# President of the US **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [January 14, 2010, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-of-the-us/524987 "2010-01-14T21:01:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-of-the-us/524987/21 "2010-01-14T22:00:47Z")
> [@Mk\_VII](#): > > They make sure the Prez and the Veep aren’t ever on the same plane. Are you sure? I seem to recall Bush & Cheney in the same room during the State of the Union speeches… ---
**Author:** ![Hello\_Again](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/85e7bf/32.png) [@Hello\_Again](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hello_Again)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-of-the-us/524987/22 "2010-01-14T22:02:29Z")
> [@mil0](#): > > Now, indulge me further and let’s pretend he wasn’t caught until after he was sworn in. In this outlandish scenario of mine, after his plot was discovered and he was convicted, would the new VP, (or more likely from what I understand the President pro tem) be raised to being a POTUS or would the original line of succession still be in effect? > > Would the office of president go to Timothy Geithner’s new VP, Robert Gates or Daniel Inouye(or maybe someone else)? Other than the Vice President, a sucessor does not become the President. They become acting President and a new President (and vice President) must be elected. ---
**Author:** ![SmellMyWort](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea5d25/32.png) [@SmellMyWort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmellMyWort)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-of-the-us/524987/23 "2010-01-14T22:12:42Z")
> [@mlees](#): > > Are you sure? > > I seem to recall Bush & Cheney in the same room during the State of the Union speeches… Were they on a PLANE? ---
**Author:** ![copperwindow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4af34b/32.png) [@copperwindow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/copperwindow)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-of-the-us/524987/24 "2010-01-14T22:22:44Z")
> [@TerpBE](#): > > In order: > > # Office Current Officer > > 1 Vice President Joe Biden > 2 Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi > 3 President pro tempore of the Senate Robert Byrd > 4 Secretary of State Hillary Clinton > 5 Secretary of the Treasury Timothy Geithner > 6 Secretary of Defense Robert Gates[2] > 7 Attorney General Eric Holder > 8 Secretary of the Interior Ken Salazar > 9 Secretary of Agriculture Tom Vilsack > 10 Secretary of Commerce Gary Locke > 11 Secretary of Labor Hilda Solis > 12 Secretary of Health and Human Services Kathleen Sebelius > 13 Secretary of Housing and Urban Development Shaun Donovan > 14 Secretary of Transportation Ray LaHood > 15 Secretary of Energy Steven Chu > 16 Secretary of Education Arne Duncan > 17 Secretary of Veterans Affairs Eric Shinseki > 18 Secretary of Homeland Security Janet Napolitano Does everyone in this order need to be 35 or older and born in the US? ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-of-the-us/524987/25 "2010-01-14T22:24:36Z")
> [@Hello\_Again](#): > > Other than the Vice President, a sucessor does not become the President. They become acting President and a new President (and vice President) must be elected. This is incorrect. Please provide a cite to an amendment or legislation that says this. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-of-the-us/524987/26 "2010-01-14T22:26:12Z")
> [@copperwindow](#): > > Does everyone in this order need to be 35 or older and born in the US? To hold a Cabinet position, no. To be able to succeed to the Presidency, yes. If a given Cabinet member (e.g. Madelaine Albright) does not meet the requirements, he or she is passed over. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-of-the-us/524987/27 "2010-01-14T22:27:10Z")
> [@Hello\_Again](#): > > Other than the Vice President, a sucessor does not become the President. They become acting President and a new President (and vice President) must be elected. Cite? You may be right but I seem to recall otherwise. So I’m asking for authoritative evidence backing your statement. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-of-the-us/524987/28 "2010-01-14T22:31:18Z")
> [@Hello\_Again](#): > > Other than the Vice President, a sucessor does not become the President. They become acting President and a new President (and vice President) must be elected. I think you’re confusing succession with the acting presidency established by the 25th Amendment, and famously used by George Bush and Dick Cheney on certain brief occasions. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-of-the-us/524987/29 "2010-01-14T22:34:14Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > To hold a Cabinet position, no. To be able to succeed to the Presidency, yes. If a given Cabinet member (e.g. Madelaine Albright) does not meet the requirements, he or she is passed over. The answer I was going to give. By the way, the President need not be “born in the United States” – he must be a natural-born citizen. For example, Mitt Romney’s father was a contender for the Republican nomination in 1960, and was born in Mexico to American missionary parents, and John McCain was famously born in a military hospital adjacent to the Canal Zone to American parents. If a given Secretary does not qualify for President, he is skipped over in the order of succession. (I believe I read that there are three people on the Obama cabinet who don’t qualify for one reason or another.) ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-of-the-us/524987/30 "2010-01-14T23:11:39Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > This is incorrect. Please provide a cite to an amendment or legislation that says this. Actually, it may be correct. I didn’t believe it either but a search turns up this: > [@](#): > > While none of these officers would succeed to the presidency as would a Vice President, the provisions of the Presidential Succession Act of 1947, now codified in Title 3, Chapter 1, Section 19 of the United States Code, create a line of succession that allows the Speaker of the House, the President pro tempore of the Senate, and Cabinet officers, to serve as Acting President in the case of removal, resignation, death or inability of both the President and Vice President, and also in the case of failure to qualify of both a President-elect and a Vice President-elect. > **[Acting President of the United States](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acting_President_of_the_United_States#25th_Amendment)** > > An acting president of the United States is a person who lawfully exercises the powers and duties of the president of the United States despite not holding the office in their own right. There is an established presidential line of succession in which officials of the United States federal government may be called upon to be acting president if the incumbent president becomes incapacitated, dies, resigns, or is removed from office (by impeachment by the House of Representatives and subsequent... ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-of-the-us/524987/31 "2010-01-14T23:12:39Z")
> [@Pleonast](#): > > Don’t you mean a “cabinet member in the line of succession”? Yes, of course. What I was trying and failing to say was that the designated survivor had to be a cabinet member who was eligible to become President. So Madeline Albright wouldn’t be chosen ever because she wasn’t born in the U.S. > [@SmellMyWort](#): > > Were they on a PLANE? [Insert snake joke] ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2010, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-of-the-us/524987/32 "2010-01-15T00:10:06Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > Actually, it may be correct. I didn’t believe it either but a search turns up this: The person would be Acting President, but there wouldn’t have to be a new election. The person would be Acting President until the term was over. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2010, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-of-the-us/524987/33 "2010-01-15T00:15:31Z")
> [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > The person would be Acting President, but there wouldn’t have to be a new election. The person would be Acting President until the term was over. Yes, I forgot to mention that I disagreed with the second part of the statement, but I thought people were objecting to the first part. ---
**Author:** ![MikeS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/919ad9/32.png) [@MikeS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MikeS)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2010, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-of-the-us/524987/34 "2010-01-15T00:58:45Z")
> [@mil0](#): > > The person who committed this egregious crime would be none other than Mister Timothy Geithner. > > Now, indulge me further and let’s pretend he wasn’t caught until after he was sworn in. In this outlandish scenario of mine, after his plot was discovered and he was convicted, would the new VP, (or more likely from what I understand the President pro tem) be raised to being a POTUS or would the original line of succession still be in effect? > > Would the office of president go to Timothy Geithner’s new VP, Robert Gates or Daniel Inouye(or maybe someone else)? The more likely scenario is that the House would impeach Geithner. If Geithner’s VP was found to be in on the plot, he’d be impeached too, at which time the newly elected Speaker of the House (since the remainder of the House is still alive in your scenario) would assume the presidency. Criminal proceedings for Geithner (and his veep, if necessary) in the Senate would come later. ETA: Crap, forgot: the House impeaches, the Senate convicts. I suppose that gives the new speaker a perverse incentive to proceed with the veep’s impeachment even if the evidence is tenuous. ---
**Author:** ![John\_DiFool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_difool/32/19543_2.png) [@John\_DiFool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_DiFool)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2010, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-of-the-us/524987/35 "2010-01-15T01:07:13Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > Sure, but what if they were all on the same doomed flight together. Then what? Huh? Or a world premiere of a film about a famous war hero. Off-topic question which has always bugged me: it seems like the Senate Majority Leader seems to play a similar, if not identical, role to that of the Speaker of the House, but shouldn’t the President Pro-Tempore be fulfilling that role instead? Is it because Byrd has been sick all year? The Majority Leader isn’t on the list posted here. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2010, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-of-the-us/524987/36 "2010-01-15T01:18:56Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > Yes, I forgot to mention that I disagreed with the second part of the statement, but I thought people were objecting to the first part. I was mainly objecting to the second part. I am not aware of any provision for a presidential election other than at the standard intervals of four years. Anyone succeeding to the office, whether “acting” or not, would serve out the remaining part of the original term. ---
**Author:** ![not\_alice](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/not_alice/32/7283_2.png) [@not\_alice](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/not_alice)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2010, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-of-the-us/524987/37 "2010-01-15T01:20:17Z")
> [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > The person would be Acting President, but there wouldn’t have to be a new election. The person would be Acting President until the term was over. Where does the Constitution define the office of “Acting President”, or allow the office of President to go unfilled? ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2010, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-of-the-us/524987/38 "2010-01-15T01:23:19Z")
Law professor Akhil Amar has argued that there are serious constitutional concerns about the inclusion of members of congress in the line of succession. The Constitution specifies that successors must be “officers,” which arguably reaches only the executive branch. On the other hand, The Speaker and the president pro tem were included in the original Succession Act of 1792 (indeed, I believe they were the only named successors). > [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > The person would be Acting President, but there wouldn’t have to be a new election. The person would be Acting President until the term was over. If I remember correctly the 1947 Act does not use the term “Acting President” but rather says that a successor “acts as President.” ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2010, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-of-the-us/524987/39 "2010-01-15T01:37:59Z")
> [@John\_DiFool](#): > > …Off-topic question which has always bugged me: it seems like the Senate Majority Leader seems to play a similar, if not identical, role to that of the Speaker of the House, but shouldn’t the President Pro-Tempore be fulfilling that role instead? Is it because Byrd has been sick all year? The Majority Leader isn’t on the list posted here. The President _pro tempore_ is basically a ceromonial role filled by the most senior member of the majority party. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2010, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-of-the-us/524987/40 "2010-01-15T01:48:55Z")
> [@not\_alice](#): > > Where does the Constitution define the office of “Acting President”, or allow the office of President to go unfilled? Not the Constitution, but US Federal Law - [http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/3/19.html](http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/3/19.html) > [@](#): > > (c) An individual acting as President under subsection (a) or subsection (b) of this section shall continue to act until the expiration of the then current Presidential term, except that— [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-of-the-us/524987.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/president-of-the-us/524987.md?page=3)