# President Obama: The First Step in Negotiating Is Not "Bend Over" **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 4, 2010, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-the-first-step-in-negotiating-is-not-bend-over/559518 "2010-11-04T22:35:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Buy\_All\_Means](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7ea924/32.png) [@Buy\_All\_Means](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buy_All_Means)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2010, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-the-first-step-in-negotiating-is-not-bend-over/559518/41 "2010-11-05T20:41:59Z")
> [@yorick73](#): > > I’m sorry…I just can’t take you seriously after **Sam Stone** handed your \*\*\* to you on such an easy one. If I were you I would try reading a newspaper or using google. Or, at the very least, ask politely for a cite so you don’t come away looking like a fool. Can you take me seriously? Can you expound on these consequences? ---
**Author:** ![yorick73](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/b5a626/32.png) [@yorick73](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yorick73)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2010, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-the-first-step-in-negotiating-is-not-bend-over/559518/42 "2010-11-05T20:53:56Z")
> [@Buy\_All\_Means](#): > > Can you take me seriously? Can you expound on these consequences? Do you really want to derail the thread with this (well, more than it has already been derailed)? Every consequence I could name already has had an entire GD thread devoted to it. Flip through it if you really have absolutely no clue what I’m talking about. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2010, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-the-first-step-in-negotiating-is-not-bend-over/559518/43 "2010-11-05T20:56:43Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > No, what I opened your eyes to is that he said exactly what I said he said, and which you characterized as “completely ridiculous” Well, I still find it completely ridiculous that you think your cites show what Obama has been firmly standing up to the Republicans on the issues. ---
**Author:** ![Buy\_All\_Means](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7ea924/32.png) [@Buy\_All\_Means](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buy_All_Means)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2010, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-the-first-step-in-negotiating-is-not-bend-over/559518/44 "2010-11-05T20:58:19Z")
> [@yorick73](#): > > Do you really want to derail the thread with this (well, more than it has already been derailed)? Every consequence I could name already has had an entire GD thread devoted to it. Flip through it if you really have absolutely no clue what I’m talking about. Then why make the post in the first place? ---
**Author:** ![IdahoMauleMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/71c47a/32.png) [@IdahoMauleMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IdahoMauleMan)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2010, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-the-first-step-in-negotiating-is-not-bend-over/559518/45 "2010-11-05T21:00:45Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > No, what I opened your eyes to is that he said exactly what I said he said, and which you characterized as “completely ridiculous” He’s easily the most partisan president in my 30+ year voting lifetime. The complete antithesis of the “coming together across the aisle” hope and change stuff of the 2008 campaign. The only one that could be worse is Jimmy Carter, and that is only _after_ Carter left office and found it charming to hurl insults at sitting American Presidents. Hell, I don’t even have a TV and I heard 3 of the 4 cites that Sam Stone posted above, just by catching snippets of CNN walking through airports or in the background of a pub somewhere. ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2010, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-the-first-step-in-negotiating-is-not-bend-over/559518/46 "2010-11-05T21:05:54Z")
> [@IdahoMauleMan](#): > > He’s easily the most partisan president in my 30+ year voting lifetime. The complete antithesis of the “coming together across the aisle” hope and change stuff of the 2008 campaign. > > The only one that could be worse is Jimmy Carter, and that is only _after_ Carter left office and found it charming to hurl insults at sitting American Presidents. > > Hell, I don’t even have a TV and I heard 3 of the 4 cites that Sam Stone posted above, just by catching snippets of CNN walking through airports or in the background of a pub somewhere. Hilarity! ---
**Author:** ![yorick73](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/b5a626/32.png) [@yorick73](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yorick73)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2010, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-the-first-step-in-negotiating-is-not-bend-over/559518/47 "2010-11-05T21:10:11Z")
> [@Buy\_All\_Means](#): > > Then why make the post in the first place? Because I assumed that people would have an idea of what I was referring to without getting into a separate debate on every one of the issues. Obviously those things that the Left likes the Right dislikes…and vice versa. Certainly you read the posts that led to my original comment? This should be common sense. ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2010, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-the-first-step-in-negotiating-is-not-bend-over/559518/48 "2010-11-05T21:17:16Z")
> [@yorick73](#): > > Because I assumed that people would have an idea of what I was referring to without getting into a separate debate on every one of the issues. Obviously those things that the Left likes the Right dislikes…and vice versa. Certainly you read the posts that led to my original comment? This should be common sense. Humor me with a couple of consequences we have suffered with. ---
**Author:** ![Buy\_All\_Means](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7ea924/32.png) [@Buy\_All\_Means](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buy_All_Means)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2010, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-the-first-step-in-negotiating-is-not-bend-over/559518/49 "2010-11-05T21:18:10Z")
> [@yorick73](#): > > Because I assumed that people would have an idea of what I was referring to without getting into a separate debate on every one of the issues. Obviously those things that the Left likes the Right dislikes…and vice versa. Certainly you read the posts that led to my original comment? This should be common sense. The SDMB is my cite? I like it. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2010, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-the-first-step-in-negotiating-is-not-bend-over/559518/50 "2010-11-05T21:23:35Z")
> [@yorick73](#): > > Nope. They voted to decrease the size of government. Somehow I doubt they’ll get that, either. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2010, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-the-first-step-in-negotiating-is-not-bend-over/559518/51 "2010-11-05T21:35:56Z")
Here, I’ll play: 1. A 2,000 page health care bill filled with regulations that are poorly understood, but which impose all kinds of costs and burdens on business. An additional trillion dollars in costs at least. 2. A financial regulation package that is 2,300 pages long, and contains all sorts of potential business costs that won’t be fully understood until the regulatory bureaucracy writes the rules. 3. A budget spiraling out of control, made worse by 300 billion dollars in increases to the discretionary budget and an 870 billion dollar stimulus package. 4. Regulatory agencies filled with left-wing activists who keep promising to ‘re-regulate’ the American economy. For example, the EPA ruling to make CO2 a pollutant and the ‘lead in toys’ act wiping out 200 million dollars in assets held by small used goods shops and thrift stores. 5. The looming potential of cap and trade legislation, and the looming potential for card-check - both of which would impose huge new costs on American business. 6. The almost complete lack of effort around securing new trade agreements and partners, and in fact this administration’s ham-fisted foreign policy that keeps pissing off allies and trading partners. 7. Constant anti-business rhetoric from the government. 8. The constant introduction of new moral hazards as the Democrats keep proposing radical ‘fixes’ to the economy such as putting a moratorium on foreclosures, allowing government arbitrators to write down the principle value of mortgages without the approval of the banks, the scrapping of legal obligations to shareholders in favor of the unions in the auto bailouts, etc. 9. Constantly distorting the market with misguided attempts at stimulus such as the ‘Cash for Clunkers’ program and the home mortgage deduction. 10. Democrats refusing to pass a budget before the election for partisan reasons, making it harder for anyone who relies on government contracts to plan their businesses. 11. The fed devaluing the dollar with quantitative easing, punishing importers and savers and distorting prices. All of this has the effect of eroding business confidence, stifling entrepreneurship, raising uncertainty and risk, and in general making it harder to do business in America. This is not just my supposition. Poll after poll for the past two years has shown that the #1 concern of American businessmen is uncertainty, primarily uncertainty about the regulatory and tax structure they are going to have to live with in the future. They can’t write business plans, so they’re sitting on their capital. ---
**Author:** ![yorick73](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/b5a626/32.png) [@yorick73](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yorick73)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2010, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-the-first-step-in-negotiating-is-not-bend-over/559518/52 "2010-11-05T21:58:11Z")
> [@Buy\_All\_Means](#): > > The SDMB is my cite? I like it. Sigh… ---
**Author:** ![yorick73](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/b5a626/32.png) [@yorick73](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yorick73)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2010, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-the-first-step-in-negotiating-is-not-bend-over/559518/53 "2010-11-05T21:59:51Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Somehow I doubt they’ll get that, either. Of course they won’t. The number one goal of a politician is to stay in power. That means being perceived as doing good…which usually means setting up “programs” and generally spending money. ---
**Author:** ![yorick73](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/b5a626/32.png) [@yorick73](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yorick73)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2010, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-the-first-step-in-negotiating-is-not-bend-over/559518/54 "2010-11-05T22:01:40Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > Here, I’ll play: C’mon **Sam** …try to avoid the bait. ---
**Author:** ![interface2x](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c0e974/32.png) [@interface2x](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/interface2x)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2010, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-the-first-step-in-negotiating-is-not-bend-over/559518/55 "2010-11-05T22:54:24Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > No spinning required:[Cite for 2 and 3](http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/10/25/obama-tells-republicans-sit/): > [@](#): > > Obama Tells Republicans to ‘Sit in Back’ > … > [Obama] said Republicans had driven the economy into a ditch and then stood by and criticized while Democrats pulled it out. Now that progress has been made, he said, “we can’t have special interests sitting shotgun. We gotta have middle class families up in front. We don’t mind the Republicans joining us. They can come for the ride, but they gotta sit in back.” Then why was it spun? “Back of the bus”? I don’t see anything about a bus. Since when do people sit “shotgun” on a bus? :dubious: [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-the-first-step-in-negotiating-is-not-bend-over/559518.md?page=2)