# presidential succession -- how does it work **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 30, 2000, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-succession-how-does-it-work/24178 "2000-06-30T16:38:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![vandal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/858c86/32.png) [@vandal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vandal)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2000, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-succession-how-does-it-work/24178/1 "2000-06-30T16:38:35Z")
Okay, so if the president dies or somehow becomes incapicated to the point that he can no longer perform his duties as president, the vice president will, of course, take over. But what I’m wondering is, do all the cabinet positions move up one notch after the V.P.? Because after the V.P., the Speaker of the House takes over, then the President pro tempore of the Senate, the Secretary of State, etc. So, when the V.P. takes over the presidency, does the Speaker of the House become his V.P.? Or does he get to choose his own V.P.? ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2000, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-succession-how-does-it-work/24178/2 "2000-06-30T16:45:02Z")
He appoints his own V.P. ---
**Author:** ![BobT](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8e8cbc/32.png) [@BobT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobT)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2000, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-succession-how-does-it-work/24178/3 "2000-06-30T16:46:29Z")
If there ever is vacancy in the office of VP, the president chooses a replacement, subject to confirmation of both houses of Congress. All of the other people in line to be President are spelled out in case of some disaster that wipes out several members of government at once. ---
**Author:** ![Iolanthe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/7bcc69/32.png) [@Iolanthe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Iolanthe)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2000, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-succession-how-does-it-work/24178/4 "2000-06-30T17:26:11Z")
> [@](#): > > \*\* > If there ever is vacancy in the office of VP, the president chooses a replacement, subject to confirmation of both houses of Congress. > \*\* Which is how we got Mr. Gerald Ford. Agnew resigned, Ford was appointed, then Nixon left. Ford never won an election. ---
**Author:** ![plnnr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7ea924/32.png) [@plnnr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/plnnr)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2000, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-succession-how-does-it-work/24178/5 "2000-06-30T17:39:16Z")
There was at least one instance (Chester Alan Arthur)where the US didn’t have a VP. The President Pro Tempore presided over the Senate and the VP office was left vacant. ---
**Author:** ![vandal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/858c86/32.png) [@vandal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vandal)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2000, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-succession-how-does-it-work/24178/6 "2000-06-30T17:50:03Z")
“_There was at least one instance (Chester Alan Arthur)where the US didn’t have a VP. The President Pro Tempore presided over the Senate and the VP office was left vacant._” Would this be allowed today? I mean, does a president **have** to choose a V.P.? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Corrado](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a88e4f/32.png) [@John\_Corrado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Corrado)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2000, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-succession-how-does-it-work/24178/7 "2000-06-30T18:08:04Z")
One of the Amendments to the Constitution (don’t remember which one; think it’s the Twenty Third; too lazy to look it up) lays out the exact order of succession of the Presidency, and _allows_ a President to choose a Vice-President by appointing one and having said appointment confirmed by the U.S. Senate. Said Amendment wasn’t ratified until 1967, so there were several periods of American History where there was no Vice-President (1812-1813, 1838-1831, 1841-1845, 1850-1852, 1865-1868, 1881-1885, 1901-1905, 1912-1913, 1923-1925, 1945-1949, 1963-1965). Legislatively, I don’t believe there is any _demand_ that the President choose a VP; politically, I think a President who didn’t decide to choose a VP would look bad- either indecisive in his unwillingness to make a choice, or weak in his ability to get Congress to approve of his choice. ---
**Author:** ![zev\_steinhardt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/97f17d/32.png) [@zev\_steinhardt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zev_steinhardt)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2000, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-succession-how-does-it-work/24178/8 "2000-06-30T18:12:52Z")
> [@](#): > > \*\* > There was at least one instance (Chester Alan Arthur)where the US didn’t have a VP. The President Pro Tempore presided over the Senate and the VP office was left vacant. > \*\* Until Nixon, there were no provisions for appointing a VP. Thus, when the president died and the VP took over, the office of VP \* remained vacant \* until the next election. Zev Steinhardt ---
**Author:** ![Indiana\_Jones](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/0ea827/32.png) [@Indiana\_Jones](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Indiana_Jones)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2000, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-succession-how-does-it-work/24178/9 "2000-06-30T19:45:42Z")
The amendment that allows the President ot appoint a Veep if the office is vacant is the 25th. The 23rd allows DC to vote for President. Also the amendement only spells out that the Veep becomes President. It does not provide for any further succession. The succession to the Speaker, President Pro tem, and the Cabinet was spelled out in an Act of Congress iin 1947, which has been amended several times when new cabinet posts were created. ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2000, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-succession-how-does-it-work/24178/10 "2000-06-30T19:48:48Z")
> [@](#): > > \*\* > too lazy to look it up > > Said Amendment wasn’t ratified until 1967, so there were several periods of American History where there was no Vice-President (1812-1813, 1838-1831, 1841-1845, 1850-1852, 1865-1868, 1881-1885, 1901-1905, 1912-1913, 1923-1925, 1945-1949, 1963-1965). > \*\* LOL! Then you just had all those dates right on the tip of your tongue, eh? ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2000, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-succession-how-does-it-work/24178/11 "2000-06-30T23:47:11Z")
> [@](#): > > \*\* > If there ever is vacancy in the office of VP, the president chooses a replacement, subject to confirmation of both houses of Congress. > > \*\* Eh? I thought VP’s and cabinet members only needed to be approved by the Senate. ---
**Author:** ![BobT](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8e8cbc/32.png) [@BobT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobT)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2000, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-succession-how-does-it-work/24178/12 "2000-07-01T00:03:07Z")
Nope, 25th Amendment requires the confirmation of any vice president by both houses of Congress. Technically only the vice president requires a confirmation. The other posts (like Cabinet positions) are subject only to the “advice and consent” of the Senate. ---
**Author:** ![brachyrhynchos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/brachyrhynchos/32/376_2.png) [@brachyrhynchos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brachyrhynchos)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2000, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-succession-how-does-it-work/24178/13 "2000-07-01T02:29:07Z")
Remember when Sec’t. of State Haig leapt over President pro tem, Speaker of the House, **and** the VP to announce that he “was in control here” after Reagan was shot? That lasted about a nanosecond, but it resulted in a lot of talk about succession. It also ultimately resulted in Haig getting the pink slip. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2000, 5:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/presidential-succession-how-does-it-work/24178/14 "2000-07-01T05:43:38Z")
We thrashed this issue out twice earlier this year: [Clinton’s Third Term](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=2594) [Can Clinton be President again?](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=13240) The 25th Amendment puts the Veep first in line of succession. If both the Prez and the Veep are knocked out, the succession is governed by a statute enacted by Congress, under a power given by Article II, section 1, para. 6 of the Constitution: “In case of the removal of the President from office, or of his death, resignation, or inability to discharge the powers and duties of the said office, the same shall devolve on the Vice President, and the Congress may by law provide for the case of removal, death, resignation or inability, both of the President and Vice President, declaring what officer shall then act as President, and such officer shall act accordingly, until the disability be removed, or a President shall be elected.” Under this power, Congress has enacted United States Code, [Title 3](http://www4.law.cornell.edu/uscode/3/19.html), Chapter 1, Section 19, which deals with this issue. Under that provision, if neither the President nor the Veep is able to act, the line of succession is: 1. Speaker of the House; 2. President pro tem of the Senate; 3. Secretary of State; 4. Secretary of the Treasury; 5. Secretary of Defense; 6. Attorney General; 7. Secretary of the Interior; 8. Secretary of Agriculture; 9. Secretary of Commerce; 10. Secretary of Labor; 11. Secretary of Health and Human Services; 12. Secretary of Housing and Urban Development; 13. Secretary of Transportation; 14. Secretary of Energy; 15. Secretary of Education; 16. Secretary of Veterans Affairs.