# Prince appreciation thread (RIP MJ, but \*Prince won\*) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [September 14, 2009, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-appreciation-thread-rip-mj-but-prince-won/510086 "2009-09-14T21:05:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2009, 5:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-appreciation-thread-rip-mj-but-prince-won/510086/41 "2009-09-16T05:51:30Z")
I rank Prince over Wonder because I don’t think Wonder had the genius of synthesis that Prince had: I think Wonder did what he did better than anyone in his generation, but I don’t get the feeling of paradigm shift from his music; of just sheer revolutionary invention like I do from Prince. Granted, Prince wouldn’t be Prince without George Clinton and Marc Bolan coming first, but the synthesis he wove out of those influences became something new, something other; a real leap forward. As far as L/McC, that’s a tough call. These lists/rankings cannot exclude personal taste. I just don’t feel the artistic power in their music that I feel in Prince’s greatest works. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2009, 7:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-appreciation-thread-rip-mj-but-prince-won/510086/42 "2009-09-16T07:32:46Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > His influence was widespread and permanent. Pop music is a markedly different animal due to Prince. And he has the best video of all time.🙂 You said the same thing about rock influence above. Did you mean pop as a subset of rock? whose music do you see influenced by Prince? ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2009, 8:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-appreciation-thread-rip-mj-but-prince-won/510086/43 "2009-09-16T08:06:27Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > And he has the best video of all time.🙂 > whose music do you see influenced by Prince? Well, to answer that question, there’s an [easy place to start](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Prince_prot%C3%A9g%C3%A9s): Apollonia 6 Dale Bozzio Tevin Campbell Ingrid Chavez Lisa Coleman Sheila E. Sheena Easton Carmen Electra The Family Anna Fantastic Flyte Tyme Nona Gaye Cat Glover Good Question Jill Jones Apollonia Kotero Eric Leeds Madhouse Martika Wendy Melvoin New Power Generation The Revolution Taja Sevelle Támar The Time Tony LeMans Bria Valente Vanity 6 Wendy & Lisa And of course that’s not counting [the Bangles](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manic_Monday), [Sinead O’Connor](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nothing_Compares_2_U), and so on . . . ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2009, 8:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-appreciation-thread-rip-mj-but-prince-won/510086/44 "2009-09-16T08:15:13Z")
And [TOM JONES!](http://www.youtube.com/watch?gl=US&v=Iw3so6ClU9I) ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2009, 8:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-appreciation-thread-rip-mj-but-prince-won/510086/45 "2009-09-16T08:42:29Z")
> [@Koxinga](#): > > And [TOM JONES!](http://www.youtube.com/watch?gl=US&v=Iw3so6ClU9I) That’s a cover. Aside from collaborations, are you assigning Princes’ musical style to all the above? ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2009, 8:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-appreciation-thread-rip-mj-but-prince-won/510086/46 "2009-09-16T08:55:35Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > That’s a cover. Aside from collaborations, are you assigning Princes’ musical style to all the above? I don’t know, what does “protégé” mean anyway? ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2009, 9:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-appreciation-thread-rip-mj-but-prince-won/510086/47 "2009-09-16T09:06:26Z")
> [@Koxinga](#): > > I don’t know, what does “protégé” mean anyway? It means more or less taken under wing. I’m talking about musical influence as in the style and sound of Prince. These appear to be people associated with him as producer. This isn’t an argument, I’m asking for information. ---
**Author:** ![Hippy\_Hollow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hippy_hollow/32/4841_2.png) [@Hippy\_Hollow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hippy_Hollow)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2009, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-appreciation-thread-rip-mj-but-prince-won/510086/48 "2009-09-16T15:55:31Z")
Seriously, can this thread get any sillier? Prince, genius. MJ, genius. In very different ways, and neither one will be forgotten for their impact on popular music. Ditto for all of the brilliant artists mentioned - Lennon/McCartney, James Brown, Stevie Wonder, etc. Arguing about who is more impactful is like dancing about architecture… ---
**Author:** ![woodstockbirdybird](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/woodstockbirdybird/32/7905_2.png) [@woodstockbirdybird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/woodstockbirdybird)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2009, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-appreciation-thread-rip-mj-but-prince-won/510086/49 "2009-09-16T16:11:16Z")
I don’t know - Michael Jackson was a good singer and dancer, but I’d stop short of calling him a musical genius. Did he even play an instrument? I know he got songwriting credits on much of his solo stuff, but I always assumed it was an Elvis Presley-type contractual thing. Or maybe he hummed a skeletal melody and Quincy Jones built the arrangement around it. I could be wrong - I honestly don’t know. But I’ve never seen him play anything. He was definitely a genius at selling himself, though. ---
**Author:** ![DiosaBellissima](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@DiosaBellissima](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DiosaBellissima)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2009, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-appreciation-thread-rip-mj-but-prince-won/510086/50 "2009-09-16T16:35:52Z")
> [@woodstockbirdybird](#): > > I don’t know - Michael Jackson was a good singer and dancer, but I’d stop short of calling him a musical genius. Did he even play an instrument? I know he got songwriting credits on much of his solo stuff, but I always assumed it was an Elvis Presley-type contractual thing. Or maybe he hummed a skeletal melody and Quincy Jones built the arrangement around it. I could be wrong - I honestly don’t know. But I’ve never seen him play anything. > > He was definitely a genius at selling himself, though. While it’s true that Michael didn’t literally write out sheet music, he could play several instruments. You have to remember that he did start in a family band and while he was the lead singer, he still learned how to play the other instruments from his brothers. Supposedly, he loved to play guitar and drums, but who knows for sure. When he would write his own songs, though, he says he would hear all of the parts in his head- each individual instrument and movement- then beatbox it into a tape recorder. Then, producers would take his beat boxing and replace it with the actual instruments. While this certainly isn’t sitting down with a quill and writing music on lined papers, I’d argue that this is no less than that in regard to the creation of art. Plus, it takes a whole lot of talent. Check out this court deposition from the 90s- he was in Mexico because he was being sued- someone said he stole their song, so he had to prove how he wrote it. [Compare his beat boxing here](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hz0wrkOT-4U) to [the actual song](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yjvoVpOrlbM). Sounds virtually identical. Don’t get me wrong, I adore Prince and think the man is not only insanely talented, but one of the greatest guitar players of all time. That said, I don’t think being able to write sheet music is what makes one an artist. ---
**Author:** ![woodstockbirdybird](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/woodstockbirdybird/32/7905_2.png) [@woodstockbirdybird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/woodstockbirdybird)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2009, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-appreciation-thread-rip-mj-but-prince-won/510086/51 "2009-09-16T17:11:49Z")
Good to know. Raises him in my estimation - but not enough to really compare to Prince. ---
**Author:** ![Nzinga\_Seated](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5ac83/32.png) [@Nzinga\_Seated](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nzinga_Seated)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2009, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-appreciation-thread-rip-mj-but-prince-won/510086/52 "2009-09-16T18:05:53Z")
> [@Lobot](#): > > Jackson was a star; Prince is an artist. > > I’m personally partial to the latter, but I seriously doubt Jackson will be forgotten any time soon. I don’t think of Marilyn Monroe as a terrific actress in the way Streep or Blanchett are, but she’s iconic, and I have no doubt she’ll be remembered in another 50 years time. Yeah, that really is a perfect way of looking at it, huh? ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2009, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-appreciation-thread-rip-mj-but-prince-won/510086/53 "2009-09-16T18:15:48Z")
> [@woodstockbirdybird](#): > > A\ > ETA: You ain’t kidding about the unreleased stuff that will come out when Prince dies, either. Among many of his bootlegs, I’ve got a 20-disc collection of outtakes (and alternate versions - does anybody really need a 35-minute run-through of “I Would Die 4 U”? Well, I guess I do). ::Raises hand:: Actually, we might have that already - Jimbo got a huge outtake collection from a friend, too. What’s the problem with Prince’s lyrics? He has the odd clunker (“kooky love affair,” for example), but I wouldn’t say any more than anyone else who puts out an album or two a year. For the last thirty years. ---
**Author:** ![Dread\_Pirate\_Jimbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dread_pirate_jimbo/32/3897_2.png) [@Dread\_Pirate\_Jimbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dread_Pirate_Jimbo)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2009, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-appreciation-thread-rip-mj-but-prince-won/510086/54 "2009-09-16T18:54:32Z")
Nothing Compares 2 Prince And yes, **CW** , we do have that 35-minute version of “I Would Die 4 U” on my “The Work” bootleg collection ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2016, 9:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-appreciation-thread-rip-mj-but-prince-won/510086/55 "2016-04-23T09:46:55Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > My sister has already informed me that if I were to find out that Prince died before she does, I’m supposed to tell her to sit down and brace herself before breaking the news, just like you do with a dead family member. Contrast that with the way we acted when MJ died, which was more like “Girl, did you hear Michael is dead! OMG!” We were sad, of course, but it was more like the kind of feeling you get when you hear that any major celebrity has died. But with Prince, it will be different. Tears will be shed, and there will be wailing and screams of “NO!!!” This week, I had occasion to remember and go look up this post from seven years ago. ☹ [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-appreciation-thread-rip-mj-but-prince-won/510086.md?page=2)