# Pregnant woman demands seat on train (London) **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 9, 2011, 12:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pregnant-woman-demands-seat-on-train-london/581263 "2011-05-09T12:41:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2011, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pregnant-woman-demands-seat-on-train-london/581263/41 "2011-05-09T20:44:49Z")
To me, this issue is purely contextual. I’ll be the first guy to leave my seat for women (preggers or not) and the elderly (but watch out, there’s a non-trivial chance to get yelled at because “I’m not _that_ old, asshole !” :)) - I was raised that way and I do it more or less unthinkingly by now. I’ll also hold doors for both men and women, and help people with their luggage up stairs (mostly because the clattering noise annoys me). I’m just _that_ unbelievably awesomee. However, anyone peremptorily demanding I do any of that ; or worse doing that passive-aggressive thing where you loudly tell your companion/husband/imaginary friend that people these days just have no manners in a flagrant obliviousness to irony ; yeah, those people trigger my fuckyou reflex something fierce. Politeness goes both ways. ---
**Author:** ![MsWhatsit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eb8c5e/32.png) [@MsWhatsit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsWhatsit)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2011, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pregnant-woman-demands-seat-on-train-london/581263/42 "2011-05-09T20:47:09Z")
So would the phrasing mentioned in the OP count as “peremptorily demanding”? ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2011, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pregnant-woman-demands-seat-on-train-london/581263/43 "2011-05-09T20:50:41Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > It is, and they are. Usually people do give up their seats but people also usually zone out or read or text during the commute so don’t always notice. There’s no harm in asking someone to move. > > Here’s a fun anecdote which does not necessarily reflect well on us: when my wife was pregnant a few years ago she was on a crowded, jostling train and asked a seated woman next to her if she could sit down as she was not feeling overly well (she had her Baby on Board badge on). The woman responded with a torrent of abuse and profanity. Thirty seconds later, my wife threw up on her. > > I’m just sayin’. Karma, ain’t it great! ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2011, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pregnant-woman-demands-seat-on-train-london/581263/44 "2011-05-09T20:53:03Z")
Would it be inappropriate to respond with. Well…maybe…How do I know you’re not just a fattie trying to take advantage of me? ---
**Author:** ![Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hilarity_n.suze/32/6223_2.png) [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hilarity_N.Suze)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2011, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pregnant-woman-demands-seat-on-train-london/581263/45 "2011-05-09T21:00:54Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > It is, and they are. Usually people do give up their seats but people also usually zone out or read or text during the commute so don’t always notice. There’s no harm in asking someone to move. > > Here’s a fun anecdote which does not necessarily reflect well on us: when my wife was pregnant a few years ago she was on a crowded, jostling train and asked a seated woman next to her if she could sit down as she was not feeling overly well (she had her Baby on Board badge on). The woman responded with a torrent of abuse and profanity. Thirty seconds later, my wife threw up on her. > > I’m just sayin’. I have a similarly fun anecdote, although it does not involve bodily fluids. I was on a fairly crowded bus middling-to-largely pregnant and with a toddler, and nobody offered me a seat. I moved back to where a woman had a backpack taking up one seat next to her and stood there hopefully, but she didn’t even offer to move the backpack, and then the bus started up. So with one hand on my kid I grabbed the strap with the other hand, and there was just no way I could keep my shoulder bag from banging the lady in the face, repeatedly. After the second time, she moved her backpack. ---
**Author:** ![Amasia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ba9def/32.png) [@Amasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amasia)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2011, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pregnant-woman-demands-seat-on-train-london/581263/46 "2011-05-09T22:53:47Z")
> [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](#): > > I have a similarly fun anecdote, although it does not involve bodily fluids. I was on a fairly crowded bus middling-to-largely pregnant and with a toddler, and nobody offered me a seat. I moved back to where a woman had a backpack taking up one seat next to her and stood there hopefully, but she didn’t even offer to move the backpack, and then the bus started up. So with one hand on my kid I grabbed the strap with the other hand, and there was just no way I could keep my shoulder bag from banging the lady in the face, repeatedly. After the second time, she moved her backpack. Why wouldn’t you ask her to move the backpack right away? That would seem to be a much more effective way of getting a seat and no one would get hit in the face. My experience on public transportation is that people are pretty damn clueless of what’s going on around them unless explicitly confronted with it. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2011, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pregnant-woman-demands-seat-on-train-london/581263/47 "2011-05-09T23:10:02Z")
> [@Amasia](#): > > Why wouldn’t you ask her to move the backpack right away? That would seem to be a much more effective way of getting a seat and no one would get hit in the face. My experience on public transportation is that people are pretty damn clueless of what’s going on around them unless explicitly confronted with it. As I said before, speech is a wonderful tool. A polite request is much more … polite … than glaring resentfully or hitting someone in the face. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2011, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pregnant-woman-demands-seat-on-train-london/581263/48 "2011-05-09T23:19:16Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > I never automatically assume a woman with a bulge is pregnant. That way lies danger. Which is why I like the badges - no ambiguity. Never ever ask if a woman is pregnant, unless you can see an actual baby coming out of her. ---
**Author:** ![Fair\_Rarity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fair_rarity/32/153_2.png) [@Fair\_Rarity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fair_Rarity)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pregnant-woman-demands-seat-on-train-london/581263/49 "2011-05-10T01:32:23Z")
I was on the train with my mother when I was pregnant. For those of you who don’t think pregnant women deserve special consideration on public transit, let me tell you that your center of gravity changes and it was hard to balance myself correctly sometimes. In _The Cider House Rules_, one of the characters talks about how he could tell a woman was pregnant just by how she walked, the care she took not to tip over. I’m sure not every woman ever was like that, but for some of us, standing on a moving train is a serious accident waiting to happen. So I boarded the train and all the seats were taken and I patted the belly and I was about to ask the nearest, healthiest looking person to please let me sit when my mother screamed “SHE’S PREGNANT. SOMEONE GIVE HER A SEAT.” I was so mortified. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pregnant-woman-demands-seat-on-train-london/581263/50 "2011-05-10T01:48:47Z")
> [@DragonAsh](#): > > But I see the following a lot, including this morning: Woman gets on the train, moves in front of the person sitting down in the seat closest to the door. Said person is busy with what looks to be company paperwork or whatever. Woman proceeds to tap him on the shoulder, points to her ‘baby on board’ pin on her bag, and says, and I quote, ‘Could you stand up please, I’d like to sit down’. Blunt, not rude, IMHO. The guy is absorbed in his paperwork, after all. But just having the pin doesn’t mean she’s pregnant. If I were the man, I’d look at the woman and if she were not visibly pregnant I’d say so and keep my seat; if she were visibly pregnant I’d give way immediately. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pregnant-woman-demands-seat-on-train-london/581263/51 "2011-05-10T01:51:52Z")
> [@MsWhatsit](#): > > So would the phrasing mentioned in the OP count as “peremptorily demanding”? Couldn’t tell you - it’s as much a matter of phrasing as tone and body language. I wasn’t there so I wouldn’t know. ---
**Author:** ![matt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a6a055/32.png) [@matt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 4:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pregnant-woman-demands-seat-on-train-london/581263/52 "2011-05-10T04:55:33Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > Blunt, not rude, IMHO. The guy is absorbed in his paperwork, after all. Agree. > [@Quartz](#): > > But just having the pin doesn’t mean she’s pregnant. If I were the man, I’d look at the woman and if she were not visibly pregnant I’d say so and keep my seat; if she were visibly pregnant I’d give way immediately. There’s no obvious signs of early-stage pregancy, and for bigger women even late-stage pregnancy may not be obvious. I’d give up my seat rather than take a chance that I was being a selfish git. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 5:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pregnant-woman-demands-seat-on-train-london/581263/53 "2011-05-10T05:10:31Z")
If they’re only a few weeks pregnant, so little that you can’t even tell, do they really have a condition that requires them to be sitting all the time? ---
**Author:** ![Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hilarity_n.suze/32/6223_2.png) [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hilarity_N.Suze)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 5:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pregnant-woman-demands-seat-on-train-london/581263/54 "2011-05-10T05:10:39Z")
> [@Amasia](#): > > Why wouldn’t you ask her to move the backpack right away? That would seem to be a much more effective way of getting a seat and no one would get hit in the face. My experience on public transportation is that people are pretty damn clueless of what’s going on around them unless explicitly confronted with it. Every now and then extreme social anxiety kicks in and I’m afraid to say two words to anyone. Also, the backpack was on the seat next to the window, and what I really wanted was for her to move over and put the backpack in her lap, rather than put the backpack in her lap and let me climb over the seat. (And she should have moved the backpack–other people were standing as well.) I would have gotten around to talking to her in another 30 seconds or so but then the bus took off. Please note, I did not purposely hit her in the face with my bag. It was a shoulder bag, and when the bus took off and I grabbed for the strap so as not to go flying down the aisle, the shoulder bag also went with the momentum of the bus. ---
**Author:** ![MsWhatsit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eb8c5e/32.png) [@MsWhatsit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsWhatsit)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 5:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pregnant-woman-demands-seat-on-train-london/581263/55 "2011-05-10T05:11:58Z")
I didn’t show with my first until I was about 4.5 months or so. I assure you that I was experiencing some of the more uncomfortable side effects of pregnancy long before that point. Now, personally I was capable of standing on a train or bus for at least short trips, but not every pregnant woman is. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pregnant-woman-demands-seat-on-train-london/581263/56 "2011-05-10T05:19:26Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > That’s no excuse. They should still be embarrassed to wear them. If you want to ask a favour of someone, you should have to ask, not rely on idiotic signage. Right. We should get rid of handicap license plates too. handicapped folks can ask nicely. ---
**Author:** ![SeaDragonTattoo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df705f/32.png) [@SeaDragonTattoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SeaDragonTattoo)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 5:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pregnant-woman-demands-seat-on-train-london/581263/57 "2011-05-10T05:21:08Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > Blunt, not rude, IMHO. The guy is absorbed in his paperwork, after all. > > But just having the pin doesn’t mean she’s pregnant. If I were the man, I’d look at the woman and if she were not visibly pregnant I’d say so and keep my seat; if she were visibly pregnant I’d give way immediately. That’s a load a hooey. The tiny doctor I work with who’s maybe 95 pounds soaking wet and never wore maternity clothes other than her husband’s sweatshirts, wasn’t noticeably pregnant until she was 7 MONTHS along. Damn straight she still needed that seat long before she was “visibly pregnant” unless she tightened her shirt and stuck her belly in your face. I suppose she could have just puked on you. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pregnant-woman-demands-seat-on-train-london/581263/58 "2011-05-10T05:22:04Z")
> [@An\_Gadai](#): > > You’re not old-fashioned, just sexist. Why in tarnation should (all other things being equal) men give up seats for women? To look down their shirts of course. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 5:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pregnant-woman-demands-seat-on-train-london/581263/59 "2011-05-10T05:25:36Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > If they’re only a few weeks pregnant, so little that you can’t even tell, do they really have a condition that requires them to be sitting all the time? Oh yeah. My wife was sickest BEFORE she started showing. She physically felt her best in her late second early third trimester ---
**Author:** ![Amara\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/7993a0/32.png) [@Amara\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amara_1)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2011, 5:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pregnant-woman-demands-seat-on-train-london/581263/60 "2011-05-10T05:32:46Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > If they’re only a few weeks pregnant, so little that you can’t even tell, do they really have a condition that requires them to be sitting all the time? I had hyperemesis with my second pregnancy; I lost 5 lbs in my first 4 months because of it. Yes, I needed that seat long before I was showing. For my first pregnancy, I didn’t need any extra accommodation until the very end (8 months +) and wouldn’t have asked for the seat then. Every pregnancy, even for the same woman, can be very different and it can be exhausting. There isn’t necessarily a need to “sit all the time” but pregnancy can be extremely tiring; sitting for the commute does not mean bed rest by any stretch of the imagination. 😛 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pregnant-woman-demands-seat-on-train-london/581263.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pregnant-woman-demands-seat-on-train-london/581263.md?page=4)