# Pronunciations which are legit but sound pretentious to outsiders **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [November 3, 2018, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciations-which-are-legit-but-sound-pretentious-to-outsiders/823939 "2018-11-03T18:17:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![mundylion](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mundylion/32/3604_2.png) [@mundylion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mundylion)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2018, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciations-which-are-legit-but-sound-pretentious-to-outsiders/823939/121 "2018-11-05T15:03:36Z")
I know a few people here in the Midwest who put gazz in their car. Odd but I think they are all jewish. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2018, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciations-which-are-legit-but-sound-pretentious-to-outsiders/823939/122 "2018-11-05T15:29:49Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > Imagine the French being told how to pronounce “London” Or “happiness.” 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2018, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciations-which-are-legit-but-sound-pretentious-to-outsiders/823939/123 "2018-11-05T17:36:42Z")
> [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](#): > > And New Berlin WI is “New BUR lin”. To differentiate it from Germany’s “Bur LIN”. 🆒 Regular Berlin (by Omro (AM ro) is also “BER lin”. At least, after WWI. And Beloit is Americanized. I groaned in the SNL episode when Shatner (as TJ Hooker) rode a car hood all the way to “Be LOY” Wisconsin. No one will ever find you, TJ, if you tell them you are in BeLOY. It’s BaLOIT. Full T. And Fon du Lac has no French hoity toitiness. It’s pronounced more like Fondle-ak. I laughed on some recent TV show (FBI, maybe?) where a character said she was “from Wis-con-sin”. I said, no you aren’t. If you were, you’d be from Wes KHANS n. ---
**Author:** ![Chicken\_Fingers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Chicken\_Fingers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chicken_Fingers)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2018, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciations-which-are-legit-but-sound-pretentious-to-outsiders/823939/124 "2018-11-05T18:06:30Z")
You’ll find a lot of ordinary, unpretentious New Englanders pronouncing words with what sound like hybridized leftover British pronunciation. I hear some of my Massachusetts relatives pronounce the “h” in herb. They also have a particular way of saying “aunt,” as if they almost rhyme it with “haunt,” but leave their mouths more open and drawl the “aahh” sound more. My Vermont relatives say “aren’t” for “aunt.” ---
**Author:** ![Limmin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f04885/32.png) [@Limmin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Limmin)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2018, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciations-which-are-legit-but-sound-pretentious-to-outsiders/823939/125 "2018-11-05T18:45:12Z")
(In keeping with the OP’s premise, I suggest that there are issues like these that affect everyone speaking English, be they British or American.) Gawd. Pronunciation is such a problem. I’ve generally decided to give up on there being a “right” way to pronounce certain words, and just go with the flow… In a restaurant, be prepared to have to change the pronunciation of foreign food, no matter where it’s from. Japanese, Italian, Spanish. There’s the real, native word, then there’s the local version of it. Same deal with place names. I thought it was cool to be able to pronounce places like Tiburon (north of San Fran) properly, you know, using the original Spanish language, only to be corrected, “No, it’s TIB-beron!” Sigh. ---
**Author:** ![Tibby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tibby/32/17030_2.png) [@Tibby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tibby)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2018, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciations-which-are-legit-but-sound-pretentious-to-outsiders/823939/126 "2018-11-05T18:53:05Z")
I always say, “my _ay-unt’s_ got _awnts_ in her _pawnts_.” I wish she’d get an exterminator so I could stop saying that. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2018, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciations-which-are-legit-but-sound-pretentious-to-outsiders/823939/127 "2018-11-05T18:59:46Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > And Beloit is Americanized. I groaned in the SNL episode when Shatner (as TJ Hooker) rode a car hood all the way to “Be LOY” Wisconsin. No one will ever find you, TJ, if you tell them you are in BeLOY. It’s BaLOIT. Full T. When I was in college at the University of Wisconsin, I attended a dinner that included a talk with Michael Leckrone (the longtime director of the school’s marching band). It was mostly silly stories, but one joke he told was, “What Wisconsin city is named after the sound of dropping a quarter into a toilet?” 😃 ---
**Author:** ![xnylder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/bbce88/32.png) [@xnylder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xnylder)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2018, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciations-which-are-legit-but-sound-pretentious-to-outsiders/823939/128 "2018-11-05T20:40:53Z")
How’s about Japanese loan words pronounced properly in the Japanese fashion, in American English? KA-RA-TAY instead of ka-RATTY, KYO-TO instead of kee-YOH-toe and so on. It’s correct, but unfortunately sometimes seen as pretentious. ---
**Author:** ![Brayne\_Ded](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Brayne\_Ded](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brayne_Ded)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2018, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciations-which-are-legit-but-sound-pretentious-to-outsiders/823939/129 "2018-11-05T20:52:57Z")
> [@Yorkshire\_Pudding](#): > > New one on me! I’ve never heard it with a hard t. My impression is that it depends on whether the person knows French pronunciation. So, BOOK-et or boo -KAY, BUFF-et or byew-FAY, etc. Tomato? Garage? Oh, yes, how do the locals pronounce “Ponce de Leon” or “Des Moines”? ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2018, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciations-which-are-legit-but-sound-pretentious-to-outsiders/823939/130 "2018-11-05T22:24:54Z")
> [@Infovore](#): > > Those are the only ones I’ve ever heard, and I’ve lived my whole life in California. If there’s another way to pronounce it, I’ve never heard it. Probably more like cho-RI-so if you’re looking for the Spanish pronunciation- basically how it’s said commonly in the US, only with a “S” instead of a “Z” in the last syllable. My favorite is from when my wife and I took a cooking class about 15 years ago- the instructor was this bubbly blonde Southern woman who kept talking about the “Sal-sA” and overenunciating it with her mouth open too wide and a thick Southern accent. She was trying SO hard to pronounce it correctly, but it was actually worse than just saying it lazy Anglo style- “sal-suh”. We still make jokes about the “Sal-sA” to this day. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2018, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciations-which-are-legit-but-sound-pretentious-to-outsiders/823939/131 "2018-11-05T22:39:09Z")
> [@notfrommensa](#): > > Cairo (KAY-roh) Illinois > > New Madrid (MAD-rid), Missouri Delhi (Dell-High), New York ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2018, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciations-which-are-legit-but-sound-pretentious-to-outsiders/823939/132 "2018-11-05T22:46:11Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Delhi (Dell-High), New York Is it really “Dell-high”? That’s exceptionally going out of your way to make the pronunciation local! ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2018, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciations-which-are-legit-but-sound-pretentious-to-outsiders/823939/133 "2018-11-05T22:58:31Z")
I think the reason it can sound pretentious to us is that, when people who are actually from around here say it that way, it sounds like they’re mimicking these other people, as if the local pronunciation is wrong. And I bet that, historically, there really were people like that, because of non-prestige dialects. I know I was specifically taught in elementary school to get rid of the pin-pen merger that I naturally had. The way my teacher talked about it like it was ignorant, I would definitely think that people with that merger would think she was being pretentious. That said, it is useful not to have it when you’re learning to read via phonics. That way there’s not a special rule for e before n. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2018, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciations-which-are-legit-but-sound-pretentious-to-outsiders/823939/134 "2018-11-05T23:03:38Z")
> [@Yorkshire\_Pudding](#): > > I’ve just remembered a Russell Kane routine where he says > > “HallaPENNyoes? HallaPENNyoes?! Say jallapeenoes, you dick.” > > Can’t say I’m remotely close to agreeing with him, but it does suggest there’s a contingent who think a Spanish-based pronunciation is needless pretention. I just think it sounds pretentious if you affect an accent while saying it. Same for pretty much any foreign word. Only when natives (or fluent people who sound like natives) say it with the original accent does it sound okay to me. Especially don’t linger on the accent to make it clear you used it. That’s the thing that bugs me when Alex Trebek does it. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2018, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciations-which-are-legit-but-sound-pretentious-to-outsiders/823939/135 "2018-11-05T23:10:18Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > Again this is why y’all need to learn IPA Sure, but learning the sounds when you have a merger is actually difficult. Even if you hear someone saying both sounds (rather than just having example words), if you have the merger, they will not sound as distinct to someone who does not. I know IPA pretty well. But I have both the caught/cot and father/bother mergers. So I still am unclear on the difference between [ɑ] and [ɒ], though I do understand how [a] is different. (also [ɔ]) I may have even figured it out at various points, but I can’t remember. Is one of them rounded, maybe? Maybe slightly more forward? ---
**Author:** ![mundylion](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mundylion/32/3604_2.png) [@mundylion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mundylion)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2018, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciations-which-are-legit-but-sound-pretentious-to-outsiders/823939/136 "2018-11-06T00:08:19Z")
Des Moines was mentioned above. In Iowa it’s duh moin but in Illinois we have des plains. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2018, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciations-which-are-legit-but-sound-pretentious-to-outsiders/823939/137 "2018-11-06T00:15:46Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > Is it really “Dell-high”? That’s exceptionally going out of your way to make the pronunciation local! It’s also DELL high in Ohio Ohio also has ROO sha bell FOUNT in ver SAYLES RYE o grand and a bunch more ---
**Author:** ![P-man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/p-man/32/3606_2.png) [@P-man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/P-man)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2018, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciations-which-are-legit-but-sound-pretentious-to-outsiders/823939/138 "2018-11-06T01:09:33Z")
It probably took me 20 years to get Ms. P to pronounce “Appalachian” right. She insisted on pronouncing the third syllable with a long a. There’s a town in southwestern Virginia called Dante. They pronounce it with one syllable, rhyming with ant. Ever since I lived in NYC I’ve pronounced Houston as “How-ston” unless I’m referring to the city in Texas. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2018, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciations-which-are-legit-but-sound-pretentious-to-outsiders/823939/139 "2018-11-06T01:28:45Z")
> [@bump](#): > > My favorite is from when my wife and I took a cooking class about 15 years ago- the instructor was this bubbly blonde Southern woman who kept talking about the “Sal-sA” and overenunciating it with her mouth open too wide and a thick Southern accent. She was trying SO hard to pronounce it correctly, but it was actually worse than just saying it lazy Anglo style- “sal-suh”. We still make jokes about the “Sal-sA” to this day. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/Uub_Oqwefwc/hqdefault.jpg "Seinfeld - salsa scene") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uub_Oqwefwc) ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2018, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciations-which-are-legit-but-sound-pretentious-to-outsiders/823939/140 "2018-11-06T01:29:51Z")
> [@P-man](#): > > Ever since I lived in NYC I’ve pronounced Houston as “How-ston” unless I’m referring to the city in Texas. There’s another one someplace else? 😕 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciations-which-are-legit-but-sound-pretentious-to-outsiders/823939.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pronunciations-which-are-legit-but-sound-pretentious-to-outsiders/823939.md?page=8)