# Pop songs with a slow-shuffle beat. **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 15, 2011, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-songs-with-a-slow-shuffle-beat/589095 "2011-07-15T03:22:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Mean\_Mr.Mustard](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mean_mr.mustard/32/3865_2.png) [@Mean\_Mr.Mustard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mean_Mr.Mustard)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2011, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-songs-with-a-slow-shuffle-beat/589095/41 "2011-07-17T14:36:33Z")
> [@drastic\_quench](#): > > Talking Heads - [Take Me To The River](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXYB-1KTeh4) is a damn good one. I don’t know a shuffle from a kerfluffle, but damn, that is one great song. mmm ---
**Author:** ![Mean\_Mr.Mustard](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mean_mr.mustard/32/3865_2.png) [@Mean\_Mr.Mustard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mean_Mr.Mustard)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2011, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-songs-with-a-slow-shuffle-beat/589095/42 "2011-07-17T14:45:39Z")
Awright, here’s my entry: [Shuffle?](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L5pHM-o2_Dk) (awaiting confirmation) mmm ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2011, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-songs-with-a-slow-shuffle-beat/589095/43 "2011-07-17T15:01:39Z")
> [@Argent\_Towers](#): > > I think that song, one of my favorites by L.Z., is a little more complex than a traditional shuffle, which has a pretty repetitive bass and drum line. Maybe it’s technically a shuffle but to me it sounds like its own unique rhythm. That song, by the way, has one of the best prolonged solos completely in a major key, which is another topic for a thread I plan on starting. It’s definitely a shuffle but, like the “Rosanna” beat, it’s a half-time shuffle, so instead of the snare coming in on 2 & 4, it comes in the 3s. It seems like you’re looking for more swampy, bluesy shuffles with clear “DUM-duh-DUM-duh-DUM..etc.” type bass or kick drum lines. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2011, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-songs-with-a-slow-shuffle-beat/589095/44 "2011-07-17T15:06:00Z")
> [@Mean\_Mr.Mustard](#): > > Awright, here’s my entry: [Shuffle?](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L5pHM-o2_Dk) > > (awaiting confirmation) > mmm It has a certain swing to it, but it’s not really a shuffle beat. ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2011, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-songs-with-a-slow-shuffle-beat/589095/45 "2011-07-17T15:07:22Z")
> [@panamajack](#): > > Found [this interesting video](http://quietube.com/v.php/http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MwFdExvCxM4&feature=related) in which Jeff Porcaro describes where the Rosanna beat came from. It’s also interesting in how the YouTube processing eliminates much of the information Jeff it trying to illustrate. YouTube reduces the frame rate so much that some stick movement, which is present in only an adjacent frame or two, is completely lost. I hear the sounds, but I can’t see how all of them are made and the instructional value is compromised. Great clip anyway. MMM – _Take me to the River_ isn’t a shuffle, but an even-eights. Just because it’s slow doesn’t mean it’s a shuffle. The Tom Petty song _is_ a shuffle (uneven eights, or dotted eighth/sixteenth), although many shuffles don’t have that heavy a backbeat. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2011, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-songs-with-a-slow-shuffle-beat/589095/46 "2011-07-17T15:15:36Z")
> [@Musicat](#): > > It’s also interesting in how the YouTube processing eliminates much of the information Jeff it trying to illustrate. YouTube reduces the frame rate so much that some stick movement, which is present in only an adjacent frame or two, is completely lost. I hear the sounds, but I can’t see how all of them are made and the instructional value is compromised. > > Great clip anyway. > MMM – _Take me to the River_ isn’t a shuffle, but an even-eights. Just because it’s slow doesn’t mean it’s a shuffle. The Tom Petty song _is_ a shuffle (uneven eights, or dotted eighth/sixteenth), although many shuffles don’t have that heavy a backbeat. You hear shuffle in the Tom Petty song? The melody has a shuffle to it, but the underlying rhythm is slow straight eighths, to, just like “Take Me to the River.” ---
**Author:** ![Mean\_Mr.Mustard](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mean_mr.mustard/32/3865_2.png) [@Mean\_Mr.Mustard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mean_Mr.Mustard)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2011, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-songs-with-a-slow-shuffle-beat/589095/47 "2011-07-17T15:52:32Z")
> [@panamajack](#): > > Found [this interesting video](http://quietube.com/v.php/http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MwFdExvCxM4&feature=related) in which Jeff Porcaro describes where the Rosanna beat came from. FWIW, Rosanna sounds more like a modified Bo Diddley beat than a shuffle to me. mmm ---
**Author:** ![bahia\_hombre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@bahia\_hombre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bahia_hombre)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2011, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-songs-with-a-slow-shuffle-beat/589095/48 "2011-07-17T15:57:58Z")
> [@BDoors](#): > > One thing I’m taking from this thread is that “shuffle” means different things to different people! To me, it means a triplet-feel beat, and is synonymous with “swing”. > I would describe it not too differently from you - take a “one-and-uh two-and-uh” rhythm, where the “one”, “and”, and “uh” each occupy the same amount of time. Then replace all the “ands” with silence of the same duration, so you’re left with “one… uh two… uh three” etc. That’s a shuffle, and the notes on the "uh"s are swung notes. Oh, that. How about Killer Queen and California Girls? https://www.youtube.com/embed/MMz-wi50ACU?feature=oembed&wmode=opaque https://www.youtube.com/embed/i_iyf-lNFbs?feature=oembed&wmode=opaque ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2011, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-songs-with-a-slow-shuffle-beat/589095/49 "2011-07-17T16:00:23Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > You hear shuffle in the Tom Petty song? The melody has a shuffle to it, but the underlying rhythm is slow straight eighths, to, just like “Take Me to the River.” But subdividing the even-eights is a shuffle, with hits on 1 & 4 of a 4-pattern. I hear it mostly in the guitar pickup stroke (4) to the downbeats. Not prominent, but it’s there. I guess if you require a shuffle to have a triplet subdivision, it wouldn’t qualify since it’s a 4 part pattern. I can take it either way. Take me to the River doesn’t have a further subdivision that I can readily hear below the even 8ths. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2011, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-songs-with-a-slow-shuffle-beat/589095/50 "2011-07-17T16:51:30Z")
That’s why I wasn’t sure if TMttR was a shuffle; I can fit the and-a in there but don’t know if it is the song naturally. ---
**Author:** ![Shoeless](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shoeless/32/7099_2.png) [@Shoeless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shoeless)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2011, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-songs-with-a-slow-shuffle-beat/589095/51 "2011-07-17T21:20:42Z")
What about Cream’s “Spoonful”? Is that a shuffle? ---
**Author:** ![Argent\_Towers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e8c25b/32.png) [@Argent\_Towers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Argent_Towers)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2011, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-songs-with-a-slow-shuffle-beat/589095/52 "2011-07-17T21:22:13Z")
> [@bahia\_hombre](#): > > Oh, that. How about Killer Queen and California Girls? > > [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MMz-wi50ACU](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MMz-wi50ACU) > > [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i\_iyf-lNFbs](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i_iyf-lNFbs) I was just going to ask a question about this kind of beat. I thought about it earlier today. Is this really a shuffle? If you subdivide the beat (is that what the word is - basically increase the number of beats within each measure) you get a shuffle like the kind I’m talking about. But it’s more minimalist and less swing-sounding to me than a traditional shuffle. Here is another song with this kind of beat: [Indian Reservation.](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=clux1gLimUo) ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2011, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-songs-with-a-slow-shuffle-beat/589095/53 "2011-07-17T22:05:26Z")
> [@Musicat](#): > > But subdividing the even-eights is a shuffle, with hits on 1 & 4 of a 4-pattern. I hear it mostly in the guitar pickup stroke (4) to the downbeats. Not prominent, but it’s there. > > I guess if you require a shuffle to have a triplet subdivision, it wouldn’t qualify since it’s a 4 part pattern. I can take it either way. > > Take me to the River doesn’t have a further subdivision that I can readily hear below the even 8ths. I don’t think a shuffle _has_ to be in triplets. 16ths are fine, too. [See Purdie](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6FX_84iWPLU&feature=related)’s 16th note shuffle. Triplet shuffles are looser and 16th note shuffles are “harder” (as in “stronger” not “more difficult.”) [This drum lesson](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gt2Sp_iG2hU) is actually a very good explanation of what the most basic shuffle beat, for me, sounds like. Go to 0:51 in the video if you just want to hear the basic beat. I definitely agree that the Tom Petty song has a shuffle feel in the guitars and vocal delivery, but the underlying drum groove is pretty straight. Similarly, while I find the drum groove for “Fool in the Rain” a typical half-time shuffle, the rest of the instrumentation doesn’t really have that typical swinging shuffle feel to it. A more typical “blues shuffle” that most people know is “Sweet Home Chicago.” That’s about as typical a shuffle rhythm as you can get–it’s pretty much the same beat as the blues shuffle beat link above. ETA: I would definitely classify the beats of “Killer Queen” and “California Girls” as basically being shuffles. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2011, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-songs-with-a-slow-shuffle-beat/589095/54 "2011-07-17T23:01:27Z")
The Carpenters’ version of “(They Long to Be) Close to You”. When Bacharach wrote it the song had a basic 4/4 beat, which is how Dionne Warwick recorded it. Richard Carpenter’s arrangement put in the shuffle, which made a huge difference. ---
**Author:** ![SeldomSeen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/7ba0ec/32.png) [@SeldomSeen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SeldomSeen)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2011, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-songs-with-a-slow-shuffle-beat/589095/55 "2011-07-17T23:15:20Z")
I’ve been trying to think of something from the C&W side that might qualify. Not sure but I think _[Someone Could Lose a Heart Tonight](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAJU8KesD2A)_ by Eddie Rabbit, the late country/crossover artist might work. Also, more uptempo but similar; _[I Love a Rainy Night](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=idJ7pA-CKGM)_ by the same artist. ---
**Author:** ![tomcar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tomcar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomcar)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2011, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-songs-with-a-slow-shuffle-beat/589095/56 "2011-07-18T00:58:21Z")
“Come Down Easy” by Spacemen3 is A fairly good example of this…although it is a cover of “In My Time of Dying.” ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2011, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-songs-with-a-slow-shuffle-beat/589095/57 "2011-07-18T03:09:44Z")
> [@SeldomSeen](#): > > I’ve been trying to think of something from the C&W side that might qualify. Yeah, there should be a zillion examples of country shuffles–the shuffle is a common rhythm in country. I just can’t think of any really slow ones off the top of my head that sound like the songs in the OP. ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2011, 6:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-songs-with-a-slow-shuffle-beat/589095/58 "2011-07-18T06:31:06Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > Yeah, there should be a zillion examples of country shuffles–the shuffle is a common rhythm in country. I just can’t think of any really slow ones off the top of my head that sound like the songs in the OP. Happy Trails? ---
**Author:** ![ZipperJJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zipperjj/32/211_2.png) [@ZipperJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZipperJJ)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2011, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-songs-with-a-slow-shuffle-beat/589095/59 "2011-07-18T15:11:36Z")
I am pretty sure Hayden’s [Bad as They Seem](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aiDbMmeDlQM) fits the bill. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_Torque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Max\_Torque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_Torque)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2011, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-songs-with-a-slow-shuffle-beat/589095/60 "2011-07-18T19:02:32Z")
When I was in college, a friend pointed out to me that Pink Floyd is unique in that they’re a highly successful rock band, with almost no fast songs. Very few go above the pace of [“Learning To Fly”](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xb-Nacm-pKc). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-songs-with-a-slow-shuffle-beat/589095.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pop-songs-with-a-slow-shuffle-beat/589095.md?page=4)