That headline is misleading (not surprising coming from Breitbart). 51% of Muslim Americans believe that American Muslims should be able to live under Sharia if they wish (which they already can).
Pretty shitty cite.
Wiki on The Center for Security Policy
…allegedly uttered the “I fear we have awoken a sleeping giant.” Or something to that effect?
I wonder if any of the ISIL/'Qeida leaders are having similar sentiments yet?
Nah, doubt it. They’re just batshit crazy SOB’s too stupid to realize they’ve signed their own death warrants. This discussion is moot to anyone who actually understands on which side of that fence they sit.
No.
We had a different world view in those days regarding killing civilians.
ISIS is not an established state/nation and most, if not nearly all, of the civilians in the areas ISIS occupies are truly innocent.
Who’s “we?”
On the contrary, they are quite well established. Maybe not formally recognized political entities, but certainly quite well established.
Civilian status is an interesting topic for another conversation.
So let’s assume you righties are correct; Islam is fundamentally evil and inherently anathema to Truth, Justice, and the American Way, and there’s absolutely nothing that any western culture can do to change that.
What do you propose we do about it?
Kill them all?
Forcibly convert them to Christianity?
Abolish the First Amendment?
Build a wall around Islamia and make ISIS pay for it?
Ha. I tried for a couple hours last night to get your bleeding heart buddies to offer some suggestions as to how we can quell the violence, the killing perpetrated by the terrorists. All I got were personal attacks and insults.
edit: Well, one guy did suggest that we could appeal to them with reason. That was a good one.
You know the bleeding hearts that I sympathize with? The families of the victims killed for no apparent reason other than they lived a lifestyle or believed differently than did the killers. I sympathize with my friend in Paris who had other friends killed in the nightclub. I sympathize with the friends and families of the thousands killed in the Twin Towers attack. That’s the kind of people I sympathize with.
Here’s a few ideas;
- Stress the commonalities between Muslim people and families, and western/Christian/American people and families
- Show through words and actions that Muslim terrorists are the enemies not just of westerners, but of non-extremist Muslims as well
- Highlight examples of American Muslim success stories
- Put a spotlight on Muslim philosophers who teach that Islam does not support or advocate terrorism
- Reach out to LBGT Muslims and show them that America is far more welcoming to them than extremist regimes
- Support the idea, as George W. Bush did, that Islam is a religion of peace and there is no inherent conflict between Islam and the US
If you go on telling all Muslims that there’s no difference between them and ISIS or al-Qaeda, then you’re only going to drive a wedge that will encourage further extremism. The way to defeat Muslim extremism is by showing the majority of peaceful Muslims that they’re better off siding with us than with them.
You seem like a reasonable fellow. I hope you are right, but I fear you are not.
Is that how you recall that going? Good thing there is an actual record.
You never answered my question about if you are in favor of forcibly removing all Muslims from the west as a solution. What is your solution. Do you believe that all Muslims are terrorists or terrorists in waiting? You use the term Muslim and terrorist interchangeably in that other thread so I assume so.
For the record, I am in favor of using police and military intervention to fight ISIS. I am happy to arrest people who have been caught in conspiracy to commit terrorist attacks. I also think that the best way to end the violence is with acceptance of the other 90ish percent of Muslims who want nothing to do with the killing. ISIS and other terrorist groups use people like you to show the isolated and uneducated Muslims that the West hates them and that they either need to kill us or we will kill them.
Spewing hate helps ISIS. Stop helping ISIS Mr. Natural.
No, they aren’t. We are fighting bigotry. It’s your side that turns fighting bigotry into defending people’s beliefs.
Your cites prove one thing: there are Muslims who do not believe these bad things. That inherently means that, if you blame Islam as a whole for it, you are wrong. There must be some other causative factor besides Islam itself. (In the case of your cites, probably the culture of the country.)
And we do in fact keep this separation for Christianity. Christianity is still majority homophobic, and was even more so during the early days of this board. Yet, any time someone tried to call Christianity homophobic, they would get blasted for it, with people citing Christians that weren’t. This proves that Christianity itself does not cause homophobia.
For fuck’s sake, what do you think it accomplishes to attack someone’s religion instead of attacking their erroneous beliefs? Especially when their religion has as a tenet that they will be attacked for their beliefs? You’re just reinforcing that you are the devil and thus everything you say must be wrong.
We are attacking a bigot and his bigoted helpers. Not “defending Islam.” Not a single person has said “Islam as a religion is good.” They’ve said that the majority of Muslims are peaceful.
Not agreeing with the bigots is not the same as defending something.
How about the civilian deaths by terrorists in Muslim countries? The terror in Irak, Turkey, the murders of Shi’a followers? You sympathize with them?
How about we, and by “we” I mean every civilized country in the world, just get on with the business of weeding out the bad guys and get it over with? The sooner the better, by any means necessary. People are getting hurt on both sides. When does rational common sense kick in?
That won’t sit well with the apologists, et al. and that’s why the bastards are resurgent and able to continue to get away with this shit. Europe is seeing the chickens of their open borders and other EU policies now coming home to roost. Their real financial crises is just around the corner and will make terrorist attacks seem trivial after the whole mess really starts to unwind. It’s time to clean house.
Thank you for being slightly more clear, although I think most people would say you are clearly implying that “defending Islam” means that one is in fact supporting the cultural behaviors you metioned.
Doesn’t matter, though: I for one have never ‘defended’ Islam; I am on record in this very thread as rejecting all religions. I believe the term “bunch of hooey” was used. I seriously doubt “most of the board’s posters” are “defending Islam” either. What I, and anyone else who can be bothered to engage with bigots such as your fine self, are objecting to, is your apparent willingness to embrace repression of a large group on the specious notion that a small subset of that group accurately represents the intentions of the larger group.
I’m not claiming, and never have, that there is nothing to reject in the cultural behavior of certain countries which are also muslim-majority. There is no argument there; you don’t need to trot out the same old polls again and again. What would be good for you, the OP and Mr. Natural to do is to kindly stop fucking around and be clear as to what degree of oppression of muslims will satisfy you.
I’m all for going after the bad guys, which requires nuance and specificity and not going after or denouncing the millions of peaceful Muslims who don’t support terrorism or violence.
Let’s be specific and go after the ones who are dangerous, and make sure we don’t lump in peaceful people with the assholes.
If you have a magic wand that will jail all the world’s criminals and murderers and general bad guys… Why are you keeping this a secret? It’s so easy! Let’s just do it.
You say by any means necessary. Do you mean that? Would you willingly sacrifice your life and the lives of every person you have ever loved to make this happen? Because by any means necessary usually means a lot of people who have done nothing wrong are going to die. Are you OK with that being all your loved ones rather than the loved ones of a faceless stranger?
It’s not easy, pleasant OR politically correct. That’s why the notion seems unpalatable to so many lacking the wherewithal to do what needs to be done. It won’t get done until enough people pull their heads out of their collective asses and get on with it. We got things started post 9-11 when nationalistic sentiment was high, but things change. Administrations for one, come to mind. So it’s ebbing. The Islamic supporters in this thread just love that. Let’s talk it out and try to determine the real problem. Riiiight. If you personally have not figured it out, consider yourself intellectually blind to the issues of Islam.
It time to get the things flowing again. It takes alot of resolve go out hunting and killing people, but that’s what needs to be done.
I did it for 9 months in Bosnia.
Now you’re just talking shit. You are clueless.