# Pro bono bullshit **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 9, 2010, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132 "2010-09-09T02:43:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 36
**Author:** ![Rand\_Rover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/db5fbb/32.png) [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/701 "2010-09-21T19:26:37Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > All fucking right! **Bricker** and **RR** in a knock down, drag out struggle over precise semantic parsing! Fuck WWF, this is the shit! Yes, I know that debating concepts is difficult for you since you live in a black and white world that you have all figured out (eg, poor people good, rich people bad). But pay attention and you may learn something. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/702 "2010-09-21T19:28:52Z")
This thread just keeps getting more entertaining all the time. It’s even better than going to the monkey house at the zoo to watch them jumping and screeching and hurling feces. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/703 "2010-09-21T19:44:13Z")
> [@villa](#): > > Where the hell am I going wrong then? Try going after a more desperate class of golddigger. > [@Rand\_Rover](#): > > I don’t understand why people would take my comments in this thread to mean that I only do things that are required. We don’t think you only do things that are required. We think that you think that the only reason to do something that you don’t want to do but will benefit society as a whole is if you will be directly and immediately affected in a negative way if you don’t do it. > [@Rand\_Rover](#): > > SFG, we’ve always had a little friendly banter going, but this thread seems to have caused Ýou to take a turn to the dark side. No we haven’t. I’ve always though you were an insufferable little tard. > [@](#): > > Is it because I said your legs looked fat in that picture ýou posted? Hahaha, you actually mean so little to me that I’d actually forgotten that. But thanks for reminding me that you want to bone me. Also, what the fuck is up with your accented y’s? ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/704 "2010-09-21T19:51:41Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > Also, what the fuck is up with your accented y’s? He thinks liberal chicks go for foreign accents? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/705 "2010-09-21T19:52:39Z")
> [@Rand\_Rover](#): > > You are using the phrase “practical difficulties of imposing a sanction” in two different ways in the different contexts. In the pro bono context, the rules themselves clearly impose no sanction. In the competence context, the rules do impose a sanction, but reality may intrude to make the sanction not actually imposed in every situation where it should be. Why is that a relevant distinction? ---
**Author:** ![villa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/bc79bd/32.png) [@villa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/villa)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/706 "2010-09-21T19:56:32Z")
> [@Bosstone](#): > > > [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > > > Also, what the fuck is up with your accented y’s? > > He thinks liberal chicks go for foreign accents? Yet another thing that fails to work for me. Damn it I am a failure. ---
**Author:** ![purplehorseshoe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/purplehorseshoe/32/2996_2.png) [@purplehorseshoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/purplehorseshoe)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/707 "2010-09-21T20:17:35Z")
> [@Rand\_Rover](#): > > … > I don’t understand why people would take my comments in this thread to mean that I only do things that are required. I guess they just see all the discussion of what a set of rules require and get confused. To be clear, nothing I’ve stated in this thread would lead a reasonable person to believe that I don’t tip simply because there’s no set of rules requiring tipping. Well. Apparently, you’re wrong about all that, too. We do think all that, and worse, about you. Or at least, I do, and I’m kinder and more charitable than some of these other assholes. (I say that with love, assholes.) ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/708 "2010-09-21T20:18:55Z")
> [@villa](#): > > > [@Bosstone](#): > > > > He thinks liberal chicks go for foreign accents? > > Yet another thing that fails to work for me. Damn it I am a failure. Try flashing some cash, like a hotshot tax attorney would. ---
**Author:** ![Rand\_Rover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/db5fbb/32.png) [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/709 "2010-09-21T20:30:19Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > > [@Rand\_Rover](#): > > > > You are using the phrase “practical difficulties of imposing a sanction” in two different ways in the different contexts. In the pro bono context, the rules themselves clearly impose no sanction. In the competence context, the rules do impose a sanction, but reality may intrude to make the sanction not actually imposed in every situation where it should be. > > Why is that a relevant distinction? Look at the speeding example. You seem to be using this as a gotcha. You think that I must be arguing that a rule does not impose a requirement unless a sanction is imposed for an infraction 100% of the time. But I’m not saying that at all. To return to pro bono, it would have been very easy to erite a rule saying that a lawyer shall try to do pro bono and to provide a sanction if a lawyer doesn’t try. The fact that a lawyer doesn’t do any pro bono would be evidence of the lack of trying. But the rules don’t say that. The rules themselves provide no sanction for not trying to do pro bono. The fact that in reality there is also often no sanction imposed in situations where the rules do impose a sanction is completely irrelevant. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/710 "2010-09-21T20:31:56Z")
> [@Rand\_Rover](#): > > Look at the speeding example. > > You seem to be using this as a gotcha. You think that I must be arguing that a rule does not impose a requirement unless a sanction is imposed for an infraction 100% of the time. Call me crazy, but aren’t you the one who created the speeding example? And aren’t you the only one who keeps referencing it? And aren’t you the only one who’s making any reference to an idea that a sanction must be imposed 100% of the time? Christ, you’re a moron. ---
**Author:** ![Rand\_Rover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/db5fbb/32.png) [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/711 "2010-09-21T20:38:41Z")
SFG, I think it would benefit society as a whole if you were to post naked pictures of yourself. If you don’t, then you are clearly a sociopath and are only not doing it because there’d be no immediate bad consequences to you for not doing so. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/712 "2010-09-21T20:43:48Z")
Society may be better off if sad men like you could fap to pictures of me, it’s true, but neither is there any \*detriment \*to your not getting your clammy sausage fingers on photos of my tits, in the grand scheme of things. Especially considering that there’s plenty of free porn for you to masturbate to, or you could buy your wife another tennis bracelet in exchange for letting you climb on top for another 90-second ride. (And there certainly would be negative consequences for me personally, _vis_. nausea.) Whereas our society \*is \*broken when the rich have all of the access to our judicial system and the poor have none. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/713 "2010-09-21T20:47:34Z")
To him, that’s not broken; that’s “working as intended”. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/714 "2010-09-21T20:49:12Z")
It’s not a bug–it’s a feature! ---
**Author:** ![Rand\_Rover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/db5fbb/32.png) [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/715 "2010-09-21T20:54:57Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > > [@Rand\_Rover](#): > > > > Look at the speeding example. > > > > You seem to be using this as a gotcha. You think that I must be arguing that a rule does not impose a requirement unless a sanction is imposed for an infraction 100% of the time. > > Call me crazy, but aren’t you the one who created the speeding example? And aren’t you the only one who keeps referencing it? And aren’t you the only one who’s making any reference to an idea that a sanction must be imposed 100% of the time? > > Christ, you’re a moron. SFG, you can safelÝ leave that discussion in Bricker’s capable hands. But thanks for trying to help out. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/716 "2010-09-21T20:59:57Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > To him, that’s not broken; that’s “working as intended”. Huh. I never realized that **Rand Rover** worked for Blizzard. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/717 "2010-09-21T21:01:21Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > Society may be better off if sad men like you could fap to pictures of me, it’s true, but neither is there any \*detriment \*to your not getting your clammy sausage fingers on photos of my tits, in the grand scheme of things. Especially considering that there’s plenty of free porn for you to masturbate to, or you could buy your wife another tennis bracelet in exchange for letting you climb on top for another 90-second ride. (And there certainly would be negative consequences for me personally, _vis_. nausea.) Whereas our society \*is \*broken when the rich have all of the access to our judicial system and the poor have none. Hot. ---
**Author:** ![Rand\_Rover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/db5fbb/32.png) [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/718 "2010-09-21T21:03:35Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > Society may be better off if sad men like you could fap to pictures of me, it’s true, but neither is there any \*detriment \*to your not getting your clammy sausage fingers on photos of my tits, in the grand scheme of things. Especially considering that there’s plenty of free porn for you to masturbate to, or you could buy your wife another tennis bracelet in exchange for letting you climb on top for another 90-second ride. (And there certainly would be negative consequences for me personally, _vis_. nausea.) Whereas our society \*is \*broken when the rich have all of the access to our judicial system and the poor have none. Just because you have identified a problem does not mean that all possible solutions to that problem are morally required or even OK. In the present situaÞion, there’s a lot of ground between “poor people can’t afford lawyers” and “all lawyers are required to donate labor to poor people.” Also, your opinion that I should or am required to work for free does not impose any actual obligation on me to work for free. So, framing the discussion in terms of me not living up to my obligations misses the point of determining whether I have an obligation in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![villa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/bc79bd/32.png) [@villa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/villa)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/719 "2010-09-21T21:07:47Z")
What amuses me, and is probably the result of you being a tax attorney, is that **RandRover** isn’t capable of noticing that there is at least some sanction attached to a failure to do pro bono work as expounded in the Illinois Rules. It may not be a lot, but it is certainly at least a peppercorn’s worth of sanction. But seeing as it isn’t expressed in financial terms, it doesn’t register. ---
**Author:** ![Doxy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f14d63/32.png) [@Doxy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doxy)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132/720 "2010-09-21T21:10:30Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > Society may be better off if sad men like you could fap to pictures of me, it’s true, but neither is there any \*detriment \*to your not getting your clammy sausage fingers on photos of my tits, in the grand scheme of things. Especially considering that there’s plenty of free porn for you to masturbate to, or you could buy your wife another tennis bracelet in exchange for letting you climb on top for another 90-second ride. (And there certainly would be negative consequences for me personally, _vis_. nausea.) Whereas our society \*is \*broken when the rich have all of the access to our judicial system and the poor have none. Wow. That’s beautiful! That may be one of the most eloquent slams I’ve ever read! SBG… YOU are my new heroine! 😃 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132.md?page=35) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pro-bono-bullshit/553132.md?page=37)