# Prometheus Question: The Engineer Attacking **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 20, 2016, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prometheus-question-the-engineer-attacking/757909 "2016-06-20T19:39:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![River\_Hippie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/river_hippie/32/26_2.png) [@River\_Hippie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/River_Hippie)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2016, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prometheus-question-the-engineer-attacking/757909/41 "2016-06-26T21:35:34Z")
Yes, thanks **Blake**! It’s one of those movies I love despite the industrial grade suspension of disbelief needed. Your post shed some light on the topic of this thread which is something that puzzled me. Did that script explain the opening sequence any better? ---
**Author:** ![Hail\_Ants](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/dc4da7/32.png) [@Hail\_Ants](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hail_Ants)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2016, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prometheus-question-the-engineer-attacking/757909/42 "2016-06-27T22:21:56Z")
> [@Blake](#): > > The original script varied quite a lot from what we finally saw, but a lot of the material wasn’t re-shot, so we ended up with a mess. > > In the original script, the Engineer had been infected by “something”, possibly the black tar, possibly something connected with it, possibly something the tar was supposed to counteract. To save his life, his crew had placed him into suspended animation. Then his crew got slaughtered. > > When Weyland woke him up, it was a death sentence. His ship wasn’t working. he had no one around to treat his infection, and he couldn’t go back into suspended animation. > > That did not make him happy. > > Then he realised that the humans either had been infected by the same thing that had infected him. So he set out to destroy them all so that they couldn’t spread the infection. When he discovers that some humans had escaped in another spaceship earlier, he sets out to sterilise the Earth. The humans stop him, and leave on another spaceship. > > The Alien was supposed to be the last thing that survived on the planet, emerging from the Engineer, who staggers to his chair and sets of the warning beacon. We then see the alien laying eggs in the hold after the heroes have escaped assuming nothing remains. > > With rewrites it all became nonsensical. Instead of the planet just being a jumping off point for an extended universe, it was re-written so that Weyland knew about the planet, even though 100 years its existence is unknown. So the planet looks exactly the same, the ship looks exactly the same and has crashed the same way, it is connected to the Aliens, but it is canonically not the same planet. The Engineer attacks, but for no reason, and then sets out to destroy the Earth, even though that’s obviously pointless since humans have spaceflight and have already spread throughout the universe. > > The whole thing is an incomprehensible mess, but the original script was much more coherent and actually pretty good from what I’ve seen of it. It tries to explore issues of what it is that separates Gods,Men and Monsters and the distinction between creator, mother and host. It also throws in some interesting abortion/infanticide analogies by looking at whether an individual can justifiably terminate an unwanted lifeform, and whether that changes if the lifeform is intelligent or is just capable of becoming intelligent. You can still see hints of some of those elements in there, and the phallic symbolism of some of the monsters and sets makes a lot more sense with that as the subtext. > > But the rewrites just produced a mess. I can’t help but think that almost all of these changes were made late in the game by Ridley Scott himself once he decided that he did not want _Prometheus_ to be a direct _Alien_ prequel (which it was totally promoted as being all thru pre-production and filming, right up until Scott started denying that it was just a few months before it was released). It seemed like, with all the movie franchises sprouting up everywhere, Scott suddenly felt it would be cheesy to look like he was hopping on the franchise/sequel/prequel bandwagon by going back to his 30-year old breakthrough film for new material. Big mistake, as everyone (but him) _wanted_ it to be an \*Alien \*prequel, not just the studio execs but the fans as well. And regardless of all his changes and denials it still totally \*was \*an \*Alien \*prequel, and would have been a much better one if he hadn’t messed it all up as above… ---
**Author:** ![iamthewalrus\_3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/258eb7/32.png) [@iamthewalrus\_3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iamthewalrus_3)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2016, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prometheus-question-the-engineer-attacking/757909/43 "2016-06-28T23:11:30Z")
Yeah, that original script sounds pretty good. At the very least, it sounds coherent. An alien prequel is exactly what we all wanted. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2016, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prometheus-question-the-engineer-attacking/757909/44 "2016-06-29T14:21:51Z")
> [@Hail\_Ants](#): > > I can’t help but think that almost all of these changes were made late in the game by Ridley Scott himself once he decided that he did not want _Prometheus_ to be a direct _Alien_ prequel (which it was totally promoted as being all thru pre-production and filming, right up until Scott started denying that it was just a few months before it was released). It seemed like, with all the movie franchises sprouting up everywhere, Scott suddenly felt it would be cheesy to look like he was hopping on the franchise/sequel/prequel bandwagon by going back to his 30-year old breakthrough film for new material. > > Big mistake, as everyone (but him) _wanted_ it to be an \*Alien \*prequel, not just the studio execs but the fans as well. And regardless of all his changes and denials it still totally \*was \*an \*Alien \*prequel, and would have been a much better one if he hadn’t messed it all up as above… I sure as hell wanted one. What I got was…a white hot mess. I mean, it’s arguably worse than the other sequels. I am one of the few people on the planet who actually liked Alien 3. I don’t like that they SPOILER! killed Newt and Hicks/Hudson (I can never remember which one is which) but the movie itself is kind of cool…dark, and a very dark ending, but with interesting characters and premises. Alien 4 was just terrible. Terrible, terrible, terrible. I don’t like Winona Ryder or Ron Pearlman or half the people in the cast, and suddenly Ripley-clone is sympathetic to the aliens that have dominated half her life? Ugh? But I still like Prometheus despite all of its flaws. ---
**Author:** ![Ryan\_Liam](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ryan_liam/32/3965_2.png) [@Ryan\_Liam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ryan_Liam)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2016, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prometheus-question-the-engineer-attacking/757909/45 "2016-06-29T20:06:34Z")
> [@Blake](#): > > The original script varied quite a lot from what we finally saw, but a lot of the material wasn’t re-shot, so we ended up with a mess. > > In the original script, the Engineer had been infected by “something”, possibly the black tar, possibly something connected with it, possibly something the tar was supposed to counteract. To save his life, his crew had placed him into suspended animation. Then his crew got slaughtered. > > When Weyland woke him up, it was a death sentence. His ship wasn’t working. he had no one around to treat his infection, and he couldn’t go back into suspended animation. > > That did not make him happy. > > Then he realised that the humans either had been infected by the same thing that had infected him. So he set out to destroy them all so that they couldn’t spread the infection. When he discovers that some humans had escaped in another spaceship earlier, he sets out to sterilise the Earth. The humans stop him, and leave on another spaceship. > > The Alien was supposed to be the last thing that survived on the planet, emerging from the Engineer, who staggers to his chair and sets of the warning beacon. We then see the alien laying eggs in the hold after the heroes have escaped assuming nothing remains. > > With rewrites it all became nonsensical. Instead of the planet just being a jumping off point for an extended universe, it was re-written so that Weyland knew about the planet, even though 100 years its existence is unknown. So the planet looks exactly the same, the ship looks exactly the same and has crashed the same way, it is connected to the Aliens, but it is canonically not the same planet. The Engineer attacks, but for no reason, and then sets out to destroy the Earth, even though that’s obviously pointless since humans have spaceflight and have already spread throughout the universe. > > The whole thing is an incomprehensible mess, but the original script was much more coherent and actually pretty good from what I’ve seen of it. It tries to explore issues of what it is that separates Gods,Men and Monsters and the distinction between creator, mother and host. It also throws in some interesting abortion/infanticide analogies by looking at whether an individual can justifiably terminate an unwanted lifeform, and whether that changes if the lifeform is intelligent or is just capable of becoming intelligent. You can still see hints of some of those elements in there, and the phallic symbolism of some of the monsters and sets makes a lot more sense with that as the subtext. > > But the rewrites just produced a mess. Why the hell did the get rid of this story?! Did the writers not think for a second ‘Ok this re write makes no sense whatsoever’ That’s a perfect reason, thanks man. ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2016, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prometheus-question-the-engineer-attacking/757909/46 "2016-06-29T20:17:35Z")
Wow, what **Blake** posted is a _much_ better movie than the one I saw. ---
**Author:** ![Roderick\_Femm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roderick_femm/32/14875_2.png) [@Roderick\_Femm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roderick_Femm)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2016, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prometheus-question-the-engineer-attacking/757909/47 "2016-06-29T23:08:42Z")
I’m going to post a bit of a contrarian view, then. I preferred the tenuous and uncertain connection between Prometheus and the Alien canon better than a straight prequel. It made it more interesting to me, even with the questions I had after seeing it (except for the question about how the alien in the med lab grew to be so big, I’m not letting that go). Also, the way it was presented really begged for a sequel to answer all those questions, whereas the film as a prequel would have almost not allowed another film between Prometheus and Alien. Therefore no real new knowledge or interest in the Alien universe with Prometheus as a prequel, while as it was released it opened up a lot of new possibilities. That said, probably it would have been better if that had been the goal from the beginning, instead of switching from a straight prequel to this mixed bag film. Poor planning, I guess. ---
**Author:** ![dracoi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/90db22/32.png) [@dracoi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dracoi)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2016, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prometheus-question-the-engineer-attacking/757909/48 "2016-06-30T02:15:45Z")
> [@Roderick\_Femm](#): > > I’m going to post a bit of a contrarian view, then. I preferred the tenuous and uncertain connection between Prometheus and the Alien canon better than a straight prequel. It made it more interesting to me, even with the questions I had after seeing it (except for the question about how the alien in the med lab grew to be so big, I’m not letting that go). Also, the way it was presented really begged for a sequel to answer all those questions, whereas the film as a prequel would have almost not allowed another film between Prometheus and Alien. Therefore no real new knowledge or interest in the Alien universe with Prometheus as a prequel, while as it was released it opened up a lot of new possibilities. > > That said, probably it would have been better if that had been the goal from the beginning, instead of switching from a straight prequel to this mixed bag film. Poor planning, I guess. I would be all in favor of any _coherent_ movie set in that universe, prequel or otherwise and I think most of us here would agree with you. I don’t even need something that answers all the questions and spells it out for me as long as its coherent. We could apologize for all the aliens in Prometheus by saying that we don’t understand them, but even the human characters are pretty implausible and inconsistent. ---
**Author:** ![Qwakkeddup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/90ced4/32.png) [@Qwakkeddup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qwakkeddup)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2016, 5:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prometheus-question-the-engineer-attacking/757909/49 "2016-06-30T05:08:31Z")
I just watched Alien and Aliens. Hicks and the rest are dead at the end, only Newt and Ripley regain the Marine’s ship. Alien 3 (which I don’t have) is based at a prison colony, IIRC. I can remember what happens to Ripley, but not Newt and the rest of the colony. I think Alien Requiem is when they find the temple under the polar ice, which brings in the Predators. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2016, 5:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prometheus-question-the-engineer-attacking/757909/50 "2016-06-30T05:21:58Z")
> [@Qwakkeddup](#): > > I just watched Alien and Aliens. Hicks and the rest are dead at the end, only Newt and Ripley regain the Marine’s ship. Alien 3 (which I don’t have) is based at a prison colony, IIRC. I can remember what happens to Ripley, but not Newt and the rest of the colony. I think Alien Requiem is when they find the temple under the polar ice, which brings in the Predators. Hicks wasn’t dead. His life signs were real low, but he wasn’t dead. ---
**Author:** ![theR](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/977dab/32.png) [@theR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/theR)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2016, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prometheus-question-the-engineer-attacking/757909/51 "2016-06-30T15:12:30Z")
> [@Qwakkeddup](#): > > I just watched Alien and Aliens. Hicks and the rest are dead at the end, only Newt and Ripley regain the Marine’s ship. Alien 3 (which I don’t have) is based at a prison colony, IIRC. I can remember what happens to Ripley, but not Newt and the rest of the colony. I think Alien Requiem is when they find the temple under the polar ice, which brings in the Predators. I assume we don’t need spoilers for movies this old. Yes, Alien 3 is at the prison colony and Ripley is the only one that survives when their escape pod crashes there at the beginning. I guess you could argue Bishop sort of survives because he gets reactivated (briefly?). ---
**Author:** ![Randolph](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Randolph](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Randolph)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2016, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prometheus-question-the-engineer-attacking/757909/52 "2016-06-30T15:29:52Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Hicks wasn’t dead. His life signs were real low, but he wasn’t dead. Then we go back in there and get them! ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2016, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prometheus-question-the-engineer-attacking/757909/53 "2016-06-30T22:38:30Z")
> [@Randolph](#): > > Then we go back in there and get them! Fuck that! ---
**Author:** ![Randolph](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Randolph](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Randolph)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2016, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prometheus-question-the-engineer-attacking/757909/54 "2016-06-30T23:19:29Z")
We don’t leave our people behind! ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2016, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prometheus-question-the-engineer-attacking/757909/55 "2016-06-30T23:20:30Z")
Aw, man, and I was getting short. Four threads and out. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prometheus-question-the-engineer-attacking/757909/56 "2016-07-01T00:35:42Z")
David originally said this to the Engineer in the Engineer’s language. > > [@](#): > > “This man is here because he does not want to die. He believes you can give him more life.” The argument I heard was that the engineer had a chest burster inside of it, and went into statis 2000 years ago to avoid having the chest burster grow and mature. When the engineer was woken up he realized he was as good as dead, so he killed the humans who woke him up out of vengeance for killing him by waking him up. Also he was mad at the humans for wanting more life, and for creating a bastard version of life like David the machine. Personally I loved the movie, it was the best one in the Alien franchise. ---
**Author:** ![Roderick\_Femm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roderick_femm/32/14875_2.png) [@Roderick\_Femm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roderick_Femm)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prometheus-question-the-engineer-attacking/757909/57 "2016-07-01T02:01:41Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > Personally I loved the movie, it was the best one in the Alien franchise. Me too, and I’m not sure why. Maybe because, in place of the gritty ugly corporate-ridden vision of the future in the first films, this one had a vision that included human emotion and aspirations (and stupidity). So, \*\*Wesley \*\*and others who like this film, why? ---
**Author:** ![Hail\_Ants](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/dc4da7/32.png) [@Hail\_Ants](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hail_Ants)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 5:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prometheus-question-the-engineer-attacking/757909/58 "2016-07-01T05:47:45Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Hicks wasn’t dead. His life signs were real low, but he wasn’t dead. Yeah, Hicks (Michael Biehn) was most definitely alive at the end. There wasn’t even any mention of his life signs being low, I think you’re confusing this with the earlier scene inside the APC after the first alien battle where Hudson says this about the sarge (he was grabbed but not killed). But Hicks is pretty much absent for the last third of the film. His last line is when they land the second drop ship inside the atmosphere processor and Ripley is getting ready to leave to rescue Newt. Bishop is warning her how little time they have and Ripley says, “Hicks, don’t let him leave” to which Hicks replies, “We ain’t goin’ anywhere”. The director’s cut adds a short little bit after this where Ripley and Hicks tell each other their first names (Ellen and Duane respectively). The next time we see him is when they’re back inside the Sulaco but still inside the drop-ship. He’s unconscious and Ripley goes to try and move him and Bishop stops her and says, “We need a stretcher to move him to medical”. Then there’s the queen battle etc. He’s still unconscious (but very much alive) when Ripley seals him (and half of Bishop) into the cryotubes. The film’s last shot is of Ripley and Newt in cryosleep (as opposed to the last shot in _Alien_ of Ripley and the cat in cryosleep). I’ve seen that movie a few times… ---
**Author:** ![Qwakkeddup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/90ced4/32.png) [@Qwakkeddup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qwakkeddup)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 7:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prometheus-question-the-engineer-attacking/757909/59 "2016-07-01T07:53:45Z")
I just watched it the other night. You would think I could keep it straight for a few days. Hail Ants has it nailed down. I was thinking about the crew who were caught in the nest looking for colonists down there. ---
**Author:** ![Ryan\_Liam](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ryan_liam/32/3965_2.png) [@Ryan\_Liam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ryan_Liam)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prometheus-question-the-engineer-attacking/757909/60 "2016-07-01T16:02:00Z")
> [@Roderick\_Femm](#): > > Me too, and I’m not sure why. Maybe because, in place of the gritty ugly corporate-ridden vision of the future in the first films, this one had a vision that included human emotion and aspirations (and stupidity). > > So, \*\*Wesley \*\*and others who like this film, why? The premise is interesting of them going to find an Old civilization, but, I always envision Elon Musk doing something similar with his real life Weyland corporation (Space X) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prometheus-question-the-engineer-attacking/757909.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/prometheus-question-the-engineer-attacking/757909.md?page=4)