# Prince, you are the KING of the goat-felchers! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 20, 2013, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-you-are-the-king-of-the-goat-felchers/664050 "2013-07-20T18:40:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2013, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-you-are-the-king-of-the-goat-felchers/664050/61 "2013-07-20T22:59:35Z")
> [@gaffa](#): > > Again, he was not the only party here. The kids have rights. I have rights. The other performers who are benefiting from my videos have rights. And this asshole thinks his rights trumps everyones. You’ve repeated this a couple times in this thread, and I’m having trouble concluding anything but that it is complete bullshit. The kids’ and your rights don’t include the right to use someone’s music without their permission. His rights aren’t “trumping” yours, because you don’t have any right that conflicts with his. Now, if someone used your intellectual property without your permission and somehow Prince said “No, go ahead and use his stuff because I give you permission”, you’d have a point. But that’s not what he did, nor is it likely to ever find support in the law. If anything, it’s you who is asserting that your rights should trump his. ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2013, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-you-are-the-king-of-the-goat-felchers/664050/62 "2013-07-20T23:07:38Z")
So re-edit the videos to cut out Prince covers. The kids can see everything else and get all the great feedback and coments they’re being denied. It’s called a compromise. ---
**Author:** ![panaccione](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/94ad74/32.png) [@panaccione](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panaccione)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2013, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-you-are-the-king-of-the-goat-felchers/664050/63 "2013-07-20T23:22:42Z")
If it makes you feel any better, I just illegally downloaded Princes greatest hits. Got your back, bro. ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2013, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-you-are-the-king-of-the-goat-felchers/664050/64 "2013-07-20T23:37:18Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > . Prince has done nothing wrong except not played ball with you. Lucky for him! Charlie Murphy says that cat can ball! Woulda kicked his ass! ---
**Author:** ![Hbns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hbns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hbns)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2013, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-you-are-the-king-of-the-goat-felchers/664050/65 "2013-07-20T23:54:33Z")
> [@IvoryTowerDenizen](#): > > So re-edit the videos to cut out Prince covers. The kids can see everything else and get all the great feedback and coments they’re being denied. > > It’s called a compromise. The OP is just pissed at the potential loss of a free promotional tool that provides links back to the website where you can purchase the DVD’s. I noticed the Prince DVD is still offered, so Gaffa isn’t pissed enough at Prince not to make a buck off him. If this were really about the kids, the videos wouldn’t be titled first with the name of the performer being covered. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2013, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-you-are-the-king-of-the-goat-felchers/664050/66 "2013-07-21T04:02:44Z")
> [@IvoryTowerDenizen](#): > > So he took advantage of a valid option on YouTube to protect his interests in the way he feels is best for him, but because it affects you negatively he’s some horrible hateful person? It was a legal, valid option and he’s a horrible person because he put his interests ahead of yours? You could be annoyed but he’s not some immoral being since he chose to promote his best interests over yours. > > My goodness. While the OP’s outrage is a bit excessive, he’s [actually probably right](http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2008/07/19/mom-still-suing-prince-riaa-over-%E2%80%98fair-use%E2%80%99/). ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2013, 4:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-you-are-the-king-of-the-goat-felchers/664050/67 "2013-07-21T04:16:03Z")
If you’re going to pit Prince for anything, it should be because he’s an egotistical douchebag. Always used to love reading about how upset people got that Prince didn’t take the stage at his 9pm concert until 3am… ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2013, 4:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-you-are-the-king-of-the-goat-felchers/664050/68 "2013-07-21T04:56:41Z")
Seems to me that there’s a lot of dick-sucking junior mods for the RIAA posting here, hoping to get noticed like a whore fucking a band’s roadies so she can get close enough to sniff the stink off one of these asshole’s armpits. Copyright is a joke in this country, something corporations who buy Congressmen get to dictate for decades at a time, and the pathetic waste products of a one night stand with groupies fight to keep from expiring so they never have to work a day in their life. Gaffa’s 100% right in this, he’s half owner of the video. What people don’t seem to get is that this isn’t like stealing Prince’s CD’s or copying his tracks and selling them. The video is about more than just the music, its about the performance. Prince did not perform in any of the videos in Gaffa’s channel and he should not get to dictate how something he only partly owns gets to be used, essentially for free. Plus, Youtube ads are not a zero-sum market. More ad revenue for Gaffa doesn’t impact Prince at all. The guy’s a dick, plain and simple, and he’s abusing our skewed copyright laws to hurt someone who, let’s be honest here, was essentially helping Prince out by making his music even more popular. Until Prince joins those kids onstage and actually sings the songs, Gaffa has just as much right to keep his videos and sell them as Prince does. Intellectual property does not work like selling a car or a TV. Its electronic, it can be copied and resold without having it taken away from the owner. Xiao Qiao in Podunk, China making a thousand copies of “Purple Rain” and selling it at the local market doesn’t mean Prince doesn’t get to do it as well. Especially now, decades later, Prince is probably not getting the royalties from his songs as he once was. His stupidity in keeping hold of his copyrights so tightly makes more generations of people forget him rather than venerate him. Plus he’s an ass and looks like a girl ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2013, 5:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-you-are-the-king-of-the-goat-felchers/664050/69 "2013-07-21T05:09:59Z")
I know that personally, the only reason I’ve never bought a Prince album is because I can get free copies of thirteen year olds singing his songs on YouTube. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2013, 5:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-you-are-the-king-of-the-goat-felchers/664050/70 "2013-07-21T05:24:59Z")
What Prince did was legal. Also, the actions of his team did nothing to advance creativity, the purpose of protecting and defining IP. He deserves a pitting. Given the influence of Disney and various sundry media companies, I don’t expect creativity friendly IP laws to pass anytime soon. Quite the contrary. Prince’s work is over-rated and derivative anyway.[sup]1[/sup] > [@](#): > > Prince did not perform in any of the videos in Gaffa’s channel and he should not get to dictate how something he only partly owns gets to be used, essentially for free. Plus, Youtube ads are not a zero-sum market. More ad revenue for Gaffa doesn’t impact Prince at all. The guy’s a dick, plain and simple, and he’s abusing our skewed copyright laws to hurt someone who, let’s be honest here, was essentially helping Prince out by making his music even more popular. Yes. What we need is some sort of mandatory licensing procedure. Shorter copyright periods would also be full justified. In the beginning of US history they were something like 14 years. [sup]1[/sup]I retain all legal copyrights to this all-purpose and universal form of artistic derision. Get your license at [dismissEverything.com](http://dismissEverything.com) ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2013, 5:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-you-are-the-king-of-the-goat-felchers/664050/71 "2013-07-21T05:44:39Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > While the OP’s outrage is a bit excessive, he’s [actually probably right](http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2008/07/19/mom-still-suing-prince-riaa-over-%E2%80%98fair-use%E2%80%99/). That’s a pretty big stretch from the article you’ve cited. Apparently Universal has backed off the claim that a 30 second video of a baby dancing to a Prince song is infringement. The OP isn’t using a 30 second sample of Prince songs…he’s recording complete performances and selling them for profit. Whole different scenario. ---
**Author:** ![bdgr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a87d85/32.png) [@bdgr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bdgr)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2013, 10:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-you-are-the-king-of-the-goat-felchers/664050/72 "2013-07-21T10:53:31Z")
I dislike prince, not because he’s a jerk (I don’t know him personally). I dislike his music. I think he has talent, and I think he uses it badly. Prince has been paid for the the cover performance through BMI, ASCAP, or whatever other nasty rights agency he licenses too. I’m sure he cashed the check. Having a video on youtube is not going to hurt him. It may be legal but it’s rather jerkish. The OP did not write the song, but saying he’s just trying to profit off of someone elses work without contributing anything to it himself is just wrong. Shoot a concert and editing it is hard work, and it takes skill and creativity. ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2013, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-you-are-the-king-of-the-goat-felchers/664050/73 "2013-07-21T13:55:20Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > While the OP’s outrage is a bit excessive, he’s [actually probably right](http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2008/07/19/mom-still-suing-prince-riaa-over-%E2%80%98fair-use%E2%80%99/). That seems to be a very different situation. It’s like the difference between my photocopying a page of a book to include a few sentences in a lecture (fair use), vs photocopying the whole thing to put in handouts I’m selling to the class. Maybe not a perfect analogy, but a few seconds of a song for personal use vs posting the whole song to make money off of… If its not a valid option, YouTube should remove it as a choice. If its there as a choice, Prince is not wrong for exercising his right to use it. ---
**Author:** ![11811](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/1/9d8465/32.png) [@11811](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/11811)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2013, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-you-are-the-king-of-the-goat-felchers/664050/74 "2013-07-21T14:25:49Z")
> [@Oakminster](#): > > Nope. You don’t get to choose how Prince controls his intellectual property. Word (to your moms?). His music, his rules. ---
**Author:** ![11811](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/1/9d8465/32.png) [@11811](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/11811)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2013, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-you-are-the-king-of-the-goat-felchers/664050/75 "2013-07-21T14:29:16Z")
> [@hajario](#): > > But certainly he can have an opinion on how Prince controls his intellectual property, right? Gaffa isn’t just voicing his opinion. He is asking us to join in his umbrage. I can’t get worked up about a living artist having control over his work. ---
**Author:** ![11811](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/1/9d8465/32.png) [@11811](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/11811)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2013, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-you-are-the-king-of-the-goat-felchers/664050/76 "2013-07-21T14:50:17Z")
> [@gaffa](#): > > Read my OP. I shoot a concert with seven cameras _by myself_. I edit the whole thing into a fairly professional looking product. My original content. > > Again, why should one contributor, the songwriter, overrule the rights of everyone else? He didn’t perform these songs with the kids. He didn’t record the performances. As an enticement to Prince, YouTube offered him that option. He accepted their offer. Clearly YouTube values his goodwill more than they value yours. This should not surprise you. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2013, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-you-are-the-king-of-the-goat-felchers/664050/77 "2013-07-21T15:08:33Z")
> [@11811](#): > > As an enticement to Prince, YouTube offered him that option. He accepted their offer. Clearly YouTube values his goodwill more than they value yours. This should not surprise you. The “surprise” part is what gets me. Youtube isn’t a government service. They’re a private enterprise with their own rules about how to handle things. Surely the OP knew those rules going in, and Prince is playing by those rules. This isn’t burning someone’s house down, it’s getting rid of a luxury item. **Gaffa** , your outrage is misplaced. Fix your shit, play by Youtube’s rules going forward, and move on. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2013, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-you-are-the-king-of-the-goat-felchers/664050/78 "2013-07-21T15:55:01Z")
> [@Tracijo67](#): > > Prince is himself probably not even aware of what happened. Do you actually think that he, himself, has the time or the inclination? I doubt his legal team — or whoever handles such matters on his behalf – even bothered to inform him of the action they’d taken. Actually, Prince is known for personally surfing YouTube to find videos using his songs. He’s adamant about it. And this is fairly well known. Anyone who regularly posts videos to YouTube should know that posting anything with a Prince song on it—even barely audible in the background—is likely to get a takedown notice from Prince himself. > [@gaffa](#): > > Prince is, in my experience, the entirety of option #3. I woke up one morning to find that “Controversy Music” had issued DMCA Takedown Notices against two of my videos. Only by swiftly deleting the other two Prince videos I had on my channel did I avoid losing every single video I have on my channel. It is his absolute right to issue DMCA notices. I don’t feel sorry for you. If you want to avoid trouble, you should be seeking permission _before_ you post your videos. ---
**Author:** ![Hbns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hbns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hbns)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2013, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-you-are-the-king-of-the-goat-felchers/664050/79 "2013-07-21T16:00:03Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > I know that personally, the only reason I’ve never bought a Prince album is because I can get free copies of thirteen year olds singing his songs on YouTube. This made me chuckle. Then I realized what Gaffa is doing isnt that far removed from sites that copy threads from SDMB are doing. Taking a portion of someone else’s content to drive traffic to their for profit website. A little googling found several SoR videos (and a ton of others) featuring Prince covers available on the YouTube. The most significant difference being that those other videos don’t have “Get the DVD of the video shown here:_link to Gaffa’s business site where the DVD is FOR SALE_”. I think the fact it looks like he is set up to profit from the performance is likely what led to the TDN. ---
**Author:** ![miss\_elizabeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/838e76/32.png) [@miss\_elizabeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/miss_elizabeth)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2013, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-you-are-the-king-of-the-goat-felchers/664050/80 "2013-07-21T16:35:59Z")
> [@YogSosoth](#): > > Prince did not perform in any of the videos in Gaffa’s channel Neither did Gaffa > [@](#): > > The guy’s a dick, plain and simple, and he’s abusing our skewed copyright laws to hurt someone who, let’s be honest here, was essentially helping Prince out by making his music even more popular. :rolleyes: Prince doesn’t need the help. > [@](#): > > Until Prince joins those kids onstage and actually sings the songs, Gaffa has just as much right to keep his videos and sell them as Prince does. Intellectual property does not work like selling a car or a TV. Its electronic, it can be copied and resold without having it taken away from the owner. Xiao Qiao in Podunk, China making a thousand copies of “Purple Rain” and selling it at the local market doesn’t mean Prince doesn’t get to do it as well. Especially now, decades later, Prince is probably not getting the royalties from his songs as he once was. His stupidity in keeping hold of his copyrights so tightly makes more generations of people forget him rather than venerate him. Plus he’s an ass and looks like a girl This entire block of text is completely wrong. It’s pretty amazing. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-you-are-the-king-of-the-goat-felchers/664050.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prince-you-are-the-king-of-the-goat-felchers/664050.md?page=5)