# Professor Asks a Stuttering Student \[ed.\] to Pose Qs Before or After Class **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 12, 2011, 4:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/professor-asks-a-stuttering-student-ed-to-pose-qs-before-or-after-class/599392 "2011-10-12T04:59:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Vihaga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Vihaga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Vihaga)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2011, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/professor-asks-a-stuttering-student-ed-to-pose-qs-before-or-after-class/599392/101 "2011-10-14T17:51:15Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > Expecting that students will learn how to deal with differences around them and to put them in situations in which, for example, they have to be patient and accommodate the weaknesses of people around them, is not unproductive. In fact, it is probably equally as important as the substantive subject matter of any class. I disagree. If I’m paying 10K a year (I didn’t look it up, I ballparked public university tuition) to learn about calculous, biochemistry, or Russian literature, I want to learn about those things. I don’t give a crap about life lessons about dealing with people with disabilities. To me, this would be like a wheelchair-bound student not wanting to sit in one of the accessible rows in a classroom because it’s not right up front. There’s already an alternative for him to learn what he needs (like writing questions or going to office hours), and the fact that he doesn’t _prefer_ it does not make the current accommodation less reasonable. Having a disability entitles you to reasonable accommodations. It does not entitle you to drag everyone else down to your speed. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2011, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/professor-asks-a-stuttering-student-ed-to-pose-qs-before-or-after-class/599392/102 "2011-10-14T18:01:52Z")
> [@Vihaga](#): > > I disagree. If I’m paying 10K a year (I didn’t look it up, I ballparked public university tuition) to learn about calculous, biochemistry, or Russian literature, I want to learn about those things. I don’t give a crap about life lessons about dealing with people with disabilities. Really, you’re the one being selfish and snowflakey. College is not like a private tutor whose sole responsibility is to cram facts into your head with no need to notice or accommodate the others around you. A college is education in a social context, which means you are also learning how to interact with people who are different from you. ---
**Author:** ![Vihaga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Vihaga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Vihaga)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2011, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/professor-asks-a-stuttering-student-ed-to-pose-qs-before-or-after-class/599392/103 "2011-10-14T18:07:27Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > Really, you’re the one being selfish and snowflakey. College is not like a private tutor whose sole responsibility is to cram facts into your head with no need to notice or accommodate the others around you. A college is education in a social context, which means you are also learning how to interact with people who are different from you. I want to know how, exactly, that the kid having to write down his questions or ask them during office hours prevents him from getting the education promised by the class. Because it’s quite clear how his wasting class time prevents the other students from getting it. Why is it fine for him and not for them? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2011, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/professor-asks-a-stuttering-student-ed-to-pose-qs-before-or-after-class/599392/104 "2011-10-14T18:11:12Z")
> [@Vihaga](#): > > I want to know how, exactly, that the kid having to write down his questions or ask them during office hours prevents him from getting the education promised by the class. Because it’s quite clear how his wasting class time prevents the other students from getting it. > Why is it fine for him and not for them? Because he’s not able to give or get responses from the other students, and give-and-take with the students (not just the professor) is also part of how you learn in class. Everybody is already allowed to go to office hours and email questions to the professor, including this student. He would be the only one who is forced to use those options exclusively. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2011, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/professor-asks-a-stuttering-student-ed-to-pose-qs-before-or-after-class/599392/105 "2011-10-14T18:14:11Z")
> [@Vihaga](#): > > I want to know how, exactly, that the kid having to write down his questions or ask them during office hours prevents him from getting the education promised by the class. Because it’s quite clear how his wasting class time prevents the other students from getting it. > Why is it fine for him and not for them? Because I categorically reject the assumption that letting a stutterer get an occasional question out is not obviously a waste of time for anyone. It’s only “quite clear” to someone with a very narrow view of what education is. And having to submit written questions denies him the ability to do what everyone else in class has the option to do … engage the _class_ in a conversation about the topic at hand. If the entire class was limited to submitting questions in writing or during office hours, that would be different, but there’s a reason that most good teachers of any kind don’t have rules like that. One of the benefits of teaching in a face-to-face class setting is the opportunity to interact. Ban that and you might as well just read a book. ---
**Author:** ![Vihaga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Vihaga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Vihaga)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2011, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/professor-asks-a-stuttering-student-ed-to-pose-qs-before-or-after-class/599392/106 "2011-10-14T18:16:51Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Because he’s not able to give or get responses from the other students, and give-and-take with the students (not just the professor) is also part of how you learn in class. Everybody is already allowed to go to office hours and email questions to the professor, including this student. He would be the only one who is forced to use those options exclusively. Perhaps I found class discussions to be mind-numbingly worthless at the undergrad level, so I’m not overly convinced of their power as an educational tool. Mostly they seemed like an opportunity for the professor to correct the students’ most asinine misconceptions. So, how much time is it appropriate for him to waste? 10%? 30% When does the need to get through the material come before his assuredly insightful questions? ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2011, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/professor-asks-a-stuttering-student-ed-to-pose-qs-before-or-after-class/599392/107 "2011-10-14T18:23:56Z")
> [@Vihaga](#): > > Perhaps I found class discussions to be mind-numbingly worthless at the undergrad level, so I’m not overly convinced of their power as an educational tool. Mostly they seemed like an opportunity for the professor to correct the students’ most asinine misconceptions. Yeah, I have encountered some number of people with that attitude. Some of them manage to learn something about the world and the people around them. Some of them don’t. That doesn’t mean that the approach was wrong. It’s not going to work with everybody. > [@](#): > > So, how much time is it appropriate for him to waste? 10%? 30% When does the need to get through the material come before his assuredly insightful questions? I still don’t accept that anyone has definitively established “waste” in this case. Anyway, is that the level of detail we’ve reached? I thought we were talking about a complete ban. Are you conceding that a total ban is inappropriate? ---
**Author:** ![Vihaga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Vihaga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Vihaga)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2011, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/professor-asks-a-stuttering-student-ed-to-pose-qs-before-or-after-class/599392/108 "2011-10-14T18:29:12Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > Are you conceding that a total ban is inappropriate? I said I thought him writing his questions during class would be better, but I don’t think a ban was entirely inappropriate, because I wasn’t there. It could have been, or not, depending on how much time we’re talking about. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2011, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/professor-asks-a-stuttering-student-ed-to-pose-qs-before-or-after-class/599392/109 "2011-10-14T18:38:13Z")
> [@Vihaga](#): > > Perhaps I found class discussions to be mind-numbingly worthless at the undergrad level, so I’m not overly convinced of their power as an educational tool. Mostly they seemed like an opportunity for the professor to correct the students’ most asinine misconceptions. Even if they are worthless, it doesn’t mean he should be barred from participating. > [@](#): > > So, how much time is it appropriate for him to waste? 10%? 30% When does the need to get through the material come before his assuredly insightful questions? The two students who were quoted in the first article said he didn’t take much more time than anyone else. I’m skeptical that he is wasting anybody’s time. I think that would indicate a self-important attitude on the students’ part if they see somebody with a stutter and decide he should curtail his participation so he doesn’t waste _their_ time rather than considering that it’s more difficult for him than it is for them. ---
**Author:** ![bldysabba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecccb3/32.png) [@bldysabba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bldysabba)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2011, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/professor-asks-a-stuttering-student-ed-to-pose-qs-before-or-after-class/599392/110 "2011-10-14T18:49:52Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally Posted by Marley23 > Philip’s ability to participate fully in the class is more important than the students’ and professor’s desire not to have their time wasted. > > > [@bldysabba](#): > > > > Why exactly? I would still appreciate a response to this. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2011, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/professor-asks-a-stuttering-student-ed-to-pose-qs-before-or-after-class/599392/111 "2011-10-14T20:16:38Z")
> [@CitizenPained](#): > > Hmm. I actually learned that in a university class. wait, you had a college professor tell his students they had “question tickets” to spend in class or it was a teaching technique taught in college for use in teaching young children? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2011, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/professor-asks-a-stuttering-student-ed-to-pose-qs-before-or-after-class/599392/112 "2011-10-14T20:19:36Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > I still don’t accept that anyone has definitively established “waste” in this case. I’m prepared to take the teacher’s word for it, myself, at least until such time as somebody produces a recording of a class session. Even then, I still lean toward giving the teacher some discretionary control to make the class run smoother as the teacher sees fit. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2011, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/professor-asks-a-stuttering-student-ed-to-pose-qs-before-or-after-class/599392/113 "2011-10-14T20:20:24Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > You can’t give somebody with a stutter a device that lets him speak faster. Allowing him to submit his questions in writing or email is closer, but it does still stop him from engaging in discussions with other students and you’re still telling him _not_ to do something, which is going to be discouraging. All of which is intended to be taken as a theoretical discussion, not a comment on the Morris College situation. typing his questions absolutely allows him to communicate in a timely manner unless he stutters when he types. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2011, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/professor-asks-a-stuttering-student-ed-to-pose-qs-before-or-after-class/599392/114 "2011-10-14T20:22:35Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > Oh, so his offense is that he bypassed the chain of command? Is he in the marines? Yes, yes it is. And he should join the Marines. That will give him something to really bitch about. He could have gone the department head. He could have gone the dean (hell, he declined an offer to meet with the dean). Hell, there is probably a “special snowflake student services” department/do your student bitching here department on campus somewhere. But it sounds to me like he wanted to throw a tantrum and make a scene instead rather than work something out. So, lets say its a three hour semester course. About 3 hours of class time a week for lets say 16 weeks. Lets call that 45 hours of class instruction time. Okay, now lets say we allow 10 percent of that time for questions. Now we are down to 4.5 hours. Lets say there are only 22 students in the class. Thats .2 hours per student for the whole semester. 12 minutes for 16 weeks. Less than a minute per week. If this guy was asking lots of questions and being damn slow about it he was probably over his fair shair of time pretty damn quick. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2011, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/professor-asks-a-stuttering-student-ed-to-pose-qs-before-or-after-class/599392/115 "2011-10-14T20:41:59Z")
His “fair share”? Are questions like cash that only one person at a time can benefit from? It makes me think you’ve never actually been in a classroom. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2011, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/professor-asks-a-stuttering-student-ed-to-pose-qs-before-or-after-class/599392/116 "2011-10-14T20:51:45Z")
> [@billfish678](#): > > Yes, yes it is. And he should join the Marines. That will give him something to really bitch about. He could have gone the department head. He could have gone the dean (hell, he declined an offer to meet with the dean). Hell, there is probably a “special snowflake student services” department/do your student bitching here department on campus somewhere. But it sounds to me like he wanted to throw a tantrum and make a scene instead rather than work something out. > > So, lets say its a three hour semester course. About 3 hours of class time a week for lets say 16 weeks. Lets call that 45 hours of class instruction time. Okay, now lets say we allow 10 percent of that time for questions. Now we are down to 4.5 hours. Lets say there are only 22 students in the class. Thats .2 hours per student for the whole semester. 12 minutes for 16 weeks. Less than a minute per week. If this guy was asking lots of questions and being damn slow about it he was probably over his fair shair of time pretty damn quick. My gut reaction to the first article was “special snowflake syndrome”. The teacher’s version is probably a more reasoned an accurate one but of course that’s no guarantee. IMO an outgoing chatty HS sophomore isn’t likely to interact on the same level as a college age student and wouldn’t grasp the situation properly. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2011, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/professor-asks-a-stuttering-student-ed-to-pose-qs-before-or-after-class/599392/117 "2011-10-14T20:52:34Z")
> [@bldysabba](#): > > I would still appreciate a response to this. The answer is in post #94. > [@Magiver](#): > > typing his questions absolutely allows him to communicate in a timely manner unless he stutters when he types. That’s charming, but it has nothing to do with what I said. My objection isn’t to the time this would take, although when you get down to it, having him type an answer and give it to someone else to read is unlikely to save you much time. What I was saying is that he can’t participate in discussions during class. I think most of the classes I took in college would have occasional discussions - you didn’t just ask the professor questions, you would sometimes talk to each other, play off another student’s question, disagree with him, and so on, nevermind when the professor would ask questions to the class (evidently not an option for the student in this hypothetical). If two other students are discussing an issue and he wants to respond, the closest he can come to participating is writing or typing an answer and letting someone else read it. I know everybody likes to go on about how in the old days, school toughtened them up and kids today are a bunch of snowflake indigo pussies, but the argument here is not exactly extreme. The idea is that _maybe_ it’s not alright for a college professor to tell a student “You are not allowed to ask questions because your disability makes you speak slowly.” ---
**Author:** ![Kolga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e56c9b/32.png) [@Kolga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolga)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2011, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/professor-asks-a-stuttering-student-ed-to-pose-qs-before-or-after-class/599392/118 "2011-10-14T20:53:37Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > wait, you had a college professor tell his students they had “question tickets” to spend in class or it was a teaching technique taught in college for use in teaching young children? Unfortunately, yes. This is a technique recommended not only to limit the people who must always answer every question posed and will not shut up, but to also force those who refuse to participate to speak. I have…extremely ambivalent…feelings about it, and never use it, personally. > [@billfish678](#): > > He could have gone the department head. He could have gone the dean (hell, he declined an offer to meet with the dean). He had, according to the new article, several scheduled meetings with the professor and the Dean, but backed out of them. He was also supposed to send her an email with concerns, but chose not to. I still lean toward an explanation that while the professor probably could have handled this better, the student probably also wanted to throw a temper tantrum. ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2011, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/professor-asks-a-stuttering-student-ed-to-pose-qs-before-or-after-class/599392/119 "2011-10-14T20:59:40Z")
> [@Kolga](#): > > I still lean toward an explanation that while the professor probably could have handled this better, the student probably also wanted to throw a temper tantrum. I agree with this. And you are much more succinct about it than I would have been. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2011, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/professor-asks-a-stuttering-student-ed-to-pose-qs-before-or-after-class/599392/120 "2011-10-14T21:05:46Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > His “fair share”? Are questions like cash that only one person at a time can benefit from? It makes me think you’ve never actually been in a classroom. I took math and science classes and we generally didnt have deal with such sillyness as is the story here. You learned your shit and you took your tests. And you cried after you got them back. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/professor-asks-a-stuttering-student-ed-to-pose-qs-before-or-after-class/599392.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/professor-asks-a-stuttering-student-ed-to-pose-qs-before-or-after-class/599392.md?page=7)