I see. So the only effective prayer will be one by which your deity indicates what he wants and such that the praying person and others can follow it if they choose. What would be an example of how this works?
It sounds much more restrictive than the popular conception of what prayer can achieve than I’ve ever heard of.
I suppose the traditional “God, send me a sign” would be a good example.
I was more interested in how this works, not what is asked for, so much.
Worked for me! 
I have never thought that prayers were for specific things or events, but for general results desired. I was always taught to begin prayers with " If it be Thy will…"
Prayer is something to do until what ever happens happens!You could pray to a carrot ,rock, or a tree, if it happens you say carrot,rock or tree answered my prayers, if not you can say carrot, tree, or rock, said no.
Monavis
By which I mean what signs are given, how do you know they are signs etc.
Ah, yes, the “everything happens for a reason” folks. They never try to extend that vague and virtually meaningless slogan, do they?
Yes, things happen for reasons. But those reasons don’t necessarily make sense. And it doesn’t have to be all for the good or the better.
How do we follow God’s plan? How do we even know what it is?
Bush, Cheney, and Palin invoked God as if they knew exactly what Its plans were: “God wants me to run for office/has ordained me/wants us to invade Iraq/the war there was a task from God.”
Again, there’s an epistemological problem here. How do they know all that? More importantly, how can the rest of us believe them?
Just asking.
I suppose in theory you could have payed “God, I don’t know who I should vote for. I’m going to watch the debates tonight so please send me a sign so I know which candidate you prefer.” Then in the middle of the debates, a shaft of pure sunlight breaks through and shines down on Barack Obama’s head. Which is a pretty clear sign of divine intent, considering the debates were held indoors.
But you still could have said, “What? Are you nuts, God? Have you seen his plan to raise taxes? Sorry, but I’m voting for McCain.”
Thanks for posting that!!! I was just about to do so when I saw your post.
Yup.
The woods are full of them.
Prayer doesn’t work, there is no god…
To quote a recent ad displayed on
London double- deckers, “There probably
isn’t a god. Now, stop worrying and live
your lives.”
I’m hoping this election starts to wake people up.
To do things now, you don’t consult a 10,000 year old book
and talk to the walls.
Besides, if a god wanted Obama or McCain,
why in the he’ll did we vote anyway?
Could god make a rock so big he couldn’t lift it himself?
(An old stump-the-parson riddle, but one I’ve always had a sort of fondness for.)
Does this sort of thing happen?
People claim it’s happened to them.
What I’ve learned about religion in my lifetime:
God has always been and will always be. (Old as all get-out)
God knows all that has happened and all that will happen. (OK, so he couldn’t see that Satan would tempt Eve and Adam would eat the fruit?)
God has his own plan for humanity. (We don’t have any real say in anything)
God is all-powerful. (Control freak)
God loves you. (Then why do I have to suffer and die?)
God gave mankind Free Will to make its own decisions. (Begs the question why’d he bother if he knows how it’s going to go anyway.)
It doesn’t matter what you want, it matters what God wants. (Again with the ineffable plan thingy)
God wants you to listen and obey him so you can join him in Heaven when you die. But if you don’t listen and obey, you go to Hell. (But he loves you!)
No wonder I became an atheist. Religion was devised by humans to control other humans. No god would come up with such a screwed-up, convoluted, non-sensical proposition that even a ten-year old could decide was a pant-load of horse-apples.
And, please, don’t chance a case of carpal-tunnel trying to convert me. I tried for thirty years to parse the solution out of every bible I read, out of seven different ‘men of god’, out of praying for guidance and never felt a single moment of heavenly influence.
I got squat, cuz that’s what there is, squat.
Look, folks, it’s really simple.
Sarah Palin was the answer to Barack Obama’s prayers.