanbase that Rage Against the Machine were way cooler. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-culture-heroes-who-have-turned-into-villains/497758.md?page=2)