# Portion of Greek debt attributable to health care? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [July 11, 2015, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/portion-of-greek-debt-attributable-to-health-care/724876 "2015-07-11T19:17:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 5\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Dingbang](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ac8455/32.png) [@Dingbang](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dingbang)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2015, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/portion-of-greek-debt-attributable-to-health-care/724876/1 "2015-07-11T19:17:47Z")
I’m looking for some estimation of the amount of the Greek debt that is attributable to the Greek health care system. It is widely acknowledged that the country’s health care system was corrupt and profligate for years, contributing to the country’s economic crisis. But I need to reference a document or an economic analyst’s estimation of what portion of the crisis can be traced to the health care system. Anyone seen a source for something like this? ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2015, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/portion-of-greek-debt-attributable-to-health-care/724876/2 "2015-07-11T20:24:51Z")
False: > [@](#): > > Health spending accounted for 9.3% of GDP in Greece in 2012, equal to the OECD average, but > down from a high of 10.0% of GDP in 2009. Health spending as a share of GDP is lower in Greece > than in the United States (which spent 16.9% of its GDP on health in 2012) and in a number of > European countries including the Netherlands, France, Switzerland and Germany (all allocating over > 11%). > **[The future of health systems](https://www.oecd.org/en/topics/policy-issues/the-future-of-health-systems.html)** > > Rapid population ageing, tight healthcare budgets, a shortage of health workers and the recovery from the COVID-19 pandemic are all putting increased pressure on healthcare systems. As OECD countries look to prepare for the future, radical policy... ---
**Author:** ![Dingbang](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ac8455/32.png) [@Dingbang](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dingbang)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2015, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/portion-of-greek-debt-attributable-to-health-care/724876/3 "2015-07-11T20:38:22Z")
What’s false? The cite is about GDP in relation to OECD and U.S. averages, which is useful, thank you, but it doesn’t make false anything I said. Not that I was looking for a debate anyway… The Greek health care system was corrupt and profligate. The percentage of health spending in relation to GDP doesn’t contradict that. Simply looking at 9.3% and saying it is in line with or lower than other countries tells nothing about what was done with the money that represents that 9.3%. ---
**Author:** ![OldGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/3bc359/32.png) [@OldGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OldGuy)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2015, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/portion-of-greek-debt-attributable-to-health-care/724876/4 "2015-07-11T20:49:41Z")
What kind of answer would you like? If the government had not paid for any health care, and all that money had been used to buy back debt, you’d have the maximum possible difference. But that would be a very high overestimate I’d think. Do you want to know how much money was wasted by fraud and corruption and how much that would have reduced the debt if all that money had been used to buy back bonds? Or is it only the money lost do to fraud and corruption in excess of “normal” fraud and corruption? I suspect, but don’t know, there’s quite a bit in the pensions/benefits as well. ---
**Author:** ![Dingbang](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ac8455/32.png) [@Dingbang](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dingbang)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2015, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/portion-of-greek-debt-attributable-to-health-care/724876/5 "2015-07-11T20:56:18Z")
> [@OldGuy](#): > > What kind of answer would you like? If the government had not paid for any health care, and all that money had been used to buy back debt, you’d have the maximum possible difference. But that would be a very high overestimate I’d think. > > Do you want to know how much money was wasted by fraud and corruption and how much that would have reduced the debt if all that money had been used to buy back bonds? > > Or is it only the money lost do to fraud and corruption in excess of “normal” fraud and corruption? I suspect, but don’t know, there’s quite a bit in the pensions/benefits as well. Pretty much the second choice. I’m not trying to get into a debate over Greek’s healthcare system versus anyone else’s or cast aspersions on Greek health providers. This is for a work-related document that needs to characterize what role the healthcare system played in the overall crisis, the same as could be done for other government-involved entities. Just trying to get as close to a factual statement, or a well reasoned estimate, as I can find.