# President Obama eats his steak medium-well! **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 5, 2009, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-eats-his-steak-medium-well/512634 "2009-10-05T03:12:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Oslo\_Ostragoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a9a28c/32.png) [@Oslo\_Ostragoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oslo_Ostragoth)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 7:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-eats-his-steak-medium-well/512634/61 "2009-10-06T07:30:40Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > A well-done steak is still juicy and flavorful. Have to disagree. (First post I saw that I disagreed with that hadn’t already been skewered.) ---
**Author:** ![parthenokinesis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/cc9497/32.png) [@parthenokinesis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/parthenokinesis)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 11:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-eats-his-steak-medium-well/512634/62 "2009-10-06T11:26:32Z")
> [@Ston\_Col](#): > > Can we at least agree that hamburger meat should be cooked to no less than medium? Not really. When I make burgers I usually eat a couple ounces of the the burger raw with a little worcestershire as a sort of faux tartare. Wouldn’t ever force it on anyone, and you can have yours any way you like, but there’s a definite range of enjoyable states of doneness for most any meat. To my palate, a medium burger is an overcooked burger. ---
**Author:** ![emcee2k](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7bcc69/32.png) [@emcee2k](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emcee2k)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 11:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-eats-his-steak-medium-well/512634/63 "2009-10-06T11:58:07Z")
I always have my steak medium well, which to me means brown all the way through, and no char on the outside. I can deal with a little pink in the center, but I can’t deal with a pool of blood forming around it on my plate. ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 12:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-eats-his-steak-medium-well/512634/64 "2009-10-06T12:18:04Z")
> [@emcee2k](#): > > I always have my steak medium well, which to me means brown all the way through, and no char on the outside. I can deal with a little pink in the center, but I can’t deal with a pool of blood forming around it on my plate. This again. You know that isn’t actually blood, right? ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-eats-his-steak-medium-well/512634/65 "2009-10-06T12:57:01Z")
> [@TruCelt](#): > > I eat mine well-done , when I eat it. I am sick to death of the snobbery of the blood lovers. Ick! Do you really think you are somehow morally superior to me because you like that flavor?!? Yes. Because I like that flavor **and** because I know it isn’t blood. ---
**Author:** ![tim-n-va](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tim-n-va/32/3001_2.png) [@tim-n-va](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tim-n-va)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 1:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-eats-his-steak-medium-well/512634/66 "2009-10-06T13:06:46Z")
> [@D\_Odds](#): > > Yes. Because I like that flavor **and** because I know it isn’t blood. What is that red liquid that runs out of a rare steak? I generally eat my steak on a graduated scale, more rare with the better quality of the cut and facility preparing, less rare with cheaper cuts. But I always thought the red liquid was blood? ---
**Author:** ![MichaelQReilly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@MichaelQReilly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MichaelQReilly)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-eats-his-steak-medium-well/512634/67 "2009-10-06T13:47:20Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > I _think_ you’re maybe kidding, but this actually does seem to be consistent with my observations. I don’t want to get into **Autolycus** “why don’t black people like coffee” territory, but there it is. Actually, that statement would extend more to class division around here. It doesn’t work completely neatly, of course, but if I had to generalize, that’s what I’ve observed. I worked in a semi-ritzy steakhouse though college and I agree with your general observations. I think it’s probably a cultural thing. If you grew up eating something a certain way, it’s likely you will continue to eat it that way and eventually serve it to your kids that way. I also noted that, generally, black people tended to go out to dinner at a later time in the night as well. Same explanation I’m guessing. ---
**Author:** ![Terraplane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/74df32/32.png) [@Terraplane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terraplane)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-eats-his-steak-medium-well/512634/68 "2009-10-06T14:01:58Z")
> [@tim-n-va](#): > > What is that red liquid that runs out of a rare steak? I generally eat my steak on a graduated scale, more rare with the better quality of the cut and facility preparing, less rare with cheaper cuts. But I always thought the red liquid was blood? It’s [myoglobin](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myoglobin). ---
**Author:** ![emcee2k](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7bcc69/32.png) [@emcee2k](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emcee2k)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-eats-his-steak-medium-well/512634/69 "2009-10-06T14:26:37Z")
> [@Labrador\_Deceiver](#): > > This again. > > You know that isn’t actually blood, right? I do now. But that’s not really my point. I don’t dislike rare meat because of the blood (or apparently, myoglobin), if I was turned off by that sort of thing, I wouldn’t be eating animal flesh in the first place. I just don’t like the taste. And the presence of a pool of…myoglobin…immediately gives me an idea of what taste to expect. If cooking meat to medium well actually “destroys the flavor”, than to me that’s a good thing, because I don’t like that flavor. It’s the same way a water treatment plant “destroys the flavor” of sewage. But, it doesn’t destroy the flavor, it just changes it. To one I happen to prefer. ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-eats-his-steak-medium-well/512634/70 "2009-10-06T14:55:51Z")
> [@omgzebras](#): > > It’s [myoglobin](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myoglobin). A small amount of it is myoglobin, but I believe the vast majority of it is just water. ---
**Author:** ![enomaj](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/59ef9b/32.png) [@enomaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enomaj)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-eats-his-steak-medium-well/512634/71 "2009-10-06T15:26:02Z")
[QUOTE=pulykamell] My mom cooks every last piece of pork to death, and no amount of sauce could cover up the dry, shitty end product (she is otherwise a very good cook, **but I do not like her loin at all.)** [/quote] Must have been a rough 9 months for you. 😃 My mom cooked all meat well done. I didn’t learn that medium rare was safe until much later. The only time I’ve had filet mignon I ordered it well done with a glass of red wine. I was at a chess tournament in Chicago. The hotel was kinda fancy and I had cash so I splurged. I didn’t enjoy the meal at all. The filet mignon was horrible and I didn’t finish it. And wine is an acquired test. They had great dinner rolls though. When I got back, I told my coworkers this story and got laughed at. I was told that filet mignon should be medium or less. They also explained that it was safe because bacteria was only on the outside of the steak which is not true for ground meat. Still knowing all this I order medium well. Oh and I was working at hotel/resta ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-eats-his-steak-medium-well/512634/72 "2009-10-06T16:28:04Z")
> [@enomaj](#): > > Must have been a rough 9 months for you. 😃 I _knew_ somebody was going to catch that, but I missed the edit window. 🙂 [QUOTE=omgzebras] You can eventually cook any piece of meat so that it falls apart under it’s own weight. Put a slab of gristle from a worn-out 20 year old mule that’s hauled coffee sacks up and down the Andes for it’s whole life into a crock pot for 24 hours and you will need a spoon instead of a fork. [/quote] From my experience, it’s only the heavily exercised, collagen/connective-tissue heavy pieces of meat like leg, brisket, chuck, etc., that do this. This is because of the breakdown that occurs when tough and chewy collagen converts to soft, juicy gelatin. Steak meats (which are generally from the tenderest, least exercised part of the animal) just get tough and dry through long cooking. That’s one reason I never liked slow-cooked pork chops. While they do sort of fall apart and shred at the end, it’s not the same sort of juicy fall-apart texture you get from something like pork shoulder or beef brisket. They’re dry and mealy and require a lot of sauce to cover up. At any rate, something like chuck steak would be fine for a long braise. And slow-cooked meats are lovely when the cut is right–it’s just that when I eat a steak, that texture is not desirable. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-eats-his-steak-medium-well/512634/73 "2009-10-06T16:33:34Z")
> [@Ston\_Col](#): > > Can we at least agree that hamburger meat should be cooked to no less than medium? That used to be my rule, but now, if I’m at a decent burger place, I like my burgers medium rare (as does my SO). For 1/4 pounders or thinner, I could deal with a more cooked-through patty, but for a 1/2 pound pub burger, it’s gotta be medium rare. Most places, in my experience, overshoot the mark and I’ve learned to order them rare to get the medium rare level of doneness. ---
**Author:** ![gaffa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e68b1a/32.png) [@gaffa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gaffa)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-eats-his-steak-medium-well/512634/74 "2009-10-06T16:40:13Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > That used to be my rule, but now, if I’m at a decent burger place, I like my burgers medium rare (as does my SO). For 1/4 pounders or thinner, I could deal with a more cooked-through patty, but for a 1/2 pound pub burger, it’s gotta be medium rare. Most places, in my experience, overshoot the mark and I’ve learned to order them rare to get the medium rare level of doneness. It depends where their meat is ground. I have a Mexican market near my home in Chicago, and their ground beef is what ground beef is supposed to be - the scraps and trims of all the other cuts. They get primals and cut them up. Anything that isn’t cut into steaks, roasts, etc. becomes ground beef. I’ve gotten there and they had run out of ground beef and they grabbed handfuls of stew meat and fat and ground it while I waited. That, I could eat raw. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-eats-his-steak-medium-well/512634/75 "2009-10-06T16:40:29Z")
> [@TheTerribleTako](#): > > He has a chart (page 152 of the 2004 edition) describing the exact temperature and meat qualities for each stage of rare to well done. The meat qualities of well done meat at 160ºF includes “stiff” indicating that well-done meat is tougher than rarer cuts. One of the tests for doneness is simply pressing the meat with your finger and judging its doneness by the tenderness. (I believe this was alluded to upthread). The classic method for explaining how different levels of doneness feel is to extend your palm and relax it. Press into the flesh between the base of your thumb and center of your palm. This is raw meat. Now bring your thumb and pinky together. Feel that same spot. That’s well done. Thumb and ringfinger is medium. Thumb and middle finger is medium rare. Thumb and forefinger is rare. I’m not necessarily a huge proponent of that system–experience teaches you what differing levels of doneness feel like–but it gives you a baseline. > [@gaffa](#): > > It depends where their meat is ground. I have a Mexican market near my home in Chicago, and their ground beef is what ground beef is supposed to be - the scraps and trims of all the other cuts. They get primals and cut them up. Anything that isn’t cut into steaks, roasts, etc. becomes ground beef. I’ve gotten there and they had run out of ground beef and they grabbed handfuls of stew meat and fat and ground it while I waited. That, I could eat raw. Sure, and a good butcher should grind any meat to order if you ask. HOWEVER, if getting sick is your concern (as opposed to just taste, which I think is your primary point), grinding stew meat is not necessarily going to be safer than eating scraps. Most of the nasty pathogens hang out on the outside of the meat and if that grinder hasn’t been cleaned all day, they can be reintroduced into clean meat. I don’t really worry about it and I’ve never gotten sick from eating raw beef or even pork, but if it is a concern, it’s best to buy and grind the meat yourself. ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-eats-his-steak-medium-well/512634/76 "2009-10-06T16:43:51Z")
> [@gaffa](#): > > It depends where their meat is ground. What depends on where their meat is ground? ---
**Author:** ![gaffa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e68b1a/32.png) [@gaffa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gaffa)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-eats-his-steak-medium-well/512634/77 "2009-10-06T16:49:02Z")
> [@Labrador\_Deceiver](#): > > What depends on where their meat is ground? Meat ground at a slaughterhouse is far more likely to contain pathogens than meat ground at a well-kept butcher shop. And as **pulykamell** pointed out, the safest place is having a grinder of your own. I’d do that except I have limited kitchen space, and a food processor really doesn’t grind beef acceptably, not like the grinder at the butcher shop. ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-eats-his-steak-medium-well/512634/78 "2009-10-06T16:54:29Z")
> [@gaffa](#): > > Meat ground at a slaughterhouse is far more likely to contain pathogens than meat ground at a well-kept butcher shop. And as **pulykamell** pointed out, the safest place is having a grinder of your own. I’d do that except I have limited kitchen space, and a food processor really doesn’t grind beef acceptably, not like the grinder at the butcher shop. I’d much rather eat freshly ground beef, but it still doesn’t get around the fact that the bacteria is being distributed throughout the meat when it is ground. ---
**Author:** ![gaffa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e68b1a/32.png) [@gaffa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gaffa)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-eats-his-steak-medium-well/512634/79 "2009-10-06T17:02:12Z")
> [@Labrador\_Deceiver](#): > > I’d much rather eat freshly ground beef, but it still doesn’t get around the fact that the bacteria is being distributed throughout the meat when it is ground. Sure, but slaughterhouse ground beef is more likely to be contaminated with really nasty stuff that would never even enter a well-run butcher shop ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-eats-his-steak-medium-well/512634/80 "2009-10-06T17:09:24Z")
> [@gaffa](#): > > Sure, but slaughterhouse ground beef is more likely to be contaminated with really nasty stuff that would never even enter a well-run butcher shop You’re right, because the large quantity of meat that is run through a commercial grinder exponentially increases the likelihood that pathogens are spread throughout a large sample. However, no butcher shop is so well run that they have any control over, or knowledge of, the amount of contamination their cuts of beef will contain when they come through the door. The vast majority of beef in this country comes from the same 25 (ish) slaughterhouses. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-eats-his-steak-medium-well/512634.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-eats-his-steak-medium-well/512634.md?page=5)