It’s a sneaky way of counting in a way. It’s like it’s 2018 but it’s the 21st century. Two days had elapsed but they had started the third day on Sunday.
People talk about the Second Coming, but holy fuck, can you imagine Jesus here, acclimating to modern society? I suspect he would be aghast at what they have done with his idle ramblings all those years ago. I can imagine him getting to point of telling large segments of his “followers” to fuck off. Then he would step out ahead of the light, get nailed by a truck and die on the crosswalk.
Eh. It has about as much relevance to me as discussing whether the Eagles could have flown the Ring to Mount Doom instead of the dangerous and long route that was taken by the hobbits, to be honest. Actually, Tolkienesque discussions probably have MORE relevance to me than Jesus fanfic.
I believe the usual assumption is that Jesus isn’t locked in a freezer; he’s sitting up in his viewing room in heaven watching everything unfold and has been doing so the whole time. Which means that, yes, he would know how traffic lights work. Among other (creepier) things.
That could be said about most major religions today.
I’ve always heard it phrased “he rose on the third day”. The third day is two days after the first day (the day he died).
Died at 23:59 Saturday - was dead for one minute on the first day.
Stayed dead all day Sunday - was dead 24 hours on the second day.
Resurrected at 00:01 on Monday - was dead one minute on the third day.
Dead for just over 24 hours; rose on the third day. All legit.
About the only error is that when people say that Jesus gave up a weekend for our sins, they’re being too generous - the story doesn’t give us exact times but we can be fairly confident he was dead less than 36 hours. And that’s putting aside the fact that if you believe Jesus went to heaven when he died that’s hardly a sacrifice at all. (The mormons put the focus on the stuff before he died, which was, according to the story, less fun.)
Given the timing of Easter, particularly this year, my theory is that the crucifixion and resurrection of of Jesus was an elaborate April fools joke that Jesus played with the help of Pontious Pilate. But his disciples couldn’t take a joke and so ended up founding a religion.
Now someone please explain the Ascension to me. The resurrected Christ is bodily carried into the sky on a cloud. Is his physical self still up there somewhere? It is described in Luke and Acts, so if believers are using books of the New Testament as proof of Jesus’ life, they must also believe in the Ascension as a historical fact, therefore he is still out there somewhere. Also, Acts says he will return the same way as he left, bodily out of the sky, no virgin required.
Anybody still believe this?
But that’s not what Jesus said he would do:
CMC fnord!
This is a rather common way of counting. Recall that the French words for ‘1 week’ and ‘2 weeks’ are ‘huit jours’ and ‘quinze jours.’ A ‘60 day’ Thailand visa entry stamp is good for only 59 days the way you or I count.
Off-topic:
[SPOILER]This odd count was brought home to me at a video rental store in a distant city I visited every Wednesday. The 7-day rentals will be perfect, I thought to myself, until the employees explained that they’d have to be returned on Tuesday. ‘How about the 1-day rentals?’ I asked. They needed to be returned on Thursday. ‘And 2 days? 3 days?’ I counted slowly on my fingers. When I got to 7, the employees stared in amazement as though they had suddenly learned some New Math.
In fact their knowledge or ignorance was irrelevant. The cash register-computers computed due dates automatically, and showed mine as needing a Wednesday return.[/SPOILER]
I was in a hurry to get to work. That should be "After the Babylonian Exile, (587 B.C.E. – 538 B.C.E.). . . "
Good point. We got shortchanged on the days.
I have heard it argued that he was actually crucified on Wednesday or Thursday, but that makes little sense. Good Friday is also the first Sabbath of Passover. Crucifixion was seen as a death without dignity because the victim’s body is left on the cross to be picked at by crows and vultures (and maybe some kind of mustelids that can climb up there for some gnosh). But they allowed his body to be taken down because it was sunset on the Sabbath.
I tend to think that if there was to be a resurrection after the specified interval, he would have come forth on Tuesday. But the actual religious observance is abbreviated for convenience. Which, I guess, is fair enough. Rituals do not have to be precise (unless, of course, one needs to summon a dark force).
Everyone has their own tipping point, but if Jesus didn’t turn water into wine, then I’m
booting my faith. And spending the money I would have donated to the church on wine.
I mean, come ON! Jesus is at a multi-day wedding that runs out of alcohol, and to save the father of the bride embarrassment, turns large “cisterns” of dirty water into wine that’s better than what was served up until then. THIS is the most practical, most human miracle…
… Coolest. Savior. Ever.
I haven’t read the thread (it’s 12 pages, sorry, it’s a bit long), but I feel like this take is worth bringing up.
How much eyewitness testimony would you need to convince you that people are being abducted by aliens? How many individual testimonies would you need to be able to say, “Okay, yeah, I buy it, people are, in fact, being abducted by aliens”? Five? Ten? A hundred? If you look, you can find dozens if not hundreds of people who will testify that they were abducted. Not ancient documents of questionable veracity which may or may not actually add up to anything, but actual living, breathing people. And for the most part, those people won’t compound those testimonies with other bizarre, unreasonable claims.
And yet, I think that most people who believe that the resurrection of Jesus happened based on eyewitness testimony would consider the idea of believing UFO abduction testimonials rather absurd.
Our standard of evidence for things way outside the realm of the plausible has to be a lot higher than mere eyewitness testimony.
Kate McKinnon, or the being of many names I have only seen on TV, would be a national treasure, were she real. Which I’m not absolutely sure of.
I wonder who would have been watching the tomb. I mean, they put his body in there probably around 8 or 9 pm on Friday night and then went to observe the first Sabbath of Passover. One should expect that there was no one at the tomb until Sunday. So we have no idea how long he was dead because no one saw him get up. The Greys could have begun surgery on him fairly quickly after everyone left and had him up and moving about even before midnight and then been on their way back to their saucer.
One of the issues is that the farther back in History you go, the harder it is to prove people exist. Kate McKinnon is easy - but pretty much anyone in the first world is easy given the amount of data we have on people and how much we try and prevent identity theft. You can prove my nineteen year old son exists - there is a birth certification, adoption paperwork filed in state court, passport information held by the State Department. Tax returns. Driver’s license. School records. Draft registration. Bank accounts. Employment records. A speeding ticket (or two). Plus a social media footprint, a few hundred living people who will say “yeah, I know him - I went to high school with him.” These are things that we know were created contemporaneously with his existence, which we know that it is difficult to fake, which are often held in official hands, across a wide variety of entities - banks, state governments, federal governments, school districts, corporations…
My great great grandmother it is far harder to prove she ever existed. She is a name in a Bible. There is a death certificate, but no birth certificate. There is a gravestone, and a parish marriage record - but no marriage license - it wasn’t needed back then. She never did anything of importance to show up in a contemporary newspaper. She was born on the Minnesota Prairie - and her parents were German immigrants - but we think they came in through Canada - not Ellis Island (Minnesota is full of “illegal” immigrants who landed in Canada and made there way here through Saskatchewan a hundred plus years ago - it was easier to get here that way).
The farther back you go, the harder it is to figure out who was real. Robin Hood, anyone? ( IMHO, probably based on several people - i.e. not real and yet more real than just myth). And then get into the specifics facts of their lives - it gets really hard. To make it worse, Historians pre-19th century (and frankly into the 19th century), often just made shit up to fill in the gaps - and ancient historians were particularly egregious - mixing history, hearsay and myth. It can be hard to tell with contemporary accounts what was known fact and what unsubstantiated gossip they recorded. We don’t know how or when the Princes in the Tower died - and one of them was king of England - we have contemporary unsubstantiated gossip that gives us quite a few ideas, but some of it conflicts.