# Prison Rape **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 22, 2011, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prison-rape/589982 "2011-07-22T14:02:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2011, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prison-rape/589982/41 "2011-07-22T18:19:07Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > You can equally well make a plausible argument that prisoners who have been sexually victimized have more reason to participate in a voluntary study of the subject. So the participants are a self-selected group with a higher-than-average percentage of victims. And that would mean that the genuine percentage of sexual victims is lower than four percent. > > There’s no point in going back and forth on the issue. For the purposes of this thread, let’s assume the figures we have are accurate. Because the OP did not stipulate that for the purposes of this thread we are to assume that the figures given are correct, questioning those figures is certainly within reason. ---
**Author:** ![ladyfoxfyre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ad7895/32.png) [@ladyfoxfyre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ladyfoxfyre)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2011, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prison-rape/589982/42 "2011-07-22T18:27:48Z")
> [@code\_grey](#): > > other “more civilized” countries don’t have as many blacks in prison. They also don’t have lots of whites incarcerated next to the blacks. Uh, what? ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2011, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prison-rape/589982/43 "2011-07-22T19:03:56Z")
> [@ladyfoxfyre](#): > > Uh, what? If you want to follow along with code\_grey’s views on race and prison conditions, you check this [thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=617136). ---
**Author:** ![keeganst94](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/a6a055/32.png) [@keeganst94](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/keeganst94)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2011, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prison-rape/589982/44 "2011-07-22T19:57:28Z")
> [@](#): > > Exactly. I’ve worked with some people who’ve dealt with inmates (in the health care field), and they insist that the number of inmates who come in for sexual assault injuries and treatment far outweighs what’s reported. I wouldn’t doubt that the vast majority of sexual assault in prison is inmate-on-inmate, but they just don’t snitch. Stigma is a powerful tool of oppression. I think that it would be the opposite, actually. I mean lets say you’re in prison, and you’re raped by a guard. Who are you going to report him to? The other guards, who are his friends and coworkers? And lets not forget that this person could make your life extremely difficult without all that much trouble. I think if it was an inmate, at least it’s just another guy. If it’s a guard, he has real power over you. ---
**Author:** ![code\_grey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f4b2a3/32.png) [@code\_grey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/code_grey)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2011, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prison-rape/589982/45 "2011-07-23T20:24:58Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Uh… so what? > > In any case, that’s patently untrue. African-Americans make up 12% of the US prison population; Afro-Carribeans make up 11% of the UK prison population. Your claim is not just false, it is patently absurd. American blacks are 12% of American population, not of American **prison** population. Haven’t you heard about disproportionate incarceration of blacks by the racist justice system? 😃 Quoth [Incarceration in the United States - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incarceration_in_the_United_States) > [@](#): > > According to the US Bureau of Justice Statistics (BJS) non-Hispanic blacks accounted for 39.4% of the total prison and jail population in 2009.[38] According to the 2010 census of the US Census Bureau blacks (including Hispanic blacks) comprised 12.6% of the US population.[39][40][41] > > Hispanics (of all races) were 20.6% of the total jail and prison population in 2009.[38]. Hispanics comprised 16.3% of the US population according to the 2010 US census.[39] > > In 2009 black non-Hispanic males were incarcerated at the rate of 4,749 inmates per 100,000 U.S. residents of the same race and gender. White males were incarcerated at the rate of 708 inmates per 100,000 U.S. residents. Hispanic males were incarcerated at the rate of 1,822 inmates per 100,000 U.S. residents.[38][42] For female rates see the table to the right. You gotta have some basic decency, man. Proving your libtard credentials isn’t everything, it helps to at least try passing the smell test in your claims. ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2011, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prison-rape/589982/46 "2011-07-23T20:29:04Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > To eliminate prison sex abuse, you need lots of money to hire more and better trained personnel, IMHO. Training is the problem. The Catholic Church mentions this a lot, more donations and they’ll have the funds to teach men not to molest boys. ---
**Author:** ![code\_grey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f4b2a3/32.png) [@code\_grey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/code_grey)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2011, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prison-rape/589982/47 "2011-07-23T20:36:49Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > In any case, that’s patently untrue. African-Americans make up 12% of the US prison population; Afro-Carribeans make up 11% of the UK prison population. blacks comprise around 15% of UK prison population, although population-wise they are heavily overrepresented. Quoth [More black people jailed in England and Wales proportionally than in US | Prisons and probation | The Guardian](http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2010/oct/11/black-prison-population-increase-england) > [@](#): > > The report drew on a 2008 Ministry of Justice document, footnoted as the source of the EHRC statement that stated: “Black prisoners make up 15% of the prisoner population and this compares with 2.2% of the general population – there is greater disproportionality in the number of black people in prisons in the UK than there is in the United States.” Overrepresentation should not be surprising since the immigration there is fairly recent and may have attracted some of the worst dregs of society looking for easy criminal pickings and for welfare state assistance. Then again, Jamaica is no paradise either in terms of crime. In any event, so what? 15% is not that much in absolute terms, certainly less than American 40%. And lest we forget, black people from the Carribean were less affected by homosexual propaganda. Jamaica, believe it or not, is “[the most homophobic place on earth](http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1182991,00.html)”. That’s not to say that allegedly “homophobic” people were never known to commit prison rape, but fundamentally this is a matter of statistics. People who come from cultures that hate sodomy are less likely to engage in it, all else being equal. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2011, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prison-rape/589982/48 "2011-07-23T23:00:17Z")
> [@code\_grey](#): > > . . . your libtard credentials. . . This is not The BBQ Pit. Do not post insults in this forum. [/Moderating] ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2011, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prison-rape/589982/49 "2011-07-24T00:28:58Z")
> [@code\_grey](#): > > You gotta have some basic decency, man. Proving your libtard credentials isn’t everything, it helps to at least try passing the smell test in your claims. And here I thought it was hard to smell through a hood. ---
**Author:** ![G-SE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f0a364/32.png) [@G-SE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/G-SE)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2011, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prison-rape/589982/50 "2011-07-24T01:31:04Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > And here I thought it was hard to smell through a hood. Great response to someone pointing out your made up numbers. When all else fails… ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2011, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prison-rape/589982/51 "2011-07-24T02:00:18Z")
> [@G-SE](#): > > Great response to someone pointing out your made up numbers. When all else fails… I didn’t make up the numbers. I did read the wrong number for the US black prison population, from the same Wikipedia page he quoted above: > [@](#): > > According to the US Bureau of Justice Statistics (BJS) non-Hispanic blacks accounted for 39.4% of the total prison and jail population in 2009.[38] According to the 2010 census of the US Census Bureau blacks (including Hispanic blacks) comprised 12.6% of the US population. . I got the UK percentage from [here](http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200405/cmselect/cmhaff/193/19317.htm). I would have apologized, but if you read all his posts in this thread I’m sure you’ll understand why I didn’t bother. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2011, 7:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prison-rape/589982/52 "2011-07-24T07:38:19Z")
> [@elmwood](#): > > I agree. However, people are getting sentenced to incarceration, not rape, a point that doesn’t seem to be getting across. It’s the United States, **not Pakistan where people _do_ get sentenced to rape**. Please add evidence to support the above assertion. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2011, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prison-rape/589982/53 "2011-07-24T14:26:11Z")
> [@G-SE](#): > > Great response to someone pointing out your made up numbers. When all else fails… Neither accusations of lying nor your other implied insult are appropriate in this forum. **Really Not All That Bright** , your response that **GS-E** quoted was also out of line for this forum. Knock it off. [/Moderating] ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2011, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prison-rape/589982/54 "2011-07-24T15:19:16Z")
_Mea culpa._ ---
**Author:** ![eddiec3434](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/cab0a1/32.png) [@eddiec3434](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eddiec3434)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2011, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prison-rape/589982/55 "2011-07-24T18:33:41Z")
Look, that’s just prison. Believe me, it’s not a common occurrence. Prisoners are not just running around raping one another. A certain percentage of those surveyed are, well let’s just say “the willing”. Out here in So Cal., a rapist or sex offender will not survive very long. Any prisoner known as a rapist will be targeted. Out here, they are kept far from the general population for their own safety. The prisoners themselves take care of any sexual deviants. Prison health care is a bigger problem than this. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2011, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prison-rape/589982/56 "2011-07-24T20:02:08Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > Please add evidence to support the above assertion. It was overblown perhaps, but [true enough](http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/03/05/world/main678317.shtml). ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2011, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prison-rape/589982/57 "2011-07-25T02:06:13Z")
That story doesn’t support the claim **AK84** questioned. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2011, 11:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prison-rape/589982/58 "2011-07-25T11:38:33Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Sure it is. The coercion itself may give rise to another criminal charge, but rape requires force or the threat of force. No, it doesn’t. All consensual sex between guards and prisoners is classified as rape because the state presumes the balance of power prevents the “victim” from being able to legally consent. I read just a week or so ago about a female guard who was being charged with rape after having become pregnant as the result of an affair with a male prisoner. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2011, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prison-rape/589982/59 "2011-07-25T12:50:49Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > No, it doesn’t. All consensual sex between guards and prisoners is classified as rape because the state presumes the balance of power prevents the “victim” from being able to legally consent. I read just a week or so ago about a female guard who was being charged with rape after having become pregnant as the result of an affair with a male prisoner. Unless there is a specific statute which so states, I don’t think so. Where there is such an imbalance of power between the parties, it may be worth exploring whether the consent could really be said to have been free of coersion and in a case of a goaler and her prisoner trivially easy to prove; but the question is one of fact and evidence; not law. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2011, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prison-rape/589982/60 "2011-07-25T13:49:11Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > No, it doesn’t. All consensual sex between guards and prisoners is classified as rape because the state presumes the balance of power prevents the “victim” from being able to legally consent. I read just a week or so ago about a female guard who was being charged with rape after having become pregnant as the result of an affair with a male prisoner. Then I’m sure you can cite the law which sets forth that presumption? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prison-rape/589982.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prison-rape/589982.md?page=4)