# Positive Gun News of the Day **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [October 22, 2015, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/positive-gun-news-of-the-day/735490 "2015-10-22T22:57:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2015, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/positive-gun-news-of-the-day/735490/281 "2015-12-05T03:13:29Z")
> [@Common\_Tater](#): > > The _weltanschauung_ of true believers doesn’t allow for that kind of thinking. Heh–I misread you at first to say that it doesn’t allow for anything but that kind of thinking. ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2015, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/positive-gun-news-of-the-day/735490/282 "2015-12-05T16:53:17Z")
> [@Common\_Tater](#): > > The perpetrator of an armed robbery, for example, will often be described as “the victim” if he is shot in the course of the crime. You do realize that it is possible for someone to be the perpetrator of one crime and the victim of another crime? Neither one precludes the other. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2015, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/positive-gun-news-of-the-day/735490/283 "2015-12-05T16:59:12Z")
Tis the season… [A Christmas card from Nevada Assemblywoman Michele Fiore](http://tinyurl.com/p5wysuc) ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2015, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/positive-gun-news-of-the-day/735490/284 "2015-12-05T17:01:40Z")
> [@MaxTheVool](#): > > You do realize that it is possible for someone to be the perpetrator of one crime and the victim of another crime? Neither one precludes the other. Sure. Shitbags victimize each other pretty routinely. On the other hand, if little Billy decides to rob the local Shop n’ Bag and the guy behind the counter shoots Billy, the only thing Billy is the victim of is his own criminality. ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2015, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/positive-gun-news-of-the-day/735490/285 "2015-12-05T18:27:53Z")
> [@PatrickLondon](#): > > Tis the season… > > [A Christmas card from Nevada Assemblywoman Michele Fiore](http://tinyurl.com/p5wysuc) Do you consider this positive news? ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2015, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/positive-gun-news-of-the-day/735490/286 "2015-12-05T18:40:05Z")
> [@Scumpup](#): > > Sure. Shitbags victimize each other pretty routinely. On the other hand, if little Billy decides to rob the local Shop n’ Bag and the guy behind the counter shoots Billy, the only thing Billy is the victim of is his own criminality. If Billy gets shot in the back as he leaves, whatever your ugly and simplistic ideology proclaims, you’re factually incorrect. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2015, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/positive-gun-news-of-the-day/735490/287 "2015-12-05T19:08:27Z")
If Billy gets shot in the back it eliminates the likelihood that he will rob and maybe kill someone in the future. I’d hate to have it on my conscience that a robber I chose to let escape went on to kill someone else in a subsequent robbery. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2015, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/positive-gun-news-of-the-day/735490/288 "2015-12-05T19:17:40Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > If Billy gets shot in the back as he leaves, whatever your ugly and simplistic ideology proclaims, you’re factually incorrect. Billy wouldn’t have been shot at all if he hadn’t tried his hand at robbing, would he? That dirty, back-shooting varmint of a shopkeeper didn’t seek Billy out, did he? Billy set the chain of events in motion. What is it with you and this need to minimize the responsibility shitbags bear for their acts, anyway? ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2015, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/positive-gun-news-of-the-day/735490/289 "2015-12-05T19:27:25Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > If Billy gets shot in the back it eliminates the likelihood that he will rob and maybe kill someone in the future. I’d hate to have it on my conscience that a robber I chose to let escape went on to kill someone else in a subsequent robbery. That is so fucked up. You can justify any violent murder if you pretend to be able to see into the future. “I did society a favor, he might grow up to be a terrorist!” You are not the judge, jury or executioner. Your vigilantism is more dangerous than a small time burglar any day, because it says you have no respect for the Constitution or the rule of law. Your action is no less criminal than that of the robber you pretend to abhor. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2015, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/positive-gun-news-of-the-day/735490/290 "2015-12-05T19:29:27Z")
> [@Scumpup](#): > > Billy wouldn’t have been shot at all if he hadn’t tried his hand at robbing, would he? That dirty, back-shooting varmint of a shopkeeper didn’t seek Billy out, did he? Billy set the chain of events in motion. What is it with you and this need to minimize the responsibility shitbags bear for their acts, anyway? You’re behaving in almost exactly the non-Bricker mode here, unwilling or unable to separate what’s legally okay from what’s morally okay. But set aside your factual incorrectness about the legality of shooting a fleeing robber in the back. Look at the moral issue. Are you really unable to see how the following two statements can be simultaneously held true? A. Billy is morally responsible for his acts robbing a store, and should face consequences for them… B. Murder is not the appropriate consequences for these acts, and someone who murders Billy for them should face consequences for that murder. Edit: as an addendum, I don’t know why you’ve got that predilection for writing me PMs and calling me Princess, but it’s kind of creepy. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2015, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/positive-gun-news-of-the-day/735490/291 "2015-12-05T19:41:35Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > That is so fucked up. You can justify any violent murder if you pretend to be able to see into the future. “I did society a favor, he might grow up to be a terrorist!” You are not the judge, jury or executioner. Your vigilantism is more dangerous than a small time burglar any day, because it says you have no respect for the Constitution or the rule of law. Your action is no less criminal than that of the robber you pretend to abhor. What’s fucked up is your inability to differentiate between some random murder based on perceived psychic ability vs. killing someone who’s already threatened people’s lives in order to obtain a paltry sum of money. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2015, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/positive-gun-news-of-the-day/735490/292 "2015-12-05T19:43:21Z")
I didn’t say it was legal for Hezekiah ( that’s our shopkeeper’s name) to shoot Billy in the back. I didn’t say it was morally right, either. I never even had Hezekiah shoot him in the back at all. That all came from you. You know what, though? If Billy had tried to rob Ace the meth dealer down on the corner, no matter what part of his anatomy Ace shot him in and no matter what legal penalties Ace might face for the shooting, I would still say little Billy died because he wanted to rob somebody. Billy wanting to be a big, bad, desperado led to his death. Whether the fellow who shot him is in compliance with the law is a separate issue. Hezekiah and/or Ace being wrong doesn’t make Billy innocent or right. ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2015, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/positive-gun-news-of-the-day/735490/293 "2015-12-05T21:23:18Z")
For the record - I’m opposed to shooting people who present no threat and our current system of justice agrees with this. Sometimes threats are shot in the back, and sometimes fleeing people are still a threat. It’s a case by case evaluation. * * * In other news, [Mesquite man shot after attacking his grandfather](http://starlocalmedia.com/mesquitenews/news/mesquite-man-shot-after-attacking-his-grandfather/article_4c3b31b2-71c3-11e5-8328-03cc227947b6.html) > [@](#): > > A Mesquite man was shot after he tried to attack his 81-year-old grandfather with a knife Sunday night, according to police. > Michael Ashley Holley, 34, was medically treated and arrested. He’s been charged with aggravated assault with a deadly weapon. > At around 11:15 p.m., police responded to a shooting at a residence in the 1000 block of Irene Drive in Mesquite. Holley had pulled a knife and attempted to assault his grandfather, Norman Holley, police said. Norman defended himself from the attack and shot Michael. I suspect drugs were involved in some way. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2015, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/positive-gun-news-of-the-day/735490/294 "2015-12-05T21:57:28Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > What’s fucked up is your inability to differentiate between some random murder based on perceived psychic ability vs. killing someone who’s already threatened people’s lives in order to obtain a paltry sum of money. You want to kill someone who hasn’t killed anyone, because you think he might kill someone, someday. That is fucked up. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2015, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/positive-gun-news-of-the-day/735490/295 "2015-12-05T22:20:09Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > You want to kill someone who hasn’t killed anyone, because you think he might kill someone, someday. That is fucked up. Well, first of all I don’t want to kill anybody. What I am saying is that such a shooting would be justified, for the reasons I’ve already explained. ---
**Author:** ![SeldomSeen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/7ba0ec/32.png) [@SeldomSeen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SeldomSeen)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2015, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/positive-gun-news-of-the-day/735490/296 "2015-12-06T02:41:35Z")
This, I think belongs in the realm of positive gun news: [Meet the Gun-Loving Lifelong Member of the NRA Who Just Submitted His Resignation](http://news.yahoo.com/meet-gun-loving-lifelong-member-175404650.html) Nevada state legislator, congressional candidate and gun lover John Oceguera has had enough of NRA recalcitrance. > [@](#): > > “Our country is facing a tragic gun violence epidemic, and we cannot ignore it. Still, the NRA opposes any legislation that would help keep guns out of the hands of terrorists, criminals and the mentally ill, and spends millions to stop any action in Congress that could help prevent further violence,” he wrote. “I cannot continue to be a member while the NRA refuses to back closing these loopholes.” May we see more responsible gun owners taking matters into their own hands WRT LaPierre and the crazies. ---
**Author:** ![Roderick\_Femm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roderick_femm/32/14875_2.png) [@Roderick\_Femm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roderick_Femm)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2015, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/positive-gun-news-of-the-day/735490/297 "2015-12-06T02:59:29Z")
Thanks, I just shared that article on facebook, for the benefit of my cousin and her throwback husband. If they haven’t blocked me already, this will probably do it. ---
**Author:** ![ChickenLegs](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ecc23a/32.png) [@ChickenLegs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ChickenLegs)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2015, 1:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/positive-gun-news-of-the-day/735490/298 "2015-12-06T13:33:29Z")
Homeowner apprehends burglars: > **[Washington man detains suspected burglars at gunpoint](https://katu.com/news/local/washington-man-detains-burglars-at-gunpoint)** > > Officials in Cowlitz County say a southern Washington man managed to keep a pair of suspected burglars at bay until the cops showed up. Now, the local sheriff's office is applauding his efforts.It happened earlier this week in a rural Woodland... ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2015, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/positive-gun-news-of-the-day/735490/299 "2015-12-06T16:06:39Z")
In other news, [Burglary suspect shot by woman in St. Louis](http://fox2now.com/2015/10/14/burglary-suspect-shot-by-woman-in-st-louis/) > [@](#): > > Police say the woman and her 19-year-old son heard an alarm sound and went to the garage, where she saw a man rummaging through a pile of bags. The woman pulled out a handgun and told the man to leave. > > Police say that when the man turned toward her, she feared he was coming at her, and fired a shot. > > The son and the man then fought, and the woman shot at the burglar again. He was found later in another yard. The idea that someone breaking in is just there for stuff doesn’t seem to be one to bet your life on. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2015, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/positive-gun-news-of-the-day/735490/300 "2015-12-07T13:36:46Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > You want to kill someone who hasn’t killed anyone, because you think he might kill someone, someday. That is fucked up. Even if that were true, he’d be no more than following the lead set by people from the anti-gun side. They’re all about punishing gun owners for things that they might do or crimes that might be committed with guns they own(ed). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/positive-gun-news-of-the-day/735490.md?page=14) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/positive-gun-news-of-the-day/735490.md?page=16)