# presidential debates-who should be invited **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 23, 2007, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-debates-who-should-be-invited/393383 "2007-02-23T15:28:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2007, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-debates-who-should-be-invited/393383/1 "2007-02-23T15:28:31Z")
I am old enough to remember when the debates includes third and fourth parties. In the last few years they refused to invite others because they either had to get a certain percentage of votes or raise enough money. This exclusionary policy helps maintain the 2 party system In the old days a Green Party candidate could reveal his policies and show if they were really are nutzoid. The Commies could show their vision and reveal what is wrong with them The Libertarians could publically show how petty and greedy they are. Nader could lecture the Dems and Repubs and show how greedy and libertarian they are becoming. Iam kidding a little but what harm would there be in these parties showing themselves warts and all? All the innovative polcies come from 3rd parties anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2007, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-debates-who-should-be-invited/393383/2 "2007-02-23T15:36:56Z")
Well, I’m old enough to remember that too, and I’m not that old. Perot was in the debates in '92. But other than Perot, who debated Bush and Clinton, and Anderson, who debated Reagan (Carter refused to participate in a debate with Anderson), what third party candidates are you talking about? Nine elections have had presidential debates (1960, 1976, 1980, 1984, 1988, 1992, 1996, 2000, 2004), and of those nine elections, the two in which there were a significant third party candidate had that candidate participate. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2007, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-debates-who-should-be-invited/393383/3 "2007-02-23T16:22:07Z")
Nader participated . The Greens did too. I remember the Commies in too. Perot was there because he was rich and powerful. Since he is gone so did his party disappear from debates. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2007, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-debates-who-should-be-invited/393383/4 "2007-02-23T16:35:12Z")
[QUOTE=gonzomax] Nader participated . The Greens did too. I remember the Commies in too. Perot was there because he was rich and powerful. Since he is gone so did his party disappear from debates. [/QUOTE] Neither Ralph Nader nor the Communist candidate for President ever participated in a presidential debate. In fact, in 2000, Nader’s lack of an invitation to the debates was major news, and he sued the Commission on Presidential Debates over it. ---
**Author:** ![vetbridge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b5e925/32.png) [@vetbridge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vetbridge)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2007, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-debates-who-should-be-invited/393383/5 "2007-02-23T16:37:35Z")
As someone who votes for more Libertarian candidates than Dems or Repubs, I would like to see them involved in any debate. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2007, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-debates-who-should-be-invited/393383/6 "2007-02-23T16:38:53Z")
[QUOTE=Captain Amazing] Neither Ralph Nader nor the Communist candidate for President ever participated in a presidential debate. In fact, in 2000, Nader’s lack of an invitation to the debates was major news, and he sued the Commission on Presidential Debates over it. [/QUOTE] Was not referring to 2000. From 1976 to 1984 he debates were controlled by the League of Women Voters. In 84 the 2 parties took it over and eliminated anyone who did not get 15 % of the vote . They have stopped anyone else from getting in. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2007, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-debates-who-should-be-invited/393383/7 "2007-02-23T16:40:10Z")
[QUOTE=gonzomax] Nader participated . The Greens did too. I remember the Commies in too. Perot was there because he was rich and powerful. Since he is gone so did his party disappear from debates. [/QUOTE] Nader was the Green, and both he and Buchanan (Perot’s Reform Party) were [excluded](http://cnnstudentnews.cnn.com/2000/fyi/news/10/03/debate.omissions/index.html) from the 2000 presidential debates. > [@](#): > > The Commission on Presidential Debates, set up by Democrats and Republicans to manage the debate process, excluded Nader and other third-party candidates last Tuesday. The commission said that such candidates, to qualify, would have to be on the ballot in enough states to have a theoretical chance of winning the election and show around 15 percent support in national public opinion surveys. Nader recently had about 5 percent in the polls, and Buchanan about 1 percent. I, for one, certainly do not recall any Communist candidate participating in a presidential debate. Can you cite that? > [@Captain Amazing](#): > > Nine elections have had presidential debates (1960, 1976, 1980, 1984, 1988, 1992, 1996, 2000, 2004), and of those nine elections, the two in which there were a significant third party candidate had that candidate participate. Shame about '68, really. Nixon and Humphrey and Wallace all on the same stage would have made for quite a debate. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2007, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-debates-who-should-be-invited/393383/8 "2007-02-23T16:42:22Z")
[QUOTE=gonzomax] Was not referring to 2000. From 1976 to 1984 he debates were controlled by the League of Women Voters. [/QUOTE] So fine - cite when Ralph Nader, or a member of the Green Party, or a member of the Communist Party participated in a presidential debate in 1976, 1980, or 1984. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2007, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-debates-who-should-be-invited/393383/9 "2007-02-23T16:46:24Z")
[QUOTE=gonzomax] Was not referring to 2000. From 1976 to 1984 he debates were controlled by the League of Women Voters. In 84 the 2 parties took it over and eliminated anyone who did not get 15 % of the vote . They have stopped anyone else from getting in. [/QUOTE] Right, but even from 1976 to 1984, the only minor candidate who ever participated in any of the presidential debates was Anderson, who, early on, was polling at about 20%, and as the voice of liberal Republicanism, did appeal to a wide variety of the voters. And, **Frank** , you’re right. A Nixon, Humphrey, Wallace debate would certainly have been interesting, at least. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2007, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-debates-who-should-be-invited/393383/10 "2007-02-23T16:48:01Z")
It may be I am remembering the debates on PBS. They include many more. I was sure Nader was in at least one. But ,the question remains. How many more and who.? ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2007, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-debates-who-should-be-invited/393383/11 "2007-02-23T16:51:22Z")
[QUOTE=gonzomax] How many more and who.? [/QUOTE] Well, it’s pointless to allow every Tom, Dick, and Harry who runs for president to participate. Though I’d set the bar lower than 15%, I don’t think the commission is that far off. Be on the ballot in enough states to win the Electoral College, and be polling about, oh, say, 5%. I think that would be fine. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2007, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-debates-who-should-be-invited/393383/12 "2007-02-23T17:00:57Z")
Why? I think the present format is too agreeable. By the way Dean debated Nader on PBS. The present system entrenches the 2 party system. I believe they should be opened to show alternatives the 2 party system stifles. Big ideas start small. The Greens will have very strong arguments this time around. Nader always shows the contradictions in the parties. The parties have a right to the selection process for the questioners. They simply have too much ability to set the debates up to support themselves. It needs to be opened. What are we afraid of.? Learning something. ---
**Author:** ![Stonebow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ed8c4c/32.png) [@Stonebow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stonebow)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2007, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-debates-who-should-be-invited/393383/13 "2007-02-23T17:01:12Z")
I’m very concerned about what threshold would be involved for participation. What makes someone a ‘serious’ candidate? Do the Green and Libertarian parties have permanent seats at the table? How about the Reform Party? Constitution party? Communists? You have exclude someone. How would you decide? Also, assuming the debates are being hosted by a third party (as they are now), do you use force of law to force the inclusion of other candidates? ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2007, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-debates-who-should-be-invited/393383/14 "2007-02-23T17:41:26Z")
Why do they have to be that serious. The other parties may present useful alternatives. It is not always about winning but growing and learning. I would open it up to all. If they are crazy they will reveal themselves. That will damage and perhaps eliminate them. Public ridicule is a big fear. Ask Dean. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2007, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-debates-who-should-be-invited/393383/15 "2007-02-23T17:41:52Z")
[QUOTE=Frank] Well, it’s pointless to allow every Tom, Dick, and Harry who runs for president to participate. Though I’d set the bar lower than 15%, I don’t think the commission is that far off. Be on the ballot in enough states to win the Electoral College, and be polling about, oh, say, 5%. I think that would be fine. [/QUOTE] I wouldn’t use polls at all – they’re too elastic (Whose poll? Taken when?) to be a meaningful standard. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2007, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-debates-who-should-be-invited/393383/16 "2007-02-23T17:56:42Z")
[QUOTE=Steve MB] I wouldn’t use polls at all – they’re too elastic (Whose poll? Taken when?) to be a meaningful standard. [/QUOTE] OK, I’m convinced. I’m willing to drop that. Well, then, I’d say let anyone in who is on the ballot in enough states to have at least a theoretical chance of winning. That probably lets in the Greens, Libertarians, and Prohibitionists; other parties would get in now and then, but probably not so many that the events would turn into a zoo. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2007, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-debates-who-should-be-invited/393383/17 "2007-02-23T18:00:00Z")
[QUOTE=gonzomax] Why do they have to be that serious. The other parties may present useful alternatives. It is not always about winning but growing and learning. I would open it up to all. If they are crazy they will reveal themselves. That will damage and perhaps eliminate them. Public ridicule is a big fear. Ask Dean. [/QUOTE] Well, presidential debates are about winning. The candidates are explaining to the public why it should vote for them and not the other guys. The purpose of a debate isn’t to give every crackpot and fringe party the opportunity to make their views known. ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2007, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-debates-who-should-be-invited/393383/18 "2007-02-23T18:15:27Z")
Televised debates are typically time constrained. The more candidates you have, the less time each individual candidate will have allotted to them, potentially diluting the message of all. With too many candidates, this would reduce the “debates” to being short, unsupported sound bites designed to be memorable, not substantive. However, I think more than two candidates can be afforded time… Maybe they can set up more than a few televised debates. (Say, once a month?) Then, as time draws closer to the elections (Primary and General), the field becomes more and more narrowed to the top 3 or 4 candidates based on polling of likely voters. I dunno. Thoughts? The candidates that suffer from abysmal polling/ratings can still buy time on public access/PBS, for those that are interested in hearing them. Why don’t they do that now? ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2007, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-debates-who-should-be-invited/393383/19 "2007-02-23T18:18:14Z")
Why is that? Debates are about information and comparison purposes. Not about winning at all. That is where we are supposed to get our information. They will not only present their ideas but show what they are like under some pressure. The debates have evolved into something different. They now have a theme so the debaters can study and prepare. They are turning worthless. They should be open to all participants and they could be whittled away by internet or phone voting. Or not at all. Let them go at it with no warning of topic and a much longer period of time. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2007, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-debates-who-should-be-invited/393383/20 "2007-02-23T18:49:16Z")
[QUOTE=mlees] The candidates that suffer from abysmal polling/ratings can still buy time on public access/PBS, for those that are interested in hearing them. Why don’t they do that now? [/QUOTE] Because the minor party candidates that suffer from abysmal poll numbers don’t have much in the way of money to buy advertising. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-debates-who-should-be-invited/393383.md?page=2)