# Pornographic Rap Music and its Effect on Youth and Adults **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 16, 2001, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pornographic-rap-music-and-its-effect-on-youth-and-adults/87740 "2001-10-16T15:47:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![gex\_gex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/94ad74/32.png) [@gex\_gex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gex_gex)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pornographic-rap-music-and-its-effect-on-youth-and-adults/87740/21 "2001-10-16T17:48:21Z")
> [@](#): > > _all quotes originally posted by basicguy_ > First, the rappers give off an image that it is cool to be ghetto tough, when it is not because ghetto life is rife with drugs, gangs, hostilities not only towards other races but to ones own, murder, rape and various criminal activities. People in ghettos prey on each other and having served time in jail or having been knifed or shot are status symbols. no they do not: try listening to some black eyed peas, beastie boys, ugly duckling, michael franti/disposable heroes of hiphoprisy, jurassic five, de la soul etc. etc. then try and tell me that rap _as a genre_ is as you have described. > [@](#): > > In the past, Rock and Roll sent out messages of similar type about being rebels, going against the law, making love, and coming from the ‘wrong side of the tracks’ but the lyrics were nowhere as blatantly descriptive, hostile nor simply nasty. Mostly, they were not racist. Nor did they promote the killing of anyone for racial reasons. society’s moral standards have changed. in the 50’s premarital sex was a big no-no. attitudes change. these were just as ‘dangerous’ in their time as rap is ‘dangerous’ now. > [@](#): > > Somewhere in time, this stopped and free speech became the ability to promote anything in song that the so called artist, in his or her warped mind, chose to sing. Rap, in my opinion, has caused crime, racial problems and promotes a hostile, closed minded attitude. you are absolutely right. there was no crime, racial problems or people with hostile, closed minded attitudes in poverty-stricken black underclass societies _before_ rap. you’ve nailed the problem. i bet those afghanistanis have been listning to too much eminem, too. > [@](#): > > We already know, from teens in the early rock and roll era and later, in the heavy metal and hard rock of the late 60s, early 70s and later, the 80s, that teens and others take the songs to heart, try to imitate them, will follow their suggestions, use the singers and bands as role models, will copy the dress, actions and stage attitudes of their favorite bands and change their lifestyles accordingly. We have records of problems caused by the past heavy metal groups singing about Satan and devil worship, the joys of drugs, especially pot and later, coke, and the pleasure of getting drunk and cutting loose. cite, please > [@](#): > > Rap is worse than any Rock and Roll songs of the past… hatred of various races… just like (rock band) guns n roses’ _one in a million_? > [@](#): > > …hatred of authority… like (rock band) the clash’s _white riot_? > [@](#): > > …loyalty to gang members beyond the loyalty of family… i could go on, but your arguments are based on hyperbole and paranoia and are essentially meaningless. for more information on overeaction to any music, and why outrage at rap is the same as outrage at rock, look [here](http://ericnuzum.com/banned/). knock yourselves out. oh and wildest bill, i’m sure rap music promotes sex amongst teenagers, just like elvis presley’s dancing promoted sex amongst teenagers. that’s right. ---
**Author:** ![ninja\_rydr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/8491ac/32.png) [@ninja\_rydr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ninja_rydr)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pornographic-rap-music-and-its-effect-on-youth-and-adults/87740/22 "2001-10-16T17:54:24Z")
> [@](#): > > \*\*We have records of problems caused by the past heavy metal groups singing about Satan and devil worship \*\* . Could you cite something other than the stupid Judas Preist / Suicide trial. > [@](#): > > **Rap, in my opinion, has caused crime, racial problems and promotes a hostile, closed minded attitude.** Have you ever stopped to think that maybe it is the other way around? Maybe crime/racism/social/economic problems caused Rap music to be a success. > [@](#): > > **His feelings were/are that one can say anything one wants under free speech no matter the consequences because it is his right and it is art, no matter who actually takes the songs to heart and commits unsociable activities or racial actions.** As most people know you can NOT always say anything you want, you can’t yell fire in a crowded theatre, incite a riot, or as some “artist” thought skin a live cat on video tape. But what it seems you are saying is that if someone (gang member or not) listens to rap music then commits a murder the artist should be punished. That is akin to saying Shell & Bic should be fined because some criminal uses their products to set a fire. BTW law suits,filed by cities, across the country have failed to recover costs of gun violence from the gun manufacturers. ---
**Author:** ![capacitor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e47774/32.png) [@capacitor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/capacitor)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pornographic-rap-music-and-its-effect-on-youth-and-adults/87740/23 "2001-10-16T17:56:45Z")
If rap is causing crime, then why there is a dramatic drop in crime over the years, during the time rap has become the premiere genre in popular music? ---
**Author:** ![Wildest\_Bill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Wildest\_Bill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wildest_Bill)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pornographic-rap-music-and-its-effect-on-youth-and-adults/87740/24 "2001-10-16T18:02:42Z")
Where in the thread is this Basic Guy’s post y’all keep quoting from? I don’t see it. ---
**Author:** ![pldennison](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9fc29f/32.png) [@pldennison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pldennison)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pornographic-rap-music-and-its-effect-on-youth-and-adults/87740/25 "2001-10-16T18:17:21Z")
I suspect it’s gone because I suspect he was Mark Serlin. At least he was clever enough not to capitalize “black” this time. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pornographic-rap-music-and-its-effect-on-youth-and-adults/87740/26 "2001-10-16T18:25:28Z")
Serlin’s back? ARGH! Anyhoo, I was reading the _New Republic_ where there is a review of a Tupac Shakur biography. It addresses some of the problems of rap and stereotypes. BTW, I miss Arrested Development. BEST rap group I ever heard-and this coming from someone who hates rap. ---
**Author:** ![ninja\_rydr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/8491ac/32.png) [@ninja\_rydr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ninja_rydr)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pornographic-rap-music-and-its-effect-on-youth-and-adults/87740/27 "2001-10-16T18:35:29Z")
I am not a huge fan of 2 live crew. However to condem a whole genre of music because you don’t like one group or song is absurd. As was said above there are several sun-genres of rap i.e. Gangsta / East Coast and latley Southern. So \*\* Bill \*\* & \*\* Guy \*\* you two don’t like that hardcore stuff. Try something else like Mos Def, The Roots, Pharcyde (older). I never used to listen to country music, until I started to give it an honest shot. While I don’t run around in boots or cowboy hat I’ve found I like enough of it to burn a couple of CD with country songs. You just may find it’s not all bad. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pornographic-rap-music-and-its-effect-on-youth-and-adults/87740/28 "2001-10-16T18:52:40Z")
Hey, I’m not saying I don’t like rap because of one or two groups-I just don’t like the music or the format. But then, some people can’t stand classical or folk or big band swing-which I ADORE. Different strokes for different folks, I says. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pornographic-rap-music-and-its-effect-on-youth-and-adults/87740/29 "2001-10-16T19:13:16Z")
I don’t see the BasicGuy ones either…who’s Mark Serlin? A sock puppet? ---
**Author:** ![Wildest\_Bill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Wildest\_Bill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wildest_Bill)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pornographic-rap-music-and-its-effect-on-youth-and-adults/87740/30 "2001-10-16T19:25:49Z")
Hey I am not saying I hate all rap or anything. There is some rap that sounds pretty good. I like Cypress Hill, Tone Loc and the Beastie Boys. While some of their songs might be suggestive(sp), they don’t come out and say “do it in the butt” if you know what I mean? ---
**Author:** ![stofsky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dfb087/32.png) [@stofsky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stofsky)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pornographic-rap-music-and-its-effect-on-youth-and-adults/87740/31 "2001-10-16T20:50:32Z")
Bill, you’ve heard of the Beatles, right? Oldish rock & roll that doesn’t incite anyone to anything? You’ve heard of Charles Manson, right? Look up the connection between the Helter Skelter murders and the White Album. Next time try not to be such a …aww, hell, it’s worthless even to complete the sentence. ---
**Author:** ![VarlosZ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d78d45/32.png) [@VarlosZ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VarlosZ)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pornographic-rap-music-and-its-effect-on-youth-and-adults/87740/32 "2001-10-16T21:43:23Z")
> [@](#): > > Do you think such lyrics really do effect peoples libido? No, you’re thinking of PORN. As something of an aside, rap lyrics have always been taken (by white people, anyway) with a degree of literalness that would be unthinkable for rock. Does anyone think that Jim Morrison was _actually_ suggesting that we go rape our mothers in “The End”? Of course not. So why do we take it at face value when MC Ren (N.W.A., “Fuck the Police”) says that “taking out a police would make [his] day”? Finally, 2Live Crew’s “Pop That Pussy” is, to my thinking, the definitive work dealing with a trip to a gentleman’s club. “I like the way you lick that champaigne glass / It makes me want to stick my. . .” I’ve got to listen to that now. Pardon me. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2001, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pornographic-rap-music-and-its-effect-on-youth-and-adults/87740/33 "2001-10-16T22:04:23Z")
**Bill** , if your idea of pornographic is “doing it in the butt,” don’t EVER listen to Ghetto Boys. _shudder_ ---
**Author:** ![vanilla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/f19dbf/32.png) [@vanilla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vanilla)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pornographic-rap-music-and-its-effect-on-youth-and-adults/87740/34 "2001-10-17T13:37:40Z")
I can’t imagine anyone watching 2 Live Crew having sex would make them horny. I must be a singular voice of agreement with you Wildest. The world would be a better place without obscene language promoted. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pornographic-rap-music-and-its-effect-on-youth-and-adults/87740/35 "2001-10-17T14:47:54Z")
He was a notorious womaniser. While I can’t be sure of our other founding fathers, I know Ben wanted to ensure any man’s right to say “Shake your rump like a rumpshaker.” and any woman’s right to do so. ``` Chaucer's Canetrbury Tales do contain verses ranging from suggestive to explicit. In the Reeve's tale, a youth boasts about having sex with a miller's daughter, "All night long did she grind my corn.". Chaucer remains the only author I know of to refer to the female genitalia as "nether eye". The full line "And he had kissed her nether eye." Many of Shakespeare's works contain dirty jokes- In Henry V, The Dauphin says "My horse is my mistress." Hamlet "Lady shall I lie in thy lap? No, I meant my head in thy lap. Thought you I meant * country* matters?" Country matters? Doesn't make much sense, "cunt-ry" ,matters is the original meaning. According to Professor Mistichelli of the Penn State English Department, the word "cunt" was known and used during Shakespeare's time. Bill-pornography and sexually charged songs date back to the origin of writing, art, and singing. We may have gone from a Greek theatre, to a pub, to a burlesque house, to cd's but "The song remains the same." ``` ---
**Author:** ![dalovindj](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/65b543/32.png) [@dalovindj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dalovindj)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pornographic-rap-music-and-its-effect-on-youth-and-adults/87740/36 "2001-10-17T15:01:13Z")
**gex gex** : > [@](#): > > no they do not: try listening to some black eyed peas, beastie boys, ugly duckling, michael franti/disposable heroes of hiphoprisy, jurassic five, de la soul etc. etc. then try and tell me that rap as a genre is as you have described. Nice list of concious/non-violent hip-hop artists. I’ve not run into anybody who knows about Ugly Duckling except on the LBDAS web sites. Wasn’t expecting to run into someone who digs them here. Daddy likes. **WB** : Hip-Hop is NOT the cause of the worlds evils. It DOES often describe the fucked up things that go on in the world. But people have been doing it in the butt, killing each other, and getting high since way before stereos existed. Artistic expression should never be censored unless it brings physical harm to someone. The problem with wanting to rule out certain speech is picking who gets to be the judge. If it’s me, I’m a rule out the religious texts of the world, no more “Friends”, and Rod Stewart would be against the law. Alot of people would have a problem with these decisions. I would have a big problem if someone tried to tell me not to listen to Biggie. If you don’t like it fine. But it’s not the root of evil, it’s commentary on having to live in world where evil does exist. 2 Live Crew’s “The Pussy Caper” is a great tale of a prostitute fooled and an extra John satisfied. It makes me laugh. Laughing feels good. If I can feel good without hurting anybody, then it’s nobody’s buisiness and that’s why this country is great. DaLovin’ Dj ---
**Author:** ![Esprix](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/esprix/32/7899_2.png) [@Esprix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esprix)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pornographic-rap-music-and-its-effect-on-youth-and-adults/87740/37 "2001-10-17T17:05:07Z")
And what, exactly, would be the problem with “doing it in the butt?” 😕 **Bill** , I’m no fan of rap/hip-hop by any stretch of the imagination, but to answer your OP: No. Esprix ---
**Author:** ![yojimbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yojimbo/32/232_2.png) [@yojimbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yojimbo)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pornographic-rap-music-and-its-effect-on-youth-and-adults/87740/38 "2001-10-17T18:05:01Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Zoggie \* > I don’t see the BasicGuy ones either…who’s Mark Serlin? A sock puppet? Check this out. [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=44858](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=44858) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pornographic-rap-music-and-its-effect-on-youth-and-adults/87740.md?page=1)