# Pope urges US Catholics to vote for "the lesser of two evils" **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [September 14, 2024, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-urges-us-catholics-to-vote-for-the-lesser-of-two-evils/1007247 "2024-09-14T03:20:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![flurb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/51bf81/32.png) [@flurb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flurb)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2024, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-urges-us-catholics-to-vote-for-the-lesser-of-two-evils/1007247/1 "2024-09-14T03:20:52Z")
Article below. Pope Francis engaging in some serious bothsidesism by describing both Trump and Harris as being “against life” – Trump due to his anti-migrant policies, and Harris for her support of abortion rights. Meanwhile he claims that he doesn’t know who is worse, but that Catholic voters should search their conscience and choose the lesser of two evils. This is some serious bullshit. First because he clearly does not _really_ think they’re equally against life. He describes Trump as “the one who kicks out migrants,” while Harris is, “the one who kills babies.” And he turns a blind eye to the many other ways Trump is also “against life,” including Trump’s own stated opposition to a nationwide ban on abortion. Will this impact the election? PA, NV, AZ, WI and MI all have 20-25% of their population identifying as Catholic. > **[Pope slams both Harris and Trump as 'against life' and urges Catholics to...](https://apnews.com/article/vatican-pope-trump-harris-election-0e0faef49ff587098f75b265e386bf22)** > > Pope Francis has strongly criticized both U.S. presidential candidates over what he calls anti-life policies on abortion and migration. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2024, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-urges-us-catholics-to-vote-for-the-lesser-of-two-evils/1007247/2 "2024-09-14T03:23:26Z")
Brave, brave Sir Pope. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2024, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-urges-us-catholics-to-vote-for-the-lesser-of-two-evils/1007247/3 "2024-09-14T04:06:43Z")
Fuck the Pope, and whatever he thinks. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2024, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-urges-us-catholics-to-vote-for-the-lesser-of-two-evils/1007247/4 "2024-09-14T04:27:53Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > Fuck the Pope, and whatever he thinks. What that guy said. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2024, 4:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-urges-us-catholics-to-vote-for-the-lesser-of-two-evils/1007247/5 "2024-09-14T04:29:08Z")
Yeah, fuck the Pope and all that. I do feel a bit of empathy for Catholics. Not a lot, because they have a choice to not put their morality in the hands of some dude just because he wears a big hat, but some sympathy. But my takeaway from the comments by the Pope for any Catholics who do find themselves in a quandry over voting for Harris or not - Basically, the Pope just gave them license to vote for her despite the difference in position on abortion. I mean, he could have done so in a different way. But this does accomplish that result, so I guess I’m be grateful for whatever means we can get to let voters feel they can support abortion rights without feeling like they are endangering their immortal soul. ---
**Author:** ![Son\_of\_a\_Rich](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/son_of_a_rich/32/5439_2.png) [@Son\_of\_a\_Rich](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Son_of_a_Rich)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2024, 4:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-urges-us-catholics-to-vote-for-the-lesser-of-two-evils/1007247/6 "2024-09-14T04:31:10Z")
The Pope should STFU before he gets his ass RICOed. Probably not possible, but I can fantasize 😏 ---
**Author:** ![Dissonance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85f322/32.png) [@Dissonance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dissonance)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2024, 5:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-urges-us-catholics-to-vote-for-the-lesser-of-two-evils/1007247/7 "2024-09-14T05:08:55Z")
Give the pope a break. The last time there was a major political party this xenophobically anti-immigrant, it was a no brainer what side the pope should be on. > **[Gangs of New York + Immigration](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4_4p15iGlU%2F)** > > "They looked at the Irish coming off the boats and said, ‘What are you doing here?’ It was chaos, tribal chaos. Gradually, there was a street by street, bloc... ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2024, 5:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-urges-us-catholics-to-vote-for-the-lesser-of-two-evils/1007247/8 "2024-09-14T05:30:10Z")
> [@Dissonance](#): > > Give the pope a break. The titular head of the world’s largest pedophile proliferation network, money laundering service, and general promulgator of theonomical horseshit. [Fuck that guy.](https://youtu.be/-nG6Q7MqVCo?si=-cksaD4Wk7KmgJi4) Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2024, 6:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-urges-us-catholics-to-vote-for-the-lesser-of-two-evils/1007247/9 "2024-09-14T06:02:04Z")
> [@Dissonance](#): > > Give the pope a break. How 'bout we do the reverse? Let’s take away the Catholic Church’s income tax exemption for engaging in political activities. I wonder how the Church would like it if the U.S. President told cardinals how to vote in the next papal election. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2024, 6:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-urges-us-catholics-to-vote-for-the-lesser-of-two-evils/1007247/10 "2024-09-14T06:13:40Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > Let’s take away the Catholic Church’s income tax exemption for engaging in political activities. Unfortunately churches of all sorts have been practically daring the government to do that for decades, since they know it won’t dare to. Lets them feel brave at no risk, I expect. ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2024, 6:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-urges-us-catholics-to-vote-for-the-lesser-of-two-evils/1007247/11 "2024-09-14T06:32:21Z")
Well, if Trump wins ( 🤢 🤮 ) I suspect that all Churches will be expected to provide kickbacks, or at least schedule multiple meetings at Trump properties. So a de facto tax on all Churches. And considering how a great many American Catholic Bishops are so politically conservative that they make the Pope look sane and measured in his current response, I’ll echo @Stranger_On_A_Train and say fuck ALL of the upper echelons of the Catholic Church. But backing away from the rant, I’m extremely sickened by the equivalence the Pope offers the two. Okay, fine, if he INSISTS on the equality of supporting abortion and supporting the forced separation of children and abandonment of refugees, he’s Catholic, and while I may not agree, I can see the edges of his point. So, fine. Equivalent. Then look at the rest please and thank you! I mean, Harris is not perfect, but she’s SANE, a supporter of the rule of law, and willing to support and protect the whole nation, not just a fraction of it. Trump is precisely NONE of those things, not to mention a fornicator in the extreme, and the living personification of ALL of the deadly sins. Yet somehow they’re equivalent. Yeah. I’m not as generous as @Irishman who seems to feel that the Pope is trying to give Catholics an our to vote their conscience. No, what would have been the _moral_ response would be to say something like “I cannot in good conscience suggest or ask you vote for Harris, we are incompatible on our views on abortion. However, Trump is the farthest thing in the world from a Godly man, and to support him is to support sin. If you vote for Harris, in the name of Jesus, we will forgive your sins. If you find yourself in disagreement with her however, then accept the lesser of evils and DON’T VOTE AT ALL.” ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2024, 6:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-urges-us-catholics-to-vote-for-the-lesser-of-two-evils/1007247/12 "2024-09-14T06:40:29Z")
> [@ParallelLines](#): > > Well, if Trump wins ( 🤢 🤮 ) I suspect that all Churches will be expected to provide kickbacks, or at least schedule multiple meetings at Trump properties. So a de facto tax on all Churches. Put a tariff on pedophiles! The Church would pay of our debt for us. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2024, 6:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-urges-us-catholics-to-vote-for-the-lesser-of-two-evils/1007247/13 "2024-09-14T06:43:33Z")
> [@ParallelLines](#): > > No, what would have been the _moral_ response would be to say something like “I cannot in good conscience suggest or ask you vote for Harris, we are incompatible on our views on abortion. However, Trump is the farthest thing in the world from a Godly man, and to support him is to support sin. If you vote for Harris, in the name of Jesus, we will forgive your sins. If you find yourself in disagreement with her however, then accept the lesser of evils and DON’T VOTE AT ALL.” The moral response would be for the Pope to not tell people how they should vote at all. ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2024, 6:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-urges-us-catholics-to-vote-for-the-lesser-of-two-evils/1007247/14 "2024-09-14T06:50:27Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > Put a tariff on pedophiles! The Church would pay of our debt for us. It could work in Trump’s America, as long as it’s a same sex tariff. You know Elon’s angling for the Czar of Underage Breeders for a Whiter America - the current Republican party is all about letting (male) children work in our factories for their betters while girls should be uneducated breeders at home. > [@Smapti](#): > > The moral response would be for the Pope to not tell people how they should vote at all. This I disagree with. Oh, I would _prefer_ him not too, but he is, for better and worse (both) a world leader. And one with responsibilities to millions of his people living in the USA. To say he can’t, or even shouldn’t care seems unreasonable to me. But if he’s _going_ to do it, he should at least be honest to his theoretical moral code. And IMHO he’s not doing that. So, I’m damning him for being a hypocrite - he’s letting his single issue (abortion) blind him to the endless, unrelenting evil of Trump, that _far_ outweighs any minor venality on Harris’ part. And for that matter, it’s _doubly_ hypocritical because even Trump was saying he was in favor of abortion in Florida until his handlers made him retract it. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2024, 8:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-urges-us-catholics-to-vote-for-the-lesser-of-two-evils/1007247/15 "2024-09-14T08:18:38Z")
Closed on September 14, 2024, 8:18am UTC ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2024, 8:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pope-urges-us-catholics-to-vote-for-the-lesser-of-two-evils/1007247/16 "2024-09-14T08:19:56Z")
@flurb, please let me know if you want this reopened in the pit. It clearly is a pit thread and not #Politics & Elections . Moderating