# Possession is nine tenths of the law...Just what does this mean? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 11, 2011, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/possession-is-nine-tenths-of-the-law-just-what-does-this-mean/605797 "2011-12-11T03:50:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![foolscap](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9a140/32.png) [@foolscap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolscap)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2011, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/possession-is-nine-tenths-of-the-law-just-what-does-this-mean/605797/1 "2011-12-11T03:50:40Z")
I have heard this old saying, and , have never known just what it refers to. 😕 ---
**Author:** ![Wheeljack](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@Wheeljack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wheeljack)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2011, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/possession-is-nine-tenths-of-the-law-just-what-does-this-mean/605797/2 "2011-12-11T03:55:50Z")
Wikipedia has an article that sums it up nicely. > **[Possession is nine-tenths of the law](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Possession_is_nine-tenths_of_the_law)** > > Possession is nine-tenths of the law is an expression meaning that ownership is easier to maintain if one has possession of something, or difficult to enforce if one does not. The expression is also stated as "possession is ten points of the law", which is credited as derived from the Scottish expression "possession is eleven points in the law, and they say there are but twelve." > Although the principle is an oversimplification, it can be restated as: "In a property dispute (whether real or perso... ---
**Author:** ![Arkcon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/96bed5/32.png) [@Arkcon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arkcon)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2011, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/possession-is-nine-tenths-of-the-law-just-what-does-this-mean/605797/3 "2011-12-11T13:27:51Z")
Uncle Cecil covered it too, but I don’t have time for a search right now. I really dunno how I’m going to get 9/10 into a search that will work. Uncle Cecil’s is a good, through, cover of the topic, IIRC. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2011, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/possession-is-nine-tenths-of-the-law-just-what-does-this-mean/605797/4 "2011-12-11T14:51:55Z")
The original quote was " possession is nine _points_ of the law," the idea being that if you possess a property, you have an advantage, like a team with a nine-point lead. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2011, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/possession-is-nine-tenths-of-the-law-just-what-does-this-mean/605797/5 "2011-12-11T15:02:40Z")
What it boils down to is when the cops finds your buddy’s pot in your pocket, you’re the one that gets busted. Actually, better yet, when the cops find your friend’s pot in your car, you’re the one that get’s busted, which is why they say you should never consent to a search, even if you ‘know’ there’s nothing to worry about in your car (things fall out of pockets or get forgotten). I believe the remaining 1/10 is that you can clear your name if you can prove that whatever your in possession of isn’t yours, but that can be very difficult. In a lot of cases (like a bag of pot) it may take someone stepping up and claiming ownership of it. ---
**Author:** ![srzss05](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/898d66/32.png) [@srzss05](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/srzss05)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2011, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/possession-is-nine-tenths-of-the-law-just-what-does-this-mean/605797/6 "2011-12-11T21:55:38Z")
> [@Wheeljack](#): > > Wikipedia has an article that sums it up nicely. > > [Possession is nine-tenths of the law - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Possession_is_nine-tenths_of_the_law) I was going to say it is just another way of saying “finders keepers, losers weepers”, and see that that article references that saying as well. ---
**Author:** ![barbitu8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/839c29/32.png) [@barbitu8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/barbitu8)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2011, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/possession-is-nine-tenths-of-the-law-just-what-does-this-mean/605797/7 "2011-12-11T22:12:54Z")
> [@srzss05](#): > > I was going to say it is just another way of saying “finders keepers, losers weepers”, and see that that article references that saying as well. There’s a lot of law as to a finder. A finder does not have any right against the true owner, but does he get to keep it? Not always. The predominant point is that if personal property is found in a public place, or in a place where the public frequents, he usually does, but does not if found in a private place. In the latter situation, the owner of the real property has the better right. ---
**Author:** ![srzss05](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/898d66/32.png) [@srzss05](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/srzss05)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2011, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/possession-is-nine-tenths-of-the-law-just-what-does-this-mean/605797/8 "2011-12-11T22:19:06Z")
> [@barbitu8](#): > > There’s a lot of law as to a finder. A finder does not have any right against the true owner, but does he get to keep it? Not always. The predominant point is that if personal property is found in a public place, or in a place where the public frequents, he usually does, but does not if found in a private place. In the latter situation, the owner of the real property has the better right. You’re over analyzing this. It’s just a saying. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2011, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/possession-is-nine-tenths-of-the-law-just-what-does-this-mean/605797/9 "2011-12-12T17:53:16Z")
Generally, in lawsuits, courts are reluctant to overturn the status quo until everything has been settled. They aren’ going to tell person A “get out of your house until we decide whether B has a better claim”. So by maintaining possession, one has a better chance of continuing to posses than otherwise. If someone tries to use the law to take away your possessions, they have a harder fight to upset the status quo, since one of the first questions is going to be “how come you don’t have it any more, if it is yours?” ---
**Author:** ![robardin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/43a26b/32.png) [@robardin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robardin)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2011, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/possession-is-nine-tenths-of-the-law-just-what-does-this-mean/605797/10 "2011-12-12T18:56:51Z")
Huh. After all these years I finally get the joke - about 23 years ago I got a UNIX login fortune that read: “In Haiti, possession is nine tenths of the loa”. (Me being me, I knew what a “loa” was in the context of voodoo and its association with Haiti, but was not familiar with the legal quip.) ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2011, 7:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/possession-is-nine-tenths-of-the-law-just-what-does-this-mean/605797/11 "2011-12-13T07:41:24Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > What it boils down to is when the cops finds your buddy’s pot in your pocket, you’re the one that gets busted. > > Actually, better yet, when the cops find your friend’s pot in your car, you’re the one that get’s busted, which is why they say you should never consent to a search, even if you ‘know’ there’s nothing to worry about in your car (things fall out of pockets or get forgotten). > > I believe the remaining 1/10 is that you can clear your name if you can prove that whatever your in possession of isn’t yours, but that can be very difficult. In a lot of cases (like a bag of pot) it may take someone stepping up and claiming ownership of it. Also the opposite: if someone files a complaint that his unused house is actually being used by squatters, and the squatters can prove that they’ve been there a long time and have improved the property (that is, they treat it like “their” property rather than vandalizing it), the judges may fail for the squatters. In certain locations, etc etc. ---
**Author:** ![barbitu8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/839c29/32.png) [@barbitu8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/barbitu8)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2011, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/possession-is-nine-tenths-of-the-law-just-what-does-this-mean/605797/12 "2011-12-13T20:58:31Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > Also the opposite: if someone files a complaint that his unused house is actually being used by squatters, and the squatters can prove that they’ve been there a long time and have improved the property (that is, they treat it like “their” property rather than vandalizing it), the judges may fail for the squatters. In certain locations, etc etc. This is known as adverse possession, and the possession must be open and adverse. The time of possession varies by states but it is at least several years. Improvements are not necessary. The owner of the property must have knowledge of the possession or has abandoned it.