# Pronunciation of "mills" **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [May 6, 2019, 8:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciation-of-mills/833543 "2019-05-06T08:38:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2019, 8:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciation-of-mills/833543/1 "2019-05-06T08:38:46Z")
On the radio station I listen to, there’s a person whose surname is “Mills”. He pronounces his name “mils” rather than “milz”. How common (or uncommon) is this? ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2019, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciation-of-mills/833543/2 "2019-05-06T13:54:43Z")
> [@panache45](#): > > On the radio station I listen to, there’s a person whose surname is “Mills”. He pronounces his name “mils” rather than “milz”. How common (or uncommon) is this? Wow, yet another thread where I pronounce the two words the same. Something is terribly wrong with me! ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2019, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciation-of-mills/833543/3 "2019-05-06T14:04:19Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > Wow, yet another thread where I pronounce the two words the same. Something is terribly wrong with me! I think the OP was trying to divide the pronunciations of the final vowel into voiced and unvoiced without taking into consideration that “mils” is a real word that (some/most?) people would pronounce `milz` (or possibly you mean it the other way and would pronounce “milz” with the unvoiced sibilant. What do I know, my mother tongue doesn’t have the a voiced sibilant). ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2019, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciation-of-mills/833543/4 "2019-05-06T14:05:38Z")
I think “mils” meant “Mills with a distinct sibilant S sound”, like you’d expect a posh snake to sound. Aside: I misread the title as “milk” and hoped to find out why some people pronounce it “melk”. ---
**Author:** ![markn\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@markn\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/markn_1)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2019, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciation-of-mills/833543/5 "2019-05-06T14:10:20Z")
The distinction the OP is making is like the difference between “fuzz” and “fuss”. I’ve never heard the name Mills pronounced /mɪls/. Does the person who pronounces it this way have a particular accent? ---
**Author:** ![WOOKINPANUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wookinpanub/32/132_2.png) [@WOOKINPANUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WOOKINPANUB)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2019, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciation-of-mills/833543/6 "2019-05-06T14:16:57Z")
> [@digs](#): > > I think “mils” meant “Mills with a distinct sibilant S sound”, like you’d expect a posh snake to sound. > > Aside: > I misread the title as “milk” and hoped to find out why some people pronounce it “melk”. Coincidentally, a coworker,among his many annoying habits says “melk”. When asked about it he said he didn’t know but probably gets it from his mother who was raised in the Chicago area. My whole extended family is from Chicago, and though their accents make me stabby, they do at least pronounce milk correctly. Also, this guy has a bit of a lisp and often pronounces the “Z” sound as an “S”. ---
**Author:** ![awldune](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c77e96/32.png) [@awldune](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/awldune)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2019, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciation-of-mills/833543/7 "2019-05-06T14:21:24Z")
Any possibility the person’s name is “Milce”? ---
**Author:** ![markn\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@markn\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/markn_1)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2019, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciation-of-mills/833543/8 "2019-05-06T15:28:34Z")
I think I generally pronounce “milk” close to /mɛlk/. I was raised in Chicago in the 1960s. I think this pronunciation is part of the [Northern Cities Vowel Shift](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inland_Northern_American_English#History_of_the_Northern_Cities_Vowel_Shift). ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2019, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciation-of-mills/833543/9 "2019-05-06T16:04:18Z")
> [@markn\_1](#): > > I think I generally pronounce “milk” close to /mɛlk/. I was raised in Chicago in the 1960s. I think this pronunciation is part of the [Northern Cities Vowel Shift](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inland_Northern_American_English#History_of_the_Northern_Cities_Vowel_Shift). I have a friend here in Chicago who says “melk”/mɛlk/ as well, and I only just noticed my wife also shifts her vowel that way (she’s from Buffalo, which makes sense, as it’d be part of the vowel shift, and the Buffalo accent has a lot in common with the Chicago accent.) That said, we used to tease said friend about the pronunciation – he was the only one of our peer group that had at least that pronounced an /ɛ/ vowel. But the accent varies within the city. There’s arguments about what the “a” vowel in “Chicago” is. My part of the city it’s towards an /a/. Other parts of the city it’s towards /ɔ/ or even /ɒ/. (Really a bit difficult to explain without IPA, but the former is more towards an “AH” and the latter an “AW,” which won’t make any sense to people who pronounce both the same.) ---
**Author:** ![markn\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@markn\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/markn_1)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2019, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciation-of-mills/833543/10 "2019-05-06T17:52:11Z")
Thinking about it some more, I’m not so sure that the Northern Cities Vowel Shift fully explains my pronunciation of “milk”. I don’t seem to shift /ɪl/ to /ɛl/ in other words. I distinguish “mill” from “mell”, “built” from “belt”, “fill” from “fell”, etc. Milk is the only word I can think of where the /ɪl/ and /ɛl/ pronunciations both seem valid to me. I assume I must have frequently heard /mɛlk/ when I was growing up. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2019, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciation-of-mills/833543/11 "2019-05-06T18:00:51Z")
[s] and [z] are even the appropriate symbols in IPA. [z] is the voiced version of [s]. And the usual rule in English is that voiced consonants followed by s get /z/, not /s/. My accent does devoice final /z/, but only partially, and only at the ends of phrases. Essentially, it goes zzsssss, all in the length of a normal zz sound. It would surprise me if other accents would completely devoice it. I know German devoices final consonants quite often. Is there any chance it’s actually /mɪlts/? I know that z makes the /ts/ sound in some languages. (In case you wonder, you use // to refer to the phoneme, i.e. the idealized concept of the sound, while you use for pronunciation, i.e. exactly how people actually say the sound.) ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2019, 6:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciation-of-mills/833543/12 "2019-05-07T06:49:52Z")
The person in question is a professional radio announcer with a fine voice, and his name is definitely “Mills.” ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2019, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciation-of-mills/833543/13 "2019-05-08T16:05:32Z")
What station? Maybe they’re available online, and we could hear him say it. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2019, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciation-of-mills/833543/14 "2019-05-08T17:25:38Z")
> [@panache45](#): > > The person in question is a professional radio announcer with a fine voice, and his name is definitely “Mills.” AFAIK, a pronunciation like “Milce” for “Mills” is not common. I certainly have never heard of it. The only way I can get it to work in my head is if I’m imagining an exaggerated SNL Bill Swerski superfans skit of the Chicago accent. I’m assuming, otherwise, this radio announcer does not have a Great Lakes accent, but probably an American Broadcast English type of accent, so I don’t know where the pronunciation would come from. Now, [Here you can find a bunch of “mills” pronunciations.](https://forvo.com/search/mills/) I do have to say, some of them do sound like the final sibilant is an unvoiced /s/ rather than a voiced /z/. To my ears, the first example (female speaker saying “mills”) sounds like /s/. Also the “Jeff Mills” pronunciation is pretty close to an /s/, but I’m not sure. Do any of those resemble the way you hear this broadcaster pronounce his name? ---
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2019, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciation-of-mills/833543/15 "2019-05-09T01:45:35Z")
I have never heard Mills pronounced like Milce. I might pronounce it as /milzs/, though. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2019, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciation-of-mills/833543/16 "2019-05-10T21:58:54Z")
If it’s **your** surname, you can pronounce it any way you wish. ---
**Author:** ![Philster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/13edae/32.png) [@Philster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Philster)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2019, 11:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciation-of-mills/833543/17 "2019-05-11T11:37:18Z")
Somewhat famous boxing referee Mills Lane managed to have his name pronounced by others as MillSlane, likely because of the alliteration of the S rolling into the L. Never heard it as MillZlane. Whose car is that? Billz. Where are my billz? Who is faster? Bill’s faster. I hear the S in the last example. I hear Z in the others. . ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2019, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciation-of-mills/833543/18 "2019-10-30T13:15:06Z")
UPDATE: Mr. Mills has changed his pronunciation of his name. He now pronounces it the way God intended, as “milz”. Perhaps he has read this thread. ---
**Author:** ![Wheelz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wheelz/32/5718_2.png) [@Wheelz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wheelz)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2019, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciation-of-mills/833543/19 "2019-10-31T19:52:50Z")
I have a last name that is pronounced exactly as it’s spelled. Yet people often mispronounce it, because there was a celebrity with the name who, for some reason, pronounced a common diphthong in an uncommon way. I guess my point is that when it comes to people’s names, the usual rules don’t necessarily apply; you can say your own name however you damn well please. Sincerely, Wheelce ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2019, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciation-of-mills/833543/20 "2019-10-31T19:57:31Z")
> [@digs](#): > > …Aside: > I misread the title as “milk” and hoped to find out why some people pronounce it “melk”. If you get to the bottom of that you will also, likely, know why people who have lived their entire lives in my state say that they live in Ellinois. ( “L”-innoy. ) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciation-of-mills/833543.md?page=2)