# President Obama warns of progressive "purity" and "circular firing squads" **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [April 17, 2019, 6:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-warns-of-progressive-purity-and-circular-firing-squads/832662 "2019-04-17T06:04:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-warns-of-progressive-purity-and-circular-firing-squads/832662/281 "2019-07-30T16:04:19Z")
I am always interested in discussion, including in the Pit. But you know that. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-warns-of-progressive-purity-and-circular-firing-squads/832662/282 "2019-07-30T16:04:36Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > It ain’t so much that white liberals hate themselves, but that white liberals are likely to less likely to give a shit that another candidate is not white. It’s very liberating, I’m an advocate! No doubt not giving a shit about candidate color is liberating. I know I don’t care about it. However, feeling either more or less warm to a group not your own strikes me as ridiculous when it is based on color. Color is a useful distraction from the real issue which is economic class. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-warns-of-progressive-purity-and-circular-firing-squads/832662/283 "2019-07-30T17:13:43Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > I am always interested in discussion, including in the Pit. But you know that. Not by that response. But it’s not a big deal. I do the sniping thing sometimes too – it can be fun! But when you snipe in response to a thoughtful attempt to answer a question, then you reduce the chance of actual discussion and exchange of ideas. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-warns-of-progressive-purity-and-circular-firing-squads/832662/284 "2019-07-30T17:15:08Z")
> [@Scumpup](#): > > No doubt not giving a shit about candidate color is liberating. I know I don’t care about it. However, feeling either more or less warm to a group not your own strikes me as ridiculous when it is based on color. Color is a useful distraction from the real issue which is economic class. The socio-cultural categorization of “race” is different than “color” – I think economic class is indeed a valid consideration in various circumstances, but so is race. Race is bullshit, but it’s a form of bullshit that needs to be considered, because it’s so powerful. IMO, of course. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-warns-of-progressive-purity-and-circular-firing-squads/832662/285 "2019-07-30T17:44:10Z")
That’s inherently incoherent. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-warns-of-progressive-purity-and-circular-firing-squads/832662/286 "2019-07-30T17:47:41Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > That’s inherently incoherent. Interesting discussion! Thanks for such a thoughtful contribution. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-warns-of-progressive-purity-and-circular-firing-squads/832662/287 "2019-07-30T18:02:17Z")
Do I really need to spell out why? ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-warns-of-progressive-purity-and-circular-firing-squads/832662/288 "2019-07-30T18:32:10Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Very interesting piece from political scientist Zach Goldberg: > \ > it is politically hobbling for Democrats, I guarantee you that much. How will this hobbling effect work? Could you fill in step 3 below? 1. White liberals regard nonwhites more favorably than they regard whites. 2. A political scientist observes this phenomenon and writes a paper about it. 3. ??? 4. [del]Profit![/del] Democrats are politically hobbled! ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-warns-of-progressive-purity-and-circular-firing-squads/832662/289 "2019-07-30T18:33:21Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > It’s a Jewish magazine. Goldberg, iceberg, what’s the difference? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-warns-of-progressive-purity-and-circular-firing-squads/832662/290 "2019-07-30T18:42:48Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Do I really need to spell out why? Well, the thing is that saying _“Race is bullshit, but it’s a form of bullshit that needs to be considered, because it’s so powerful”_ is **not** inherently incoherent. IAN **iiandyiiii** and cannot speak for him, but it looked pretty clear to me that he was making a valid point which could be more cumbersomely expressed something like this: \*\*Racial categories are a social construct based partly on superficial phenotypic differences between human populations, partly on linguistic and sociocultural differences between ethnic/cultural groups, and partly on plain old ignorance and prejudice. Racial identity of individuals is not a reliable guide to their genetic relatedness. And there is so far no scientific confirmation of various hypotheses that measured average differences between members of different racial categories in a number of extremely complex characteristics, such as intelligence, athletic ability, proficiency at spelling, etc., are due wholly or partly to genetic differences. Therefore, trying to deduce an individual’s fundamental characteristics or abilities from their racial identity is unscientific bullshit. However, racial identity is an important aspect of modern human society, and many people regard their racial identity as an important part of who they are, just as they may regard their national, gender, ethnic, regional, etc. identity as an important part of who they are. Also, our society (especially in the US) has historically been largely shaped, and is still profoundly influenced, by far-reaching beliefs and laws concerning the racial classification of individuals. Therefore, social attitudes about race are a powerful influence in society and can’t simply be dismissed as bullshit.\*\* That position may be somewhat complicated and nuanced, but there’s nothing “inherently incoherent” about it. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-warns-of-progressive-purity-and-circular-firing-squads/832662/291 "2019-07-30T18:43:15Z")
Probably: 3) white people notice liberal Democrats scoff at their concerns and decide not to vote Dem. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-warns-of-progressive-purity-and-circular-firing-squads/832662/292 "2019-07-30T18:49:29Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > How will this hobbling effect work? Could you fill in step 3 below? > > 1. White liberals regard nonwhites more favorably than they regard whites. > 2. A political scientist observes this phenomenon and writes a paper about it. > 3. ??? > 4. [del]Profit![/del] Democrats are politically hobbled! I disagree with your premise. There is no step 3, in fact there is no step 2. The paper is just describing something, not participating in it. 1 leads to 4, because white liberals’ obsequious flagellation of their own ethnic group is a huge turnoff to the white moderates we desperately need. ---
**Author:** ![Airbeck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/airbeck/32/6574_2.png) [@Airbeck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airbeck)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-warns-of-progressive-purity-and-circular-firing-squads/832662/293 "2019-07-30T18:49:38Z")
White people who are concerned that government isn’t concerned enough with white people’s concerns are called Republicans. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-warns-of-progressive-purity-and-circular-firing-squads/832662/294 "2019-07-30T18:50:59Z")
> [@Airbeck](#): > > White people who are concerned that government isn’t concerned enough with white people’s concerns are called Republicans. Nope. Or if true, we have no chance to win national elections. ---
**Author:** ![Airbeck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/airbeck/32/6574_2.png) [@Airbeck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airbeck)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-warns-of-progressive-purity-and-circular-firing-squads/832662/295 "2019-07-30T18:52:41Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Nope. Or if true, we have no chance to win national elections. So Democrats have to pretend to be Republicans to win? At what point can we put everyone’s concerns over just white people’s concerns? Never? ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-warns-of-progressive-purity-and-circular-firing-squads/832662/296 "2019-07-30T18:59:46Z")
Whites shifted from voting R to D in 2018: [2018 exit polls show greater white Democratic support](https://www.brookings.edu/blog/the-avenue/2018/11/08/2018-exit-polls-show-greater-white-support-for-democrats/) They can shift back. [https://thehill.com/hilltv/what-americas-thinking/433270-poll-republicans-and-democrats-differ-strongly-on-whether-white](https://thehill.com/hilltv/what-americas-thinking/433270-poll-republicans-and-democrats-differ-strongly-on-whether-white) > [@](#): > > A significant majority of Republican voters, 75 percent, said that white Americans are subject to discrimination. Most independents, 55 percent, agreed. > Democrats differed strongly with only 38 percent saying that whites faced discrimination. Sixty-two percent of Democratic respondents said that European-Americans face almost no discrimination or none whatsoever. > Overall, 55 percent of respondents said that white people must deal with societal bias. White voters were much more likely than Hispanic or black respondents to agree. Sixty-two percent of white respondents said that European Americans experience discrimination while 38 percent said they face none or almost none. “Only” 38 percent. That’s a big chunk! Good luck winning without them (us). And that 38 percent is of all Democrats. I’d bet it’s close to a majority of white Dems. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-warns-of-progressive-purity-and-circular-firing-squads/832662/297 "2019-07-30T19:35:22Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > I disagree with your premise. There is no step 3 > [@](#): > > 1 leads to 4, because white liberals’ obsequious flagellation of their own ethnic group is a huge turnoff to the white moderates we desperately need. Um, this IS your step 3. _Jeez_. Now, you’re the one who’s turning “white liberals were more favorable toward nonwhites” into “white liberals’ obsequious flagellation of their own ethnic group.” These two things are not equivalent. Treating them as such to argue your point is unadulterated bullshit. Oh, and incidentally: > [@](#): > > , in fact there is no step 2. The paper is just describing something, not participating in it. ‘observes’ doesn’t imply participation. And how the hell do you describe something that you haven’t observed by some means? ETA: Observation is what scientists DO. No observation = no data. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-warns-of-progressive-purity-and-circular-firing-squads/832662/298 "2019-07-30T19:37:00Z")
Making it a “step” implies participation. What I am talking about is bad for Democrats whether this paper exists or not. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-warns-of-progressive-purity-and-circular-firing-squads/832662/299 "2019-07-30T19:46:51Z")
And again, if you are in the 62%, you may find it galling to share the party with us 38 percenters. But purging us leaves you with a few House seats, very few Senate seats or governorships, and certainly no presidents, ever. Would that really not be too great a price to pay for moral purity? ---
**Author:** ![Airbeck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/airbeck/32/6574_2.png) [@Airbeck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airbeck)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2019, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-warns-of-progressive-purity-and-circular-firing-squads/832662/300 "2019-07-30T19:50:16Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Whites shifted from voting R to D in 2018: [2018 exit polls show greater white Democratic support](https://www.brookings.edu/blog/the-avenue/2018/11/08/2018-exit-polls-show-greater-white-support-for-democrats/) > > They can shift back. > [https://thehill.com/hilltv/what-americas-thinking/433270-poll-republicans-and-democrats-differ-strongly-on-whether-white](https://thehill.com/hilltv/what-americas-thinking/433270-poll-republicans-and-democrats-differ-strongly-on-whether-white) > > “Only” 38 percent. That’s a big chunk! Good luck winning without them (us). And that 38 percent is of all Democrats. I’d bet it’s close to a majority of white Dems. So you think the best thing to do is for both parties to cater only to white people? I’m really not understanding what it is that you want the Democrats to actually do? Pander to white nationalists like Trump? If not that, then what? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-warns-of-progressive-purity-and-circular-firing-squads/832662.md?page=14) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-obama-warns-of-progressive-purity-and-circular-firing-squads/832662.md?page=16)