# President Bush's Health **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 28, 2004, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-bushs-health/281858 "2004-12-28T01:56:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![BJMoose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/5fc32e/32.png) [@BJMoose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BJMoose)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-bushs-health/281858/21 "2004-12-28T19:47:58Z")
> [@Brutus](#): > > Why would Bush need a bulletproof vest on his ranch? Uhmmm, to stop bullets from some over-zealous Bush-hater? The Secret Service is _not_ going to simply declare however many acres of boonyland ‘secure’. Okay. But what sort of geekoid would wear a bulletproof vest under a t-shirt? (cf. foto at link in OP). ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-bushs-health/281858/22 "2004-12-28T20:02:37Z")
IF he is sick, what difference does it make? The man’s not 90 years old; he’ll almost certainly make it to the end of his term. I hope we aren’t all expected to quit our jobs the moment we have a little heart trouble. Half the male population will be retired before they’re 50. ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-bushs-health/281858/23 "2004-12-28T20:05:09Z")
> [@BJMoose](#): > > Okay. But what sort of geekoid would wear a bulletproof vest under a t-shirt? (cf. foto at link in OP). Does it clash with the truck? Should he be bare-chested, other than the vest? Should he wear it over the shirt? 😕 ---
**Author:** ![eleanorigby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee7513/32.png) [@eleanorigby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eleanorigby)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-bushs-health/281858/24 "2004-12-28T20:17:24Z")
Well, we could always hope… I don’t believe the article–Afib can and is well controlled with meds. This is a guy who runs ALOT. He is in good shape, physically. People live for years with Afib (depending on the underlying cause). And it is relativley easy to treat. So, as much as I would like it (although we would end up with Cheyey–talk about out of the frying pan!)–I doubt it. No cites,but I am a critical care nurse–I see AFib every day. ---
**Author:** ![scotandrsn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a4c791/32.png) [@scotandrsn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scotandrsn)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-bushs-health/281858/25 "2004-12-28T20:42:57Z")
> [@dropzone](#): > > But it didn’t, since he seemed to be showing the early symptoms of Alzheimers before he left office! The way these things work is that if you find contradictory evidence it has to be twisted into seeming like it SUPPORTS the theory. (where’s the tinfoil hat smilie when I need it?) Yes, of course. My theory is in line with Paul Slansky’s hilarious book The Clothes Have No Emperor, in which Reagan is exactly what he seemed to be, an actor playing the President. Following this line of reasoning, the REAL President, the puppet-master pulling the strings from behind the scenes, would now be seen as some person “appointed by” Reagan who died before January 1989. William Casey, perhaps? Or if you want to add a radical-left spin to it, a corporate head who died during that period? ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-bushs-health/281858/26 "2004-12-28T20:56:27Z")
> [@manhattan](#): > > As to the OP, the alleged hardware on the President was revealed after the election to be his bulletproof vest – apparently it attaches in back. “Revealed” is putting it rather strongly: according to your cite, an anonymous member of the secret service said this to a reporter for a tiny (if influential) publication. It’s not like the presidential press secretary said it, or like anyone with any accountability said it. That said, the bulletproof vest theory is the one I went with even right after the debate, during the time that **Brutus** and others were mocking me for daring to suggest that there was any there there. Booyah, **Brutus**! Daniel ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-bushs-health/281858/27 "2004-12-28T22:02:24Z")
> [@Left Hand of Dorkness](#): > > …That said, the bulletproof vest theory is the one I went with even right after the debate, during the time that **Brutus** and others were mocking me for daring to suggest that there was any there there. Booyah, **Brutus**! From your thread: > [@Brutus](#): > > The President is wearing his IIIA vest when out there; you could see the occasional outline during the last debates. The stuff the troops wear, Interceptor armor, is bulkier because it has ammunition pouches, attachment points, and with plates, is actually above IIIA in protection. Concealable IIIA vests are certainly available to us mere civilians, and the President gets the good stuff. (Though I doubt anyone knows for sure precisely what make and model he uses.) I see your booyah, and raise you a nyah-nyah. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-bushs-health/281858/28 "2004-12-28T22:12:33Z")
> [@Brutus](#): > > From your thread: [Make me go search for it, will you?](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=5345930&postcount=67) > [@Brutus](#): > > But this is a matter of crucial importance! The ever-diligent Left needs to pursue this matter to its conclusion. Ya, you should probably get some 527s to get some ads up on this topic. You need to spend time, money, and effort to reveal what is really going on. Only then can the truth come out! And this was just the start of your mocking me for asking an innocent question, whose answer has now (according to The Hill, anyone) been answered the way I predicted. Of course, now, like then, when confronted with the silliness of your mockery, you’ll probably descend into incoherent namecalling: > [@Brutus](#): > > Don’t be so thin-skinned and start a tin-foil brigade thread. I await with bated breath your continued ill behavior. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-bushs-health/281858/29 "2004-12-28T22:26:13Z")
> [@Left Hand of Dorkness](#): > > [Make me go search for it, will you?](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=5345930&postcount=67) Builds character! > [@](#): > > And this was just the start of your mocking me for asking an innocent question, whose answer has now (according to The Hill, anyone) been answered the way I predicted. Curious that you clip out the first part of my post, which clearly frames that response in regards to the tin-foils bullshit floating around about ‘transmitters’. And in your OP, you said: > [@](#): > > The earlier hypothesis, that it was an artifact of the body armor he was wearing, now seems pretty implausible. So you go from claiming that vests were implausible, to now saying you championed the idea? Sure. Get over youself. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-bushs-health/281858/30 "2004-12-28T22:29:03Z")
> [@Brutus](#): > > Curious that you clip out the first part of my post, which clearly frames that response in regards to the tin-foils bullshit floating around about ‘transmitters’. Not at all: the first part wasn’t mocking, and the second part was. Why would I quote the non-mocking part to show that you were mockeriffic? > [@](#): > > So you go from claiming that vests were implausible, to now saying you championed the idea? Sure. Get over youself. As soon as someone pointed out that body armor could fasten in the back, I immediately said that that was probably what it was. Your snide little posts began after I’d agreed with that assessment. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2004, 12:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-bushs-health/281858/31 "2004-12-29T12:41:03Z")
Don’t you think that’s the largest fastener in the world? That bulge in the back is far too large to be explained by being the fastener for a bulletproof vest. The medical device theory fits the photographic evidence far better than the bulletproof vest theory. ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2004, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-bushs-health/281858/32 "2004-12-29T14:08:45Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > Don’t you think that’s the largest fastener in the world? That bulge in the back is far too large to be explained by being the fastener for a bulletproof vest. The medical device theory fits the photographic evidence far better than the bulletproof vest theory. Not a fastener, but a panel. Gotta stop bullets from that direction as well, you know, ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2004, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-bushs-health/281858/33 "2004-12-29T14:23:15Z")
> [@Brutus](#): > > Not a fastener, but a panel. Gotta stop bullets from that direction as well, you know, Perhaps. I’d be more confident in your theory if I had a catalog of such vests showing such panel. But: why does that particular patch of Bush’s back warrant that extra protection? And why such a small panel? Given the bulge in the back, I can imagine a bullet from the rear missing that panel and striking vital organs. If protecting the back was indeed the goal, it seems it should have been much larger. ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2004, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-bushs-health/281858/34 "2004-12-29T14:39:00Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > Perhaps. I’d be more confident in your theory if I had a catalog of such vests showing such panel. But it won’t take much more than a MS Paint picture at some hack website to get you going on the out-there conspiracy theory? Hmmm. Anyhooo, [here is a typical vest.](http://www.secondchance.com/prod.asp?action=prod&prodID=18) Of course, we don’t know what make or model of vest the POTUS gets, but note the bulge outline in the inset photo there, and compare to the bulge in the photo of Dubya in his truck. > [@](#): > > But: why does that particular patch of Bush’s back warrant that extra protection? And why such a small panel? Given the bulge in the back, I can imagine a bullet from the rear missing that panel and striking vital organs. If protecting the back was indeed the goal, it seems it should have been much larger. Again, going off the truck picture, it doesn’t look all that small. It’s just meant to stop a hit in the vitals, not be some all-encompassing perfect armor (which doesn’t really exist, sort off) Occam’s Razor, my tin-foil coifed friends. Occam’s Razor. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2004, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-bushs-health/281858/35 "2004-12-29T14:46:26Z")
Sorry, but I’ll keep wearing the tinfoil (with the propeller option). The link you provided (by the way, thank you for finding it), shows the bulge in the vest should have been larger in area but somewhat thinner than the Bush photos would indicate. Obviously there are different models and there could be a model that looks exactly like Bush’s bulge. But that still doesn’t explain the cable. How do you explain the cable? I think we have one of those situations where those that talk don’t know and those that know don’t talk. ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2004, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-bushs-health/281858/36 "2004-12-29T14:49:45Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > Sorry, but I’ll keep wearing the tinfoil (with the propeller option). The link you provided (by the way, thank you for finding it), shows the bulge in the vest should have been larger in area but somewhat thinner than the Bush photos would indicate. Obviously there are different models and there could be a model that looks exactly like Bush’s bulge. But that still doesn’t explain the cable. How do you explain the cable? I think we have one of those situations where those that talk don’t know and those that know don’t talk. :rolleyes: Right. Well, I did my part. You may now return to your regularly scheduled conspiracy theories. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2004, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-bushs-health/281858/37 "2004-12-29T15:06:59Z")
> [@Brutus](#): > > conspiracy theories. An incorrect term: a doctor and a patient who do not divulge information about the patient’s health are not engaging in a conspiracy by any but the most ludicrous definition of the term. While I’m skeptical about the medical device explanation, nothing in it involves a conspiracy. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2004, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-bushs-health/281858/38 "2004-12-29T16:51:32Z")
For that ridiculous _conspiracy_ theory, bear in mind that more people than just the President and his doctor would be involved. Ergo, conspiracy. A really stupid one, mind you, but there you have it. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2004, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-bushs-health/281858/39 "2004-12-29T17:00:29Z")
> [@Brutus](#): > > For that ridiculous _conspiracy_ theory, bear in mind that more people than just the President and his doctor would be involved. Ergo, conspiracy. A really stupid one, mind you, but there you have it. What illegal, wrongful, or subversive act does this conspiracy involve? T’ain’t a conspiracy without one of those. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2004, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-bushs-health/281858/40 "2004-12-29T17:01:20Z")
Would that be so different than FDR’s keeping his polio somewhat hidden? Or JFK and his back pain? I think it’s plausible that Bush could be wearing a heart device and only telling Laura, Dick, and Condi the full story. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-bushs-health/281858.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-bushs-health/281858.md?page=3)