# Preferred form of LGBTQ initialism **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [April 3, 2023, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/preferred-form-of-lgbtq-initialism/982106 "2023-04-03T23:20:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/preferred-form-of-lgbtq-initialism/982106/21 "2023-04-05T04:50:16Z")
> you don’t really hear “sexual orientation” that much any more - “sexuality” is the more common term. Maybe it’s just me, but I understood that as an implied distinction between fancying it and actually doing it. I hadn’t (yet?) come across objections to “orientation” on the grounds that it sounds as though it’s associated with orientalism, but if that’s a problem, I suppose “alignment” could work as an alternative. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 5:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/preferred-form-of-lgbtq-initialism/982106/22 "2023-04-05T05:41:09Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > Read a terribly sad article in the Atlantic about [equity language](https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2023/04/equity-language-guides-sierra-club-banned-words/673085/). A not particularly insightful article relying on the usual exaggerations and sloppy arguments of typical anti-“wokeism” whining, IMHO. I agree, however, that the author did a good job of using rhetorical skill to misrepresent his subject as something “terribly sad”. (“Linguistic purification”, “banning words”, pretending that official corporate-language style guides are somehow threatening the freedom of authors of essays and memoirs, oh boo hoo hoo how tragic, uh-huh.) > [@Miller](#): > > Yeah, you don’t really hear “sexual orientation” that much any more - “sexuality” is the more common term. I’m not sure if that’s specifically because of concerns over the etymology of “orient,” […] Agree that “gender and sexuality” seems to be preferred nowadays as an umbrella term for all social and biological aspects of matters associated in some way with sex (including asexuality), rather than the more narrow issue of which direction one is “oriented” sexually. I likewise haven’t encountered any criticisms of the term “orientation” in the sense of “alignment” or “direction”, as opposed to long-deprecated usages such as “Oriental” or “the Orient”. ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/preferred-form-of-lgbtq-initialism/982106/23 "2023-04-05T14:02:49Z")
My company uses “LGBTQIA+”. I prefer to use “gender-diverse”, as I prefer words over initialisms. The word “gender”, at its root, means “kind” (as in a category). In this connotation of sexual identities it is all inclusive. If particular circumstances refer to a more specific group, then that group should be referred to explicitly. ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/preferred-form-of-lgbtq-initialism/982106/24 "2023-04-05T14:07:09Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > I have never seen this before, and wouldn’t recognize what it means. But i like it a lot. I hope it catches on. > **[Urban Dictionary: MOGII](https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=MOGII)** > > Marginalized Orientation, Gender Identity, and Intersex. A newer term proposed for the lengthy LGBTQIAP+ which is inclusive for people who don't have or don't want labels, rejects allies, and uses no reclaimed slurs. ---
**Author:** ![ralfy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ralfy/32/600_2.png) [@ralfy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralfy)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/preferred-form-of-lgbtq-initialism/982106/25 "2023-04-05T14:45:23Z")
Pointless as they claim that there are dozens of genders: > **[Here's a List of 58 Gender Options for Facebook Users](https://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2014/02/heres-a-list-of-58-gender-options-for-facebook-users)** > > Facebook lets users customize their gender. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/preferred-form-of-lgbtq-initialism/982106/28 "2023-04-05T14:49:37Z")
I count about seven on that list. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/preferred-form-of-lgbtq-initialism/982106/29 "2023-04-05T15:08:40Z")
I think i can maybe get it up to nine. Cis male Cis female Trans male Trans female Non-binary Agender Gender fluid Bigender and maybe intersex, not that that’s really a gender The others are just variant names. It doesn’t seem outrageous to give people the choice of how to express ideas that don’t have really well-understood meanings in many communities right now. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/preferred-form-of-lgbtq-initialism/982106/30 "2023-04-05T15:14:52Z")
> [@PatrickLondon](#): > > I stopped trying to keep up when someone came up with QUILTBAG. Does the U stand for something? Or was it included to make the word? ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/preferred-form-of-lgbtq-initialism/982106/31 "2023-04-05T15:20:27Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Yeah, queer is my preferred term, as well. I’m middle aged, but still young enough that growing up, “queer” was an archaism - something they used to use back in the '30s, but everyone had since moved on to more modern slurs. The only people I heard using it in a modern context were gay rights orgs who were reclaiming it, so it never had a visceral association with bigotry for me. I’m old enough that I remember queer being used as a slur. This would have been the sixties and seventies so it was later than you recall (or I grew up in a region that was behind on its use of abusive language). Either way, that’s the usage I grew up with and my personal association with the word. Which is why I’m not comfortable using it. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/preferred-form-of-lgbtq-initialism/982106/32 "2023-04-05T15:22:44Z")
Agreed, I thought queer was still an insult/slur at least into the 80s. But I lived in suburbia and/or was in the Navy for the 70s & 80s.Not a city. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/preferred-form-of-lgbtq-initialism/982106/33 "2023-04-05T15:40:07Z")
“Unsure.” ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/preferred-form-of-lgbtq-initialism/982106/34 "2023-04-05T16:12:39Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > I’m old enough that I remember queer being used as a slur. This would have been the sixties and seventies so it was later than you recall (or I grew up in a region that was behind on its use of abusive language). > > Either way, that’s the usage I grew up with and my personal association with the word I was called that pretty often between 4th grade and sophomore yr of high school. Edited to Add: late 60s thru mid 70s [/edit] I’m on board with repurposing mean-spirited words that others called me by. It’s in the spirit of “I am one of the ones singled out and called this thing”. A central part of why I choose to draw attention to my identity is that other people made an issue of it _first_. But I recognize that other people (whether called that or just uncomfortable flinging around a word that made others uncomfortable) are not at ease with using it. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/preferred-form-of-lgbtq-initialism/982106/35 "2023-04-05T16:31:13Z")
Queer was certainly still used as a pejorative well into the 80s, possibly early 90s. It’s used a few times in _Stranger Things_ (set in the 80s), as a slur against Will by some bullies. It still feels odd to me to use that word in a neutral or positive sense, as my childhood associations with it being used in phrases like “you fucking queer” or the childhood game we called “Smear the Queer” is so strong. ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/preferred-form-of-lgbtq-initialism/982106/36 "2023-04-05T18:26:40Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > It still feels odd to me to use that word in a neutral or positive sense, as my childhood associations with it being used in phrases like “you fucking queer” or the childhood game we called “Smear the Queer” is so strong. It’s like when the lesbian feminists within the National Organization for Women chose to form a group called “Lavender Menace”. It’s what Betty Friedan had called them. It was their way of saying back “we know we’re going to be called the most horrific things you can think of and we don’t care, we ain’t going away and we won’t be shut down by your attempts to smear us”. > **[Lavender Menace](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lavender_Menace)** > > The Lavender Menace was an informal group of lesbian radical feminists formed to protest the exclusion of lesbians and their issues from the feminist movement at the Second Congress to Unite Women in New York City on May 1, 1970. > Members included Karla Jay, Martha Shelley, Rita Mae Brown, Lois Hart, Barbara Love, Ellen Shumsky, Artemis March, Cynthia Funk, Linda Rhodes, Arlene Kushner, Ellen Broidy, and Michela Griffo, and were mostly members of the Gay Liberation Front (GLF) and the National Th... Or imagine if Alexandra Ocasio-Cortez and Bernie Sanders formed a new splinter party and named themselves the “Godless Commie Threat”. It really sticks a spike in your opponents’ attempt to get everyone to dismiss you as some intolerable departure from the acceptable. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/preferred-form-of-lgbtq-initialism/982106/37 "2023-04-05T18:39:44Z")
> [@AHunter3](#): > > It’s like when the lesbian feminists within the National Organization for Women chose to form a group called “Lavender Menace”. It’s what Betty Friedan had called them. It was their way of saying back “we know we’re going to be called the most horrific things you can think of and we don’t care, we ain’t going away and we won’t be shut down by your attempts to smear us”. Oh, I understand the reasoning. It just still is slightly jarring given my childhood associations with the word. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2023, 9:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/preferred-form-of-lgbtq-initialism/982106/38 "2023-04-06T09:20:42Z")
> [@AHunter3](#): > > Or imagine if Alexandra Ocasio-Cortez and Bernie Sanders formed a new splinter party and named themselves the “Godless Commie Threat”. Happens all over. Within barely a day of a Tory cabinet minister dismissing her critics as [“the Guardian-reading, tofu-eating wokerati”](https://news.sky.com/story/home-secretary-suella-braverman-blames-protest-disruption-on-tofu-eating-wokerati-12724058), the [T-shirts were on sale](https://shop.newsthump.com/product/the-guardian-reading-tofu-eating-wokerati-t-shirt/). ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2023, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/preferred-form-of-lgbtq-initialism/982106/39 "2023-04-06T15:56:51Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > Just FYI, the I is for Intersex, the A for asexual (as well as aromantic and agender), I’ve also seen the “A” used to stand for “allies”, as a way of saying “Even if you’re a cis het binary male, you’re welcome here”. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2023, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/preferred-form-of-lgbtq-initialism/982106/40 "2023-04-06T19:48:00Z")
See also: Obamacare. ---
**Author:** ![eschrodinger](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschrodinger/32/122_2.png) [@eschrodinger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschrodinger)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2023, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/preferred-form-of-lgbtq-initialism/982106/41 "2023-04-06T20:19:55Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > and maybe intersex, not that that’s really a gender > > The others are just variant names. It doesn’t seem outrageous to give people the choice of how to express ideas that don’t have really well-understood meanings in many communities right now. There are people who identify as intersex. That is, their biology is intersex, and they identify as a gender associated with that biology. There’s a documentary called Intersexion available on Prime Video, and I think the filmmaker so identifies. I know that there are different meanings for many that you call “just variant names.” Transmasc people include folks who don’t identify as nonbinary, nor as transmen. Genderqueer ealso is distinct, and is not contained within any that you listed. A few of those listed are preferred ways of expressing essentially the same concepts, but many are distinct. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2023, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/preferred-form-of-lgbtq-initialism/982106/42 "2023-04-06T20:26:55Z")
I mean, really, all of these are on a multidimensional continuum, and not really atomic identities. Most of us “round” to an identity that fits us well enough. Having lots of options to self-identify seems like a good thing, not a problem. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/preferred-form-of-lgbtq-initialism/982106.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/preferred-form-of-lgbtq-initialism/982106.md?page=3)