# Pope: Economic crisis helps us leave simple lives **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 17, 2008, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-economic-crisis-helps-us-leave-simple-lives/477609 "2008-12-17T18:39:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Terrifel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c68b51/32.png) [@Terrifel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terrifel)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2008, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-economic-crisis-helps-us-leave-simple-lives/477609/21 "2008-12-18T02:03:28Z")
> [@gobear](#): > > Here’s what [Pope Bennie](http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g285/catholiclouisiana/pope-3.jpg)was wearing at the audience. No red velvet or ermine, although the gold pectoral cross is a touch gaudy. “Take your Jedi weapon! Strike me down with all of your hatred, and your journey towards the Dark Side will be complete!” ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2008, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-economic-crisis-helps-us-leave-simple-lives/477609/22 "2008-12-18T02:07:11Z")
Oh, simple lives, ay? My life gets any more simple I’ll be grinding my own flour and will simply die if I have a medical problem rather than be able to afford a doctor. My possessions will be reduce to what fits in a filched grocery cart. Poverty SUCKS. Gimme a JOB and a LOT OF MONEY!!! ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2008, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-economic-crisis-helps-us-leave-simple-lives/477609/23 "2008-12-18T02:17:31Z")
> [@Mr.Moto](#): > > You know, the traditional Santa Claus costume is pretty elaborate and includes lots of white fur. Now, was this seen traditionally as contradictory to values of family togetherness, generosity and tradition? Considering that he’s ALSO seen as living at the North Pole, it’s typically seen as “warm”. Not to mention that a mythic figure that hands out loot doesn’t exactly stand for a rejection of material things. ---
**Author:** ![Revenant\_Threshold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f1d935/32.png) [@Revenant\_Threshold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revenant_Threshold)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2008, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-economic-crisis-helps-us-leave-simple-lives/477609/24 "2008-12-18T02:37:56Z")
> [@Mr.Moto](#): > > I realize people may have different opinions on these subjects. Personally, I am Catholic - and I have no problem with elaborate vestments or churches or cathedrals so long as such does not interfere with the Church’s mission. Surely not giving all one can is an interference with that mission? If I recall correctly, you (and the Pope) have the backing of Jesus on this particular one (at least as far as relative trifles go), but how is the analysis that it does not interfere performed? > [@](#): > > There are always going to be those who visit the Cathedral of Notre Dame and bash it as an extravagant expense in a world that then saw and still sees poverty - not seeing that this architectural and artistic masterpiece has its own place in our world, and the Church was right to build it. I’m afraid I shall have to be one of those people, though I haven’t visited the place. I, as an atheist, can certainly see the worth in something architecturally and artistically impressive for its own sake; even as such I can see how an impressive or magnificient building, finery, or ceremony can aid with the spreading of the Word. Too, a building may last for many years, while the money that might have come from it instead might not, though that’s somewhat more arguable. However, I honestly cannot agree that the Pope’s finery does him better on the Church’s mission than were he to perhaps use cheaper materials and donate the rest. And I don’t believe i’d agree with your framing of the argument either - not an honest debate, but a lack of sight on the part of some that means their views are less informed. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2008, 7:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-economic-crisis-helps-us-leave-simple-lives/477609/25 "2008-12-18T07:49:27Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Oh, simple lives, ay? > > My life gets any more simple I’ll be grinding my own flour and will simply die if I have a medical problem rather than be able to afford a doctor. My possessions will be reduce to what fits in a filched grocery cart. > > Poverty SUCKS. Gimme a JOB and a LOT OF MONEY!!! Just remember,Long-haired preachers come out every night, Try to tell you what’s wrong and what’s right; But when asked how 'bout something to eat They will answer with voices so sweet: _You will eat, bye and bye, In that glorious land above the sky; Work and pray live on hay, You’ll get pie in the sky when you die._ THAT’S A LIE ![Joe Hill](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Preacher_and_the_Slave) Workers of the world, unite. You have nothing to lose but your jobs … and you’re prolly gonna lose them anyway! Solidarity Forever! CMC +fnord! “He said he wished that all the great men in the world and all the nobility could be hanged, and strangled in the guts of priests.” - [Jean Meslier](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean_Meslier), “_The Testament_” ---
**Author:** ![straight\_man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/straight_man/32/3027_2.png) [@straight\_man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/straight_man)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2008, 7:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-economic-crisis-helps-us-leave-simple-lives/477609/26 "2008-12-18T07:52:11Z")
> [@Revenant\_Threshold](#): > > However, I honestly cannot agree that the Pope’s finery does him better on the Church’s mission than were he to perhaps use cheaper materials and donate the rest. Just to be clear, nobody here has actually cited what materials his vestments are made out of (the one photo noted was just some kind of generic white cloth). It’s also worth pointing out that the Vatican’s budget is released annually, and I don’t recall it being particularly grandiose. The wealth of the Catholic church is mostly in assets, not income. ---
**Author:** ![Radegast](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c4cdca/32.png) [@Radegast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Radegast)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2008, 8:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-economic-crisis-helps-us-leave-simple-lives/477609/27 "2008-12-18T08:35:31Z")
I tend to go with the Hussite approach. They sacked a big chunk of central Europe, partly because they believed that priests wearing vestments of any kind was wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Gala\_Matrix\_Fire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4da419/32.png) [@Gala\_Matrix\_Fire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gala_Matrix_Fire)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2008, 11:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-economic-crisis-helps-us-leave-simple-lives/477609/28 "2008-12-18T11:49:42Z")
> [@smiling\_bandit](#): > > Anyway, the Pope actually lives pretty simply, given his position. His days are mostly spent in constant work and prayer, and all that stuff is owned the the Church itself, and will be passed along to the next Pope. This is not much different from the average American CEO. He lives a lifestyle where he’s flown around in private jets, wears the most luxurious clothing, and is surrounded by the most expensive furnishings and yes-men. But he works hard all day. And he only gets all that stuff for the duration of his natural life, it doesn’t follow him into the afterlife. It gets passed along to his descendants, but that’s really the only place where his story and the Pope’s diverge. The average CEO will lay people off without taking a financial hit himself, just as the Pope will counsel his faithful to embrace poverty and have more children, because God will provide. See, God provided for _him_. ---
**Author:** ![DanBlather](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f4b2a3/32.png) [@DanBlather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DanBlather)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2008, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-economic-crisis-helps-us-leave-simple-lives/477609/29 "2008-12-18T13:45:54Z")
[QUOTE=The Devil’s Grandmother] Where did you get the details on his outfit? Or does the pope wear the same clothes for all public speaking events? [/QUOTE] I was going by the pic accompanying the DrudgeReport link. He kinda looks like a gay Santa wearing a white yarmukle. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2008, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-economic-crisis-helps-us-leave-simple-lives/477609/30 "2008-12-18T16:18:54Z")
> [@The\_Devil\_s\_Grandmother](#): > > [“Perhaps the world crisis that is affecting so many families and all of humanity could be the stimulus for rediscovering the warmth, simplicity, amity and solidarity which are the very values of Christmas” the Pope said.](http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/faith/article5360399.ece) Isn’t this pretty much the message of “How the Grinch Stole Christmas”? ---
**Author:** ![Revenant\_Threshold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f1d935/32.png) [@Revenant\_Threshold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revenant_Threshold)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2008, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-economic-crisis-helps-us-leave-simple-lives/477609/31 "2008-12-18T18:16:36Z")
> [@straight\_man](#): > > Just to be clear, nobody here has actually cited what materials his vestments are made out of (the one photo noted was just some kind of generic white cloth). It’s also worth pointing out that the Vatican’s budget is released annually, and I don’t recall it being particularly grandiose. The wealth of the Catholic church is mostly in assets, not income. That wouldn’t surprise me. It is the assets rather than the income that i’m talking about here, anyway. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2008, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-economic-crisis-helps-us-leave-simple-lives/477609/32 "2008-12-18T18:30:55Z")
> [@DanBlather](#): > > The Pope, wearing a velvet cloak trimmed in ermine and a gold embroidered silk sash, [today said](http://ph.news.yahoo.com/ap/20081217/twl-eu-vatican-christmas-crisis-c8e2916.html)that tough times can give back simplicity and solidarity to holiday celebrations. I suppose even popes can have an opinion, but I disagree. hard times do not bring back any sort of “good old days”, or anything like it. I would dare say there never was any such thing as “the good old days” at all. Hard times bring unemployment, hunger, desperation, crime, and in the worst of times may even trigger wars (the neighbor has stuff we don’t and we will take it). Desperate people will do desparate things. Sorry, but if I were faced with a choice between hunger and crime, I would probably choose crime myself. If anyone really wants to capture some sort of Christmas spirit, the way to do it is to help those who are caught in this recession, not tell them to be thankful for it. ---
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2008, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-economic-crisis-helps-us-leave-simple-lives/477609/33 "2008-12-18T18:32:30Z")
> [@PunditLisa](#): > > Not sure what’s so offensive about what he said, but then again I don’t look for ways to be offended. Hey, ditto. I envy a simpler life and am actually working towards it. I have too much shit that I don’t need / don’t use / would be more productive without. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2008, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-economic-crisis-helps-us-leave-simple-lives/477609/34 "2008-12-18T18:50:49Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > If anyone really wants to capture some sort of Christmas spirit, the way to do it is to help those who are caught in this recession, not tell them to be thankful for it. From the linked article above: > [@](#): > > He said the difficulties many families were experiencing as a result of the global economic crisis “can become an opportunity and a stimulus” to free Christmas from consumerism, which had reduce Christmas to “an occasion for the sole purpose of buying and exchanging gifts”. > > “Perhaps the world crisis that is affecting so many families and all of humanity could be the stimulus for rediscovering the warmth, simplicity, amity and solidarity which are the very values of Christmas” the Pope said. “Stripped of its materialistic and consumer trappings, Christmas offers a chance to welcome as a personal gift the message of hope that emanates from the mystery of Christ’s birth”. > > …“May Christmas be a privileged opportunity to reflect on the true meaning of our existence. Let us ready ourselves to receive this gift of joy, of light and of peace and become people who do not think only of themselves, but who are open to the needs and expectations of others”, Pope Benedict declared. He added: “Happy Christmas”. > > …He said his thoughts turned to “the many children born into poverty throughout the world, those newborns who are rejected and not welcomed, those who will not survive because of lack of care and attention, those families who yearn for the joy of a child and have yet to see this realised”. This pitting is a colossal failure. ---
**Author:** ![Autolycus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/22d042/32.png) [@Autolycus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Autolycus)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2008, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-economic-crisis-helps-us-leave-simple-lives/477609/35 "2008-12-18T19:12:11Z")
Yeah, fuck you Pope! How dare you try to remind us of the true meaning of Christmas! ---
**Author:** ![TroubleAgain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e480ec/32.png) [@TroubleAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroubleAgain)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2008, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-economic-crisis-helps-us-leave-simple-lives/477609/36 "2008-12-18T19:46:04Z")
> [@](#): > > the many children born into poverty throughout the world Would any of those children born in poverty be the ones born because birth control is such a terrible sin? ---
**Author:** ![Vox\_Imperatoris](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Vox\_Imperatoris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Vox_Imperatoris)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2008, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-economic-crisis-helps-us-leave-simple-lives/477609/37 "2008-12-18T19:50:02Z")
> [@Autolycus](#): > > Yeah, fuck you Pope! How dare you try to remind us of the true meaning of Christmas! But the false meaning of Christmas is so much more fun! 😛 Valete, Vox Imperatoris ---
**Author:** ![wolfman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a8b319/32.png) [@wolfman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfman)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2008, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-economic-crisis-helps-us-leave-simple-lives/477609/38 "2008-12-18T20:48:46Z")
> [@Autolycus](#): > > Yeah, fuck you Pope! How dare you try to remind us of the true meaning of Christmas! Yeah who does this clown think he is! It’s not like somebody died and made him King of the Church or something. ---
**Author:** ![Autolycus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/22d042/32.png) [@Autolycus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Autolycus)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2008, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-economic-crisis-helps-us-leave-simple-lives/477609/39 "2008-12-18T21:22:32Z")
> [@Terrifel](#): > > “Take your Jedi weapon! Strike me down with all of your hatred, and your journey towards the Dark Side will be complete!” [Merry Christmas, Jedi scum!](http://img232.echo.cx/img232/3440/popepalpatine3ct.png) ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2008, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-economic-crisis-helps-us-leave-simple-lives/477609/40 "2008-12-18T21:33:16Z")
> [@matt\_mcl](#): > > He was wearing much the same outfit the last time he condemned homosexuality. “Tell the drag queen his handbag is on fire!” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-economic-crisis-helps-us-leave-simple-lives/477609.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-economic-crisis-helps-us-leave-simple-lives/477609.md?page=3)