# Progressive Apologism for Islam: why? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 16, 2016, 5:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/progressive-apologism-for-islam-why/760028 "2016-07-16T05:49:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2016, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/progressive-apologism-for-islam-why/760028/141 "2016-07-17T17:42:43Z")
> [@UberArchetype](#): > > It time to get the things flowing again. It takes alot of resolve go out hunting and killing people, but that’s what needs to be done. Said from that nice comfy easy chair. ---
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2016, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/progressive-apologism-for-islam-why/760028/142 "2016-07-17T17:43:37Z")
> [@UberArchetype](#): > > I did it for 9 months in Bosnia. > > Now you’re just talking shit. You are clueless. Well, no. I mean I am talking shit, but I’m not clueless. I’m talking shit in the effort to make a point. Based on your last post you seem to feel Islam is the problem and to correct the problem all Muslims need to be taken care of. I’m asking for clarification because you are being vague. Get specific please. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2016, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/progressive-apologism-for-islam-why/760028/143 "2016-07-17T17:50:14Z")
> [@UberArchetype](#): > > It’s not easy, pleasant OR politically correct. That’s why the notion seems unpalatable to so many lacking the wherewithal to do what needs to be done. It won’t get done until enough people pull their heads out of their collective asses and get on with it. We got things started post 9-11 when nationalistic sentiment was high, but things change. Administrations for one, come to mind. So it’s ebbing. The Islamic supporters in this thread just love that. Let’s talk it out and try to determine the real problem. Riiiight. If you personally have not figured it out, consider yourself intellectually blind to the issues of Islam. Please, do explain to us your _final solution_, then. ---
**Author:** ![Go\_Arachnid\_Laser\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b2d939/32.png) [@Go\_Arachnid\_Laser\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Go_Arachnid_Laser_1)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2016, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/progressive-apologism-for-islam-why/760028/144 "2016-07-17T17:56:54Z")
> [@UberArchetype](#): > > I did it for 9 months in Bosnia. > > Now you’re just talking shit. You are clueless. Now, at first I assumed that you meant that you were there as part of the NATO forces, which is puzzling since you would have been there pretty much to protect the Muslim population… but then I realized that I don’t know your location, so nothing really tells me which side you were on. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2016, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/progressive-apologism-for-islam-why/760028/145 "2016-07-17T18:04:28Z")
> [@Go\_Arachnid\_Laser](#): > > Now, at first I assumed that you meant that you were there as part of the NATO forces, which is puzzling since you would have been there pretty much to protect the Muslim population… but then I realized that I don’t know your location, so nothing really tells me which side you were on. Or if he’s telling the truth instead of relating his personal armchair fantasy. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2016, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/progressive-apologism-for-islam-why/760028/146 "2016-07-17T18:07:23Z")
> [@Go\_Arachnid\_Laser](#): > > but then I realized that I don’t know your location, so nothing really tells me which side you were on. The claim of using any means necessary in Bosnia, combined with his views on Islam, should tell you. Not that there’s any evidence he did anything but change the channel back then, either. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2016, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/progressive-apologism-for-islam-why/760028/147 "2016-07-17T18:17:01Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > The claim of using any means necessary in Bosnia, combined with his views on Islam, should tell you. > > Not that there’s any evidence he did anything but change the channel back then, either. 101st Chairborne… ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2016, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/progressive-apologism-for-islam-why/760028/148 "2016-07-17T18:20:51Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > 101st Chairborne… He’s a BarcaRanger. ---
**Author:** ![Emiliana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f0a364/32.png) [@Emiliana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Emiliana)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2016, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/progressive-apologism-for-islam-why/760028/149 "2016-07-17T18:27:11Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > Out of curiosity, just how old are you ? Not old enough to have a fricking clue about communism. Inarticulate and nonsensical references to communism are a hallmark of a particularly racist, anti-Semetic, and hate-mongering corner of the internet where our friend Derek Michael appears to hang out. ---
**Author:** ![UberArchetype](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/2bfe46/32.png) [@UberArchetype](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UberArchetype)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2016, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/progressive-apologism-for-islam-why/760028/150 "2016-07-17T18:30:54Z")
Please feel free to review the photo-documentary of my exploits in Bosnia at this [link.](http://stuff.is-a-geek.net/PhotoAlbum/Bosnia/Bosnia.htm) Then go fuck yourselves. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2016, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/progressive-apologism-for-islam-why/760028/151 "2016-07-17T18:35:47Z")
That picture of the volleyball net in the gymnasium is a chilling testimony to the threat of international Islamic terrorism. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2016, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/progressive-apologism-for-islam-why/760028/152 "2016-07-17T18:42:55Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > That picture of the volleyball net in the gymnasium is a chilling testimony to the threat of international Islamic terrorism. They look [dangerous.](http://stuff.is-a-geek.net/PhotoAlbum/Bosnia/Pics/Bosnia_40.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2016, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/progressive-apologism-for-islam-why/760028/153 "2016-07-17T18:43:33Z")
> [@UberArchetype](#): > > Please feel free to review the photo-documentary of my exploits in Bosnia at this [link.](http://stuff.is-a-geek.net/PhotoAlbum/Bosnia/Bosnia.htm) > > Then go fuck yourselves. You do remember you were defending Muslim Bosnians and Croatians from Serbian atrocities? However did you tell the good guys from the ones to be weeded out? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2016, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/progressive-apologism-for-islam-why/760028/154 "2016-07-17T18:56:30Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > You do remember you were defending Muslim Bosnians and Croatians from Serbian atrocities? However did you tell the good guys from the ones to be weeded out? Probably wasn’t that difficult. According to the EXIF data, he was there in mid 2002. ---
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2016, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/progressive-apologism-for-islam-why/760028/155 "2016-07-17T19:00:57Z")
> [@UberArchetype](#): > > Please feel free to review the photo-documentary of my exploits in Bosnia at this [link.](http://stuff.is-a-geek.net/PhotoAlbum/Bosnia/Bosnia.htm) > > Then go fuck yourselves. Oh ignore them. I am legitimately interested. When you say by any means necessary what do you actually mean? Obviously you don’t have a magic wand, and offering a blood sacrifice of your loved ones won’t actually bring about world peace. So let’s get serious. Do you think nukes are a good idea? Do you want to redirect all military to one region? Shock and Awe? What are you thinking? I gave you (well the thread) my answer. What is yours? Only fair right? ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2016, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/progressive-apologism-for-islam-why/760028/156 "2016-07-17T19:03:05Z")
> [@UberArchetype](#): > > Please feel free to review the photo-documentary of my exploits in Bosnia at this [link.](http://stuff.is-a-geek.net/PhotoAlbum/Bosnia/Bosnia.htm) > > Then go fuck yourselves. According to the home page for that photo album, “you” were in Bosnia in **2002** , “supporting computer and communications systems for the Allied Military Intelligence Battalion.” That sure sounds like Special Forces hunter-sniper work to me…long after the actual hostilities were over. (The Dayton Accords were signed in 1995…) ---
**Author:** ![Go\_Arachnid\_Laser\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b2d939/32.png) [@Go\_Arachnid\_Laser\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Go_Arachnid_Laser_1)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2016, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/progressive-apologism-for-islam-why/760028/157 "2016-07-17T19:17:07Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > According to the home page for that photo album, “you” were in Bosnia in **2002** , “supporting computer and communications systems for the Allied Military Intelligence Battalion.” > > That sure sounds like Special Forces hunter-sniper work to me…long after the actual hostilities were over. (The Dayton Accords were signed in 1995…) If that’s true, well, I guess that technically is not stolen valor, but he did heavily imply a very different story. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2016, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/progressive-apologism-for-islam-why/760028/158 "2016-07-17T19:29:51Z")
> [@Go\_Arachnid\_Laser](#): > > If that’s true, well, I guess that technically is not stolen valor, but he did heavily imply a very different story. If it’s actually HIS website. But there’s no easy way to prove or disprove that, so it’s kind of moot. ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2016, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/progressive-apologism-for-islam-why/760028/159 "2016-07-17T19:53:42Z")
I’m constantly bemused by the “it was terrorism”/“no it wasn’t terrorism” arguments that go on in threads like this one. As if, were we to find one smoking gun facebook post that proves that the asshole-in-Nice had actually read some ISIS propaganda, well, then it was Terrorism, and it was Islam’s fault!!! But if not, then it was just a crime, and Islam was in no way related at all!!! (There was also a lot of this after the San Bernadino shootings, in which the asshole seemed to be motivated by Islam, but the choice of target was not a prominent high value target, but just his office party.) My point is, it doesn’t particularly matter, and it’s not a black and white issue. You can’t just sort all evil actors into “terrorist, terrorist, criminal, terrorist, criminal, insane guy”. And if you could, it’s not like it would then prove something about the overall question, one way or the other. It’s basically impossible that the asshole-in-Nice was in no way influenced by the atmosphere of Islamic violence that pervades France these days. He may have “self-radicalized”. He may have just been mentally ill. Quibbling over the potentially unknowable details, as if it suddenly becomes a victory for one side or the other if we learn whether or not he was shouting Alluha Akbar, is just pointless. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2016, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/progressive-apologism-for-islam-why/760028/160 "2016-07-17T20:11:58Z")
> [@El\_Kabong](#): > > Thank you for being slightly more clear, although I think most people would say you are clearly implying that “defending Islam” means that one is in fact supporting the cultural behaviors you metioned. > > Doesn’t matter, though: I for one have never ‘defended’ Islam; I am on record in this very thread as rejecting all religions. I believe the term “bunch of hooey” was used. I seriously doubt “most of the board’s posters” are “defending Islam” either. What I, and anyone else who can be bothered to engage with bigots such as your fine self, are objecting to, is your apparent willingness to embrace repression of a large group on the specious notion that a small subset of that group accurately represents the intentions of the larger group. > > I’m not claiming, and never have, that there is nothing to reject in the cultural behavior of certain countries which are also muslim-majority. There is no argument there; you don’t need to trot out the same old polls again and again. What would be good for you, the OP and **Mr. Natural** to do is to kindly stop fucking around and be clear as to what degree of oppression of muslims will satisfy you. My, but you people do go on. This is a thread about liberal apologism of Islam. No one is advocating ‘genocide’ or ‘oppression’, they’re just wondering why the same (or worse, given the extreme nature of the offenses) criticisms aren’t leveled at Islam for widespread behavior, beliefs and practices that even a hint of draws liberal ire when committed by Americans, conservatives, and/or Christians. I’ve never heard a single liberal on this board “fight the bigotry” (as **BigT** ) involved in broad-brush criticisms of these groups, nor have I ever seen anyone pointing out that ‘hey, not all Christians bomb abortion clinics’ or ‘hey, most conservatives don’t really hate homosexuals’, etc., etc. In other words, you guys seem to know instinctively how to deal with religions and ideologies you don’t like here in the U.S. by slamming, insulting, mocking and degrading them (not to mention trying to repress them as much as you can), so why don’t you do the same with a religion and ideology whose offenses are far worse and far more accepted and widespread than any of the things you get so het up over when a Christian or conservative or Republican is perceived to have done them? Instead you take an exact opposite tack and defend Islam at every opportunity, when, like I said, you’d become hysterical if anyone in the U.S. were to attempt to instigate any of its most widespread and widely supported views on…just about anything. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/progressive-apologism-for-islam-why/760028.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/progressive-apologism-for-islam-why/760028.md?page=9)