# "Problematic" or potentially harmful Film/Television Shows **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [May 2, 2024, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/problematic-or-potentially-harmful-film-television-shows/1001076 "2024-05-02T17:55:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Chingon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chingon/32/17645_2.png) [@Chingon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chingon)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2024, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/problematic-or-potentially-harmful-film-television-shows/1001076/141 "2024-05-11T16:10:42Z")
Bonanza rewatch podcast hosted by the Cowboy Poet Laureate of the West. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2024, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/problematic-or-potentially-harmful-film-television-shows/1001076/142 "2024-06-20T23:04:22Z")
Any argument for Oprah is cancelled out by her hand in getting Obama elected, which was gigantic. (Of course, among those who think Obama was a problem, it is just another vote against her). ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2024, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/problematic-or-potentially-harmful-film-television-shows/1001076/143 "2024-06-20T23:23:49Z")
I don’t think it works that way. Doing other good deeds doesn’t really fix the damage that’s been done. Even Earl knew he had to make it up to those he wronged in order to fix his karma. But Oprah did do a decent amount of good by bringing up important topics on her show as well as getting a lot of people to read books they normally wouldn’t have read. While I thought Oprah did do a lot of damage, I don’t think it was intentional and it would be unfair to forget the good she also did. ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2024, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/problematic-or-potentially-harmful-film-television-shows/1001076/144 "2024-06-21T23:55:57Z")
I can think of a couple of shows that have become a lot _less_ offensive, just by contrast with more recent shows. One is [**The Secret Diary of Desmond Pfeiffer**.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Secret_Diary_of_Desmond_Pfeiffer) Yes, I’m serious. It’s not racist if the black guy is the smartest one in the bunch. And Ulysses S. Grant _was_ an alcoholic. Also, there were some shots taken at then-President Clinton that are darkly amusing in retrospect. The other is [**Heil, Honey, I’m Home!**](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heil_Honey_I%27m_Home!) No, I’m not kidding – have you ever seen an episode of **South Park**? Maybe it’s just the people I hang out with, but nowadays, it seems to be okay to spoof on things that are horribly immoral, reprehensible and so forth, in order to defang them. Like when I was in Bible school, in an era when fundies were trying to shut down Halloween, forget about devil costumes, we were told that it was _good_ to wear a devil costume on Halloween, because it showed Satan you were not afraid of him. At any rate, I honestly believe that if you showed either or both of these shows to people who are big fans of **Rick and Morty** , it wouldn’t raise an eyebrow. Well, not more than a millimeter. ---
**Author:** ![MyFootsZZZ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/myfootszzz/32/12580_2.png) [@MyFootsZZZ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MyFootsZZZ)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2024, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/problematic-or-potentially-harmful-film-television-shows/1001076/145 "2024-06-22T01:14:28Z")
Absolutely. I love **Rick and Morty**. It’s totally “problematic”, and that’s a lot of it’s charm. I do think there’s a difference with **South Park** , though. Rick and Morty Isn’t **trying** to teach you a, more often than not, surface-level and flawed, life lesson in almost every episode. It’s presented as if it’s a matter-of-fact and kind of preachy at time. Back then, I know there were things I disagreed with the show on, but I generally had more maturing and adapting to do. I can’t even watch the episodes about Mr. Garrison’s transitioning anymore. It gives me anxiety I don’t need. I’m not trans, nor do I even have any trans friends, outside of maybe online. I didn’t understand at the time how much those episodes could have hurt someone. South Park started when I was in my last few years in High School, and stayed popular well into my 20’s and I don’t know when I started missing episode, and it’s still entertaining if I catch a good one. I hated school. I was miserable and riddled with anxiety, and I was of course, and easy target. If you had asked me then, if I’d genuinely wish that type of feeling on anyone who’s just trying to understand their place, I’d say absolutely no! But I’d still use offensive language and said some shitty things. I was faintly aware of the hypocrisy, but a lot of it was per pressure of male friend groups, and anger would weigh over common decency. I even saw Trans people as their preferred gender right away, it was all emotional . Any of the things I did or said was absolutely misplaced anger. I never insulted anyone to their face, luckily. South Park didn’t hurt my going down that path. ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2024, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/problematic-or-potentially-harmful-film-television-shows/1001076/146 "2024-06-22T23:58:47Z")
> [@Grrr](#): > > The people watching are black. And they always laugh. > > Which makes me wonder does it make sense for white people to be more upset than the people being made fun of? That applies to serious media, as well. I helped shoot a DOT seat belt commercial. A member of a hiphop duo had lost his mother in a crash, which she probably would’ve survived if she’d been wearing a seatbelt. So we co-wrote a (very powerful) song and shot a poignant video of him and partner, with his friends playing basketball across the street from her church… where, of course, the mother’s ghost shows up. This was back in the early '90s, but I _just_ heard that our local state DOT was aghast at the time, because we’d had mostly white people filming blacks and “appropriating” “their” music. The head of our creative team got called into a meeting. Turns out, only the middle-aged white pencil-pushers had a problem. The black people were singing along with the commercial and thought it was great. [OMG, someone found it, 30+ years later…](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K3_oQrUpwQE) ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2024, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/problematic-or-potentially-harmful-film-television-shows/1001076/147 "2024-06-23T00:32:50Z")
> [@digs](#): > > The head of our creative team got called into a meeting. Turns out, only the middle-aged white pencil-pushers had a problem. The black people were singing along with the commercial and thought it was great. > > [OMG, someone found it, 30+ years later…](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K3_oQrUpwQE) Thats… pretty damn good. ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2024, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/problematic-or-potentially-harmful-film-television-shows/1001076/148 "2024-06-23T00:32:59Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Beavis and Butthead almost died re-enacting a school lesson about Ben Franklin using a key on a kite to discover electricity. Why is no one shocked by the consequences of respecting our founding fathers? What if kids start emulating Ben, or take a mistress like Tom, or get wooden grillz like George? We need to protect our children from patriotism! ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2024, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/problematic-or-potentially-harmful-film-television-shows/1001076/149 "2024-06-23T00:38:17Z")
> [@digs](#): > > or get wooden grillz like George? FYI, Old Geo Washington’s teeth were not wooden, one set was made from Hippo Ivory. ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2024, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/problematic-or-potentially-harmful-film-television-shows/1001076/150 "2024-06-23T01:33:32Z")
“Hippo Ivory? Your teeth are now Hippo Ivory?!? Who the hell is this George character, and which of your druggie friends told you about him?” “YOU did, Dad! I learned about him from YOU!” . > [@DrDeth](#): > > > [@digs](#): > > > > [OMG, someone found it, 30+ years later…](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K3_oQrUpwQE) > > Thats… pretty damn good. Wow… thanks [bows]. Half of my professional life was being a designer at ad agencies. It was a blast being on set, scribbling changes to the storyboards, building sets (did some of the graffiti on that school), and we had a camera crew on one of those train cars for smooth panning so I got to help build the track. But that meant I worked yet another 65-hour week, so I switched to teaching instead, so I could get to know my kids. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2024, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/problematic-or-potentially-harmful-film-television-shows/1001076/151 "2024-06-24T15:21:46Z")
> [@Slithy\_Tove](#): > > Even _Jeopardy!_ has a basis of strategy over skill. Maybe that’s why it’s failed repeatedly in its UK version. Instead _QI_ ran for years, with smart questions and answers followed by a brief, fun discussion on the topic. I’ve finally watched several episodes of **QI** , and you can’t compare it to **Jeopardy** at all. If anything, the US show **QI** most closely resembles \*\*Wait, Wait, Don’t Tell me \*\* on Public radio. Both are an excuse to get a group pf celebrities (mostly comics) together and toss questions at them as a background structure to let them come up with clever observations and retorts. The difference is that in QI it’s random pieces of knowledge and in Wait Wait it’s current events. Both Wait Wait and Jeopardy have been running in the US for ages. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2024, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/problematic-or-potentially-harmful-film-television-shows/1001076/152 "2024-06-24T19:14:11Z")
> [@Odesio](#): > > And they’re right. It’s not cool to make fun of transgender people in that manner. To say [It’s Pat](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/It%27s_Pat?wprov=sfla1) aged badly is quite the understatement. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2024, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/problematic-or-potentially-harmful-film-television-shows/1001076/153 "2024-06-24T19:25:13Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > I’ve finally watched several episodes of **QI** , and you can’t compare it to **Jeopardy** at all. If anything, the US show **QI** most closely resembles \*\*Wait, Wait, Don’t Tell me \*\* on Public radio. Both are an excuse to get a group pf celebrities (mostly comics) together and toss questions at them as a background structure to let them come up with clever observations and retorts. The difference is that in QI it’s random pieces of knowledge and in Wait Wait it’s current events. I really want to get ahold of US DvDs of all QI shows, with subtitles. > [@alphaboi867](#): > > To say [It’s Pat](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/It%27s_Pat?wprov=sfla1) aged badly is quite the understatement. It aged badly after the first, except the episode with Phil Hartman. Those were the only two funny episodes, and saying the first was 'funny" is a bit of a stretch. But Hartman can make nearly anything funny. ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2024, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/problematic-or-potentially-harmful-film-television-shows/1001076/154 "2024-06-24T20:54:06Z")
> [@alphaboi867](#): > > To say [It’s Pat](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/It%27s_Pat?wprov=sfla1) aged badly is quite the understatement. There is something to consider. Pat was never the butt of the joke. The butt of the joke was everyone who was stymied because they couldn’t figure Pat out. Pat was a happy person who was perfectly comfortable in their own skin. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2024, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/problematic-or-potentially-harmful-film-television-shows/1001076/155 "2024-06-24T21:14:54Z")
And yet, Julia Sweeney appeared on the Showtime series _[Work in Progress](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Work_in_Progress_(TV_series))_ as a fictionalized version of herself. The main character of the series, played by Abby McEnany, is a self-described fat, queer dyke who tells the fictional version of Julia Sweeney how uncomfortable the character of Pat made her feel. ---
**Author:** ![MyFootsZZZ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/myfootszzz/32/12580_2.png) [@MyFootsZZZ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MyFootsZZZ)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2024, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/problematic-or-potentially-harmful-film-television-shows/1001076/156 "2024-06-24T21:26:54Z")
Sweeney kicks butt. > **[Julia Sweeney: How Does A Person Go From Believer To Atheist?](https://www.npr.org/2019/08/23/753457270/julia-sweeney-how-does-a-person-go-from-believer-to-atheist)** > > When two young Mormon missionaries knock on performer Julia Sweeney's door one day, it touches off a quest to completely rethink her own beliefs. ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2024, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/problematic-or-potentially-harmful-film-television-shows/1001076/157 "2024-06-24T22:12:53Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > And yet, Julia Sweeney appeared on the Showtime series _[Work in Progress](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Work_in_Progress_(TV_series))_ as a fictionalized version of herself. The main character of the series, played by Abby McEnany, is a self-described fat, queer dyke who tells the fictional version of Julia Sweeney how uncomfortable the character of Pat made her feel. And? I’m not arguing the character Pat is okay or that we should reintroduce them. But in the past, queer characters were very often the butt of the joke. Objects of ridicule. Compare Pat to the characters from _In Living Color’s_ popular Men on Film sketches where being gay was the joke. The jokes around It’s Pat centered around people not knowing. To me that’s a big difference. And honestly, back in the 1990s, I don’t know many people would have recognized Pat as a queer character. Non-binary wasn’t a think in mainstream circles back then. But yes, it’s certainly aged poorly. ---
**Author:** ![NDP](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ndp/32/55_2.png) [@NDP](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NDP)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2024, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/problematic-or-potentially-harmful-film-television-shows/1001076/158 "2024-06-24T22:38:05Z")
> [@Odesio](#): > > There is something to consider. Pat was never the butt of the joke. The butt of the joke was everyone who was stymied because they couldn’t figure Pat out. Pat was a happy person who was perfectly comfortable in their own skin. Just out of curiosity, would it have been worse if Pat were not good-natured but instead extremely touchy and prone to lashing out at any perceived slight or insult, regardless of how innocent the other person’s comment is? ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2024, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/problematic-or-potentially-harmful-film-television-shows/1001076/159 "2024-06-24T22:42:03Z")
> [@NDP](#): > > Just out of curiosity, would it have been worse if Pat were not good-natured but instead extremely touchy and prone to lashing out at any perceived slight or insult, regardless of how innocent the other person’s comment is? Ha! SNL touched on this subject when Jason Alexander hosted and he kept making gaffs regarding the identities of some black coworkers he just met. But to answer your question, I don’t know if it’d be better or worse but it’d be more relevant. You go into some far right or far left spaces and don’t say the magic words you might find a lot of anger directed your way. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2024, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/problematic-or-potentially-harmful-film-television-shows/1001076/160 "2024-06-24T22:45:53Z")
> [@NDP](#): > > Just out of curiosity, would it have been worse if Pat were not good-natured but instead extremely touchy and prone to lashing out at any perceived slight or insult, regardless of how innocent the other person’s comment is? I don’t think I’ve seen the Pat sketches since they originally aired, but as far as I remember, the “butt of the joke” was how uncomfortable people get when they can’t tell someone’s gender (and so they, for example, don’t know what pronouns to use). That wouldn’t have worked (or at least not in the same way) if Pat had been touchy and lashed out). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/problematic-or-potentially-harmful-film-television-shows/1001076.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/problematic-or-potentially-harmful-film-television-shows/1001076.md?page=9)