Well, I don’t think it’s fair for him to get credit for a position he never held.
Heh, he worked in a prison to meet a better class of people, did he?
Cartooniverse
The differance between the Whitechapel murders and Jesse James crimes are not their scale, James certainly murdered more the the Ripper killer, and neither are particualarly pleasant, one can state the Whitechapel murder were more gruesome, but then, waiting in a line and kneeling on the floor for a bullet to be put in the back of your head as you hear your colleagues die has a particualr kind of nastiness about it too.
Both have been somewhat mythogloised, but no-one, no-one at all except perhaps the utterly perverse has any kind of hero worship of the Whitechapel killer, but as for James, well it depends upon whom you talk to, but in todays terms he would would be seen something along the lines of an Iraqi insurgent in the cold hard light of reality, but there is a folk mythology about him that he was some sort of Robin Hood charactor and he is regarded with a certain amount of affection among some folk, especially the confederate side of the civil war debate.
You will never find me defending the behaviour of prsion workers who commit crime, either inside prison or outside it, nor will you find many other prison workers who would do such a thing.
Those criminals who have abused the trust and authority placed in them are examples to me why we have to be alert to anyone who seeks power, and how seemingly ordinary individuals can contemplate carrying out the worst acts of crime on the statute book. This is why people in such positions must be closely monitored at all times in their work.
Of half a million such workers in the US, 10 or 20 is a miniscule amount, but given that there will be some who have not yet been detected, this is still far too many corrupted individuals.
I wonder if you took a sample of the same size of any other group of workers you would get such a low figure ?
Anyway, if we look into those links you provided,
I notice that the crimes committed by these individuals take place in a period from 1999 through to 2006.
Several of those crimes do not relate in any way to activity whilst working in jail, one regards a person who was a criminal first and wrongfully gained employment in a prison, and there is no other allegation of criminal behaviour - though the managers in that prison clearly did not carry out pre-employment security checks.
So what you have unearthed is around 11 actual crimes across a period of 7 years in a workforce of around half a million.
This is not ideal, but that idea that prison workers are 99.99% criminal and untrustyworthy is well wide of the mark.
The original argument, into which you waded, was that prison workers are overwhelmingly criminal, and far from refute that point, you went in to try and support that person making such an erroneous statement.
You claimed I cared not all for the police officer that had been murdered, and you claimed that I said that no-one could say anything about prison worker unless I set the agenda.
Just to remind you, I never made any statement about the police officer, the link spoke for itself and his murder was unconscionable, what I did was to point out that the person condemning prison staff was making an unqualified statement which was slanderous, and completely wrong.
Given that I and other prison workers were under such personal and unjustifiable attack without any evidence, I and quite within my rights to tell that person to either produce real evidence, or shut up.
That’s when you stepped in, with more unqualified statements and ignorance.
You cannot have it both ways, matey. You cannot agree that six men raped a lot of women in a prison in the State of Florida, therefore committing multiple felony rapes under Florida ( and Federal ) statute and then in the next breath say that a person who accuses prison workers of being raping drug dealing extortionists is slanderous and completely wrong.
Which truth are you siding with here ? See, to the family of that Federal Agent, I suspect you would have a bitch of a time sitting them down and telling them that the Prison Guard, the Corrections Officer who murdered their husband/son/father/brother was being unfairly slandered and accused incorrectly.
Which truth are you siding with here ? A CO kills, and you cry " slander, slander, slander " when people point out in cite after cite that CO’s do kill, rape, steal, smuggle drugs, extort and so on.
Which truth is your truth ? I know which one is mine. This is The Pit, we can say fuck you arsehole all week long and never agree and you know what? That’s just fine. I know you need to defend your Band of Brothers, just as I need to point out the glaringly obvious facts that criminals working as CO’s do in fact commit all of these crimes, and more.
Slander? Why, you yourself just admitted that I have found 11 criminals who were CO’s. You can hardly accuse me of slander, now can you ? If I didn’t have a life, I’d dedicate a day to finding 40 or 50 more. It wouldn’t make any difference to your position, I fear. A statement that condems prison staffers who commit felonies is neighter slanderous nor libelous nor unqualified nor wrong. You yourself have admitted as much in your last post.
Which truth is your truth, then ??
I think the major objection that casdave and others have is that it’s like taking the example of a few black criminals and using it to show that blacks are a criminal race. The vast majority of black Americans are good, law-abiding people, and shouldn’t be thought of as criminals simply because they share a characteristic with people who are law-breakers. Likewise, the vast majority of corrections officers are good, law-abiding people, and it’s unfair to color them all with the same brush because of the misdeeds of a minority.
Toonie, have you slipped a cog???
Some officers treat inmates in criminal ways. They need to be stopped, and face the consequences, which often includes prison time for themselves.
Some inmates fabricate stories about abuse by prison staff. They need to be stopped, and face the consequences, which often includes more prison time for themselves.
Everybody needs to be held responsible for their behavior. Period.
Now, I’m going to go back to my vacation, and I won’t fret a whit further about ludicrous assertions on a message board.
The slander that was made was this, it was that 99.9% of all prison officers were untrustworthy to such an extent that you could not rely on any of them.
This was from a person who stated that they knew a total of three staff
That slander was not made by yourself, but later on you made comments that suggested that you agreed with it, or at the very least, you defended what had been said by attacking those who pointed this out.
Are you suggesting that one should hold this opinion based on three individuals, who were not in fact criminals, as being representative of a workforce of half a million ?
Even if you find 50 such corrupt individuals across the time period you link to , seven years, that is a tiny number, and whilst one corrupt person is one too many, it is statistcaly far far away from the 99.9% allegation made by the accusing poster.
The slander is not in the fact that there are indeed corrupt prison workers, it is in the fact that they form a significant percentage, which they clearly do not.
You know, Cartooniverse, I did some quick googling just before work and found an easy dozen articles about EMTs who had committed murders, robberies and sexual assaults (including against minors). I also found a similar selection of crimes committed by video cameramen.
Can you look at the truth of these crimes and then say that a person who accuses these professions of being child-raping murdering thieves is slanderous and completely wrong?
I know which truth is mine. The one in which you’re a complete fucking lunatic.
Both dozen cites please.
Hey, it’s the Pit. Namecalling is A-ok !! Knock yerself out. But, before you do, I’m waiting for 24 verifiable cites on what you just wrote. 
And, when you provide them, I will be delighted to counter with the WIDELY HELD FUCKING ACCEPTABLE FACT THAT LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICERS ARE HELD TO A HIGHER LEVEL OF BEHAVIOR. Now, I know that is something that nobody will admit in here because it shoots to shit the allegation that even 50 cites is a statistical nothing.
Those of you who enjoy looking down on the non- gun toting masses might want to actuall hold yourself to that higher standard of behavior, and not frantically excuse those incapable of doing so.
Of course, that doesn’t excuse any verifiable cites you may or may not have to back up your post.
It always seems to be one man against the world with you, doesn’t it, Cartoon?
-Shrug- This is the Straight Dope. I provided cite, I asked for the same. It’s what we do here.
Exactly what part of that seems incongruous to you?
Hell, why not? Here’s are a sampling of a few of our paramedic friends. I don’t believe any of these are duplicates, but just in case I’ll toss in a few extra.
- hiring a hitman to bump off boyfriend’s wife http://search.japantimes.co.jp/cgi-bin/nn20051004a7.html
- sexual assault of a minor http://www.ci.vancouver.wa.us/police.asp?menuid=10465&submenuid=10527&psection=&itemID=15508&news=23122
- sex with a minor Redirect Notice
- Hey, we even got terrorism Redirect Notice
- sexual assault of a minor Redirect Notice
- theft Redirect Notice
- theft (from an accident victim) Redirect Notice
- possession of child porn Newsday | Long Island's & NYC's News Source - Newsday
- soliciting sex from a minor Redirect Notice
- sexual assault Redirect Notice
- theft Redirect Notice (fourth story down)
- theft Redirect Notice
- theft Redirect Notice
- sexual assault Redirect Notice
- smuggling handguns to a prison inmate to aid an escape Redirect Notice
- child molesting (13-year-old hospital patient) CBS Chicago - Breaking News, First Alert Weather, Exclusive Investigations & Community Journalism
- child molesting Redirect Notice
I’m at work right now, so I’m not going to google the cameramen. I’ve met a lot of them in person and they tend to give off a particularly skeevy vibe, so I’d rather not have that on my screen in the office.
Now then, even after reading all these, I still don’t believe that the statement “Paramedics are rapists, child-molesters and thieves” is an accurate one, even if I do hold them to a higher standard of conduct than the average person. You know why? Because that statement includes the 99% who haven’t done anything wrong, and it would indeed be slanderous to tar them with the same crimes.
I agree that law enforcement officers are held to a higher level of behavior, but I would guess that an EMT would be held to that same level considering the type of public trust they hold.
You know Cartooniverse, I think you are a great guy and all but lately you really seem to be out there. REALLY out there, like you aren’t comprehending the things that are actually written and are fighting windmills where there are none. Everything okay with you?
’Toon, I liked you better when you were boycotting the Pit. Posting here, you’re showing a real asshole streak.
Well, it seems that in the Pit, Cartooniverse prefers to dispense with certain words (some, a few, a minority of, etc.). Feel free to insert them in the appropriate places, and you’ll have a more interesting, more grounded post.
I’m curious, Cartoon, have you ever been in a car accident? The reason I ask is because I’ve never before seen anyone say things as stupid as the things you’re saying without actual physical brain trauma.