# Pro bono bullshit **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 9, 2010, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132 "2010-09-09T02:43:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Rand\_Rover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/db5fbb/32.png) [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/1 "2010-09-09T02:43:46Z")
So one of the senior partners in my section sent around an email today reminding everyone of the firm’s goal of having every lawyer work 20 pro bono hours each year. Apparently our section wasn’t doing so hot compared to the rest of the firm. I thought about responding to everyone in our section with simply a picture of the most beautiful and intelligent two-year-old in the world, but of course the proverbial second thought came right after that one and I didn’t do it. Also, of course the email mentioned our “ethical obligation” to do pro bono work, which just chaps my hide. I’m tired right now and can’t do this pitting full justice at this point, so I’ll just go ahead and get this out there as a placeholder to be fully filled in later. So, I’m pitting people at my firm that try to goad others into doing pro bono work, and the entire idea that because I am a lawyer I have an “ethical obligation” to work for free (hint: I don’t). ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/2 "2010-09-09T02:46:33Z")
Gee, why am I not surprised that **Rand Rover** considers pro bono work bullshit? ---
**Author:** ![Beware\_of\_Doug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/278dde/32.png) [@Beware\_of\_Doug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beware_of_Doug)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/3 "2010-09-09T02:47:57Z")
I’m much less concerned with the bullshit at your law firm than I am about the fact that no one sees anything wrong about a borderline-sociopathic ideologue like yourself having any part in the raising of a two-year-old. Can we expect an impassioned diatribe against the child labor laws a few years down the pike? ---
**Author:** ![Rand\_Rover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/db5fbb/32.png) [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/4 "2010-09-09T02:58:58Z")
> [@Beware\_of\_Doug](#): > > I’m much less concerned with the bullshit at your law firm than I am about the fact that no one sees anything wrong about a borderline-sociopathic ideologue like yourself having any part in the raising of a two-year-old. Can we expect an impassioned diatribe against the child labor laws a few years down the pike? Can you lay out the specific facts that lead you to believe I am a “borderline-sociopathic ideologue”? Thanking you in advance. ---
**Author:** ![antonio107](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/7ea924/32.png) [@antonio107](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/antonio107)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/5 "2010-09-09T02:59:02Z")
You could just calculate how much twenty hours of your time is worth, and cut a cheque to a charity of your choice. That seems a fair compromise if you’re too busy. ---
**Author:** ![Rand\_Rover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/db5fbb/32.png) [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/6 "2010-09-09T03:00:56Z")
> [@antonio107](#): > > That seems a fair compromise if you’re too busy. Compromise? No. Why don’t you just send me $1,000, that’s a fair compromise between the current state of affairs and me stealing $100,000 from you. ---
**Author:** ![Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hilarity_n.suze/32/6223_2.png) [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hilarity_N.Suze)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/7 "2010-09-09T03:04:56Z")
Wow, 20 whole hours a year! At the firm where I worked, pro bono work had a billing number, and even though it was not billed it counted as a “billable” when you were counting such things–going up for partnership, etc. (As opposed to reading advance sheets, which did not count as a billable and was mostly a euphemism for organizing papers on your desk.) In other words, it wasn’t like that 20 hours was coming out of your hide. Associates got paid their usual salary, whether they did pro bono work or not, and partners likewise. Apparently things are different where Rand Rover works. ---
**Author:** ![Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hilarity_n.suze/32/6223_2.png) [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hilarity_N.Suze)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 3:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/8 "2010-09-09T03:07:01Z")
Actually, your national association along with your firm has decreed that you _do_ have an ethical obligation to work for free. ---
**Author:** ![Oldeb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ea666f/32.png) [@Oldeb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oldeb)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 3:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/9 "2010-09-09T03:07:47Z")
But if private firms won’t help the poor they’ll be forced into the arms of the government. And we all know the government will only screw it up while taking half your salary to pay for a new project. Isn’t it better to take those few minutes each day to provide those 20 whole hours across the year? I know it’s a terrible request, but if you don’t show those uneducated slobs the superiority of the private sector who will? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/73ab20/32.png) [@The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tao_s_Revenge)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/10 "2010-09-09T03:08:01Z")
Haha OPs gotta whore himself out to charity. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/11 "2010-09-09T03:10:44Z")
Was that **Randy** ’s latest contribution to “Shit My Dad Says”? Kids are so cute at his age, pretending to be all grown up and shit. ---
**Author:** ![Beware\_of\_Doug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/278dde/32.png) [@Beware\_of\_Doug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beware_of_Doug)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/12 "2010-09-09T03:11:05Z")
> [@Rand\_Rover](#): > > > [@Beware\_of\_Doug](#): > > > > I’m much less concerned with the bullshit at your law firm than I am about the fact that no one sees anything wrong about a borderline-sociopathic ideologue like yourself having any part in the raising of a two-year-old. Can we expect an impassioned diatribe against the child labor laws a few years down the pike? > > Can you lay out the specific facts that lead you to believe I am a “borderline-sociopathic ideologue”? Thanking you in advance. Jesus. Do you _read_ half the hateful solipsistic claptrap you write? Here. _You_ find some cites. I’ve had enough animus for today. [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/search.php?searchid=5677402](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/search.php?searchid=5677402) ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/13 "2010-09-09T03:13:30Z")
IANAL, but isn’t pro bono considered an obligation that goes with the privileges and rights pertaining to the license–not least, because everyone is bound by the laws of the land and the opinions of its courts, regardless of whether they can afford counsel? And according to the Wikipedia entry on [pro bono](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pro_bono) the ABA would like you to do at least 50 hours a year. So cheer up, it sounds like you’re getting off easy. ---
**Author:** ![Rand\_Rover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/db5fbb/32.png) [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/14 "2010-09-09T03:13:50Z")
> [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](#): > > Actually, your national association along with your firm has decreed that you _do_ have an ethical obligation to work for free. Cite for the national association piece? And I guess you’re not a lawyer, right? ---
**Author:** ![Rand\_Rover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/db5fbb/32.png) [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/15 "2010-09-09T03:16:07Z")
> [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](#): > > IANAL, You’re goddamn right about that. > [@](#): > > but isn’t pro bono considered an obligation that goes with the privileges and rights pertaining to the license–not least, because everyone is bound by the laws of the land and the opinions of its courts, regardless of whether they can afford counsel? And according to the Wikipedia entry on [pro bono](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pro_bono) the ABA would like you to do at least 50 hours a year. So cheer up, it sounds like you’re getting off easy. Nope. You don’t even know what the ABA is, do you? Here’s a littly hinty-hint: one need not be a member of the ABA to practice law in any state in these here united ones. ---
**Author:** ![Rand\_Rover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/db5fbb/32.png) [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/16 "2010-09-09T03:17:11Z")
> [@Beware\_of\_Doug](#): > > > [@Rand\_Rover](#): > > > > Can you lay out the specific facts that lead you to believe I am a “borderline-sociopathic ideologue”? Thanking you in advance. > > Jesus. Do you _read_ half the hateful solipsistic claptrap you write? > > Here. _You_ find some cites. I’ve had enough animus for today. > [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/search.php?searchid=5677402](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/search.php?searchid=5677402) So . . . you got nothin’. ---
**Author:** ![Tapioca\_Dextrin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Tapioca\_Dextrin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tapioca_Dextrin)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/17 "2010-09-09T03:17:25Z")
> [@The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](#): > > Haha > > OPs gotta whore himself out to charity. No, the OP voluntarily and knowingly entered into legal contract with a firm that encourages him to nearly three days of work per year helping people who aren’t millionaires. And he’s been called on it. By the guy that cuts him a check. Boo fucking hoo, ---
**Author:** ![Rand\_Rover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/db5fbb/32.png) [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/18 "2010-09-09T03:19:26Z")
> [@Oldeb](#): > > But if private firms won’t help the poor they’ll be forced into the arms of the government. And we all know the government will only screw it up while taking half your salary to pay for a new project. Isn’t it better to take those few minutes each day to provide those 20 whole hours across the year? I know it’s a terrible request, but if you don’t show those uneducated slobs the superiority of the private sector who will? Obvious troll is obvious, but this doesn’t make any sense. Lots of the pro bono projects my firm does involve fighting the government. What does that do to your little theory there, buckaroo? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9fc348/32.png) [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Flying_Dutchman)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/19 "2010-09-09T03:22:26Z")
**Randrover** If you make a decision to help someone who can’t afford it with your precious skills and knowledge you will be rewarded with good feelings about yourself. Instead you opt for misery by subjecting yourself to the criticism and ridicule of your fellow dopers. You must be some sort of masochist. ---
**Author:** ![Rand\_Rover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/db5fbb/32.png) [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/20 "2010-09-09T03:26:04Z")
> [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](#): > > **Randrover** If you make a decision to help someone who can’t afford it with your precious skills and knowledge you will be rewarded with good feelings about yourself. Wrong-o, bub. I would be rewarded with (i) inviting some n’er-do-well miscreant into my life in a way that places me in a position to help him with his in all likelihood largely self-created problems and (ii) less time with that certain most beautiful and intelligent two-year-old you’ve heard so much about. No thanks. > [@](#): > > Instead you opt for misery by subjecting yourself to the criticism and ridicule of your fellow dopers. You must be some sort of masochist. You haven’t been following my SDMB career closely enough if this comes as a surprise to you. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132.md?page=2)