# Proof That God Exists: An Open Debate For The Existence of God **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 31, 2016, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proof-that-god-exists-an-open-debate-for-the-existence-of-god/764578 "2016-08-31T16:30:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 19
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2016, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proof-that-god-exists-an-open-debate-for-the-existence-of-god/764578/361 "2016-09-13T17:54:51Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Evidence against the existence of a Risen God: If _you_ were a “Risen God” how would _you_ feel about the device used to kill you being displayed in the building supposedly built to worship you, worn around the necks of your worshippers, and displayed on the front of the books that supposedly records your teachings? “Hey, remember how we killed you? Here’s a constant reminder!” A cradle to commemorate his birth, or maybe a Shepard’s Crook to commemorate [del]our fleecing[/del]his guidance, but the lethal weapon used to torture him to death? If he existed, and had any say in the matter, there would be some heavy duty smiting going on, I think. Bill Hicks said it better. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2016, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proof-that-god-exists-an-open-debate-for-the-existence-of-god/764578/362 "2016-09-13T17:57:14Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > Bill Hicks said it better. I decided to quote myself, instead, but please link to whatever it is he had to say on the subject. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2016, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proof-that-god-exists-an-open-debate-for-the-existence-of-god/764578/363 "2016-09-13T18:26:16Z")
> [@Biffster](#): > > God to me is simply that life-force. So if you believe in some sort of life force, why not call it snargleblazz or something? The term God is already taken, and while different people mean different things by it, God is usually intelligent, and some god in the pantheon created the universe. Calling your woo god does nothing but gives your nonsense some initial credence from the unwashed that it does not deserve. ---
**Author:** ![TreacherousCretin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/treacherouscretin/32/476_2.png) [@TreacherousCretin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TreacherousCretin)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2016, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proof-that-god-exists-an-open-debate-for-the-existence-of-god/764578/364 "2016-09-13T19:06:36Z")
> [@Ludovic](#): > > So _that’s_ how he got a fish as a symbol. Also origin of the term “Holy Mackerel!” ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2016, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proof-that-god-exists-an-open-debate-for-the-existence-of-god/764578/365 "2016-09-13T19:08:39Z")
> [@TreacherousCretin](#): > > Also origin of the term “Holy Mackerel!” Snappy! ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2016, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proof-that-god-exists-an-open-debate-for-the-existence-of-god/764578/366 "2016-09-13T19:41:15Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > That’s why I stipulated that there be one amputee assigned to each god/goddess/godthing. Ideally, each subject would have two amputated limbs; one would be the target of the prayers. The other would be a control arm. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2016, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proof-that-god-exists-an-open-debate-for-the-existence-of-god/764578/367 "2016-09-13T19:46:05Z")
> [@Biffster](#): > > Very quickly you fell back into the traditional sky-father concept of God, I believe, halfway through your post. If science can adjust its hypotheses when new evidence presents itself, why can’t religion? Don’t you think religion is capable of evolving? Of course religions can change. I’m currently reading a book on the history of the Reformation. Some very big changes occurred. Religions, almost by definition, rely upon supernatural explanations for events, and that, almost by definition, fails to be scientific. You can choose one or the other, but you can’t have both. > [@](#): > > As for Dark Matter, if concrete discovery is missing, isn’t that on par with saying we believe the earth is flat; we just haven’t discovered the edge of it yet? . . . In 4,000 B.C., maybe. Today, no. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2016, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proof-that-god-exists-an-open-debate-for-the-existence-of-god/764578/368 "2016-09-13T19:59:53Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > Ideally, each subject would have two amputated limbs; one would be the target of the prayers. The other would be a control arm. Man, that could get expensive: it would cost … ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2016, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proof-that-god-exists-an-open-debate-for-the-existence-of-god/764578/369 "2016-09-13T20:03:23Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > Man, that could get expensive: it would cost … Well, yeah. But on the _other_ hand… ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2016, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proof-that-god-exists-an-open-debate-for-the-existence-of-god/764578/370 "2016-09-13T20:19:38Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > I decided to quote myself, instead, but please link to whatever it is he had to say on the subject. [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=19625848](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=19625848) [QUOTE=Bill Hicks] Lot of Christians wear crosses around their necks. You think when Jesus comes back he’s gonna want to see a [beep]ing cross, man? “Ohhh!” May be why he hasn’t shown up yet. “Man, they’re still wearing crosses. [beep] it, I’m not goin’, Dad. No, they totally missed the point. When they start wearing fishes I might show up again, but … Let me bury fossil heads with you, Dad. [beep] ’em … Let’s [beep] with them! They’re [beep]in’ with me now, let’s get ’em. Give me that brontosaurus head, Dad.” You know, kinda like going up to Jackie Onassis with a rifle pendant on, you know. “Thinkin’ of John, Jackie. We love him. Just tryin’ to keep that memory alive, baby.” [/QUOTE] ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2016, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proof-that-god-exists-an-open-debate-for-the-existence-of-god/764578/371 "2016-09-13T20:39:37Z")
I always loved Jon Stewart’s on-the-outside-looking-in puzzlement; something about, what, did Jesus explain that he was going to die? Though you should fear not, for I shall return to comfort you lo that very Sunday; but I say unto you, if I see even _one_ egg, then I’m _gone_. No, all kidding aside: _I hate eggs_; paint them so they don’t even look like eggs any more, and then hide them all. If, in years to come, you remember nothing else of me and my teachings, recall always that I despised eggs. ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2016, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proof-that-god-exists-an-open-debate-for-the-existence-of-god/764578/372 "2016-09-14T03:55:07Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > “Science” isn’t a body of dogma. It’s a _method_. And no one is required to blindly accept any result of that method; apart from the constraints of time and resource one can reproduce - or disprove - any scientific hypothesis, theory or law one likes via that method. Scientists hold dear, and extrapolate off of, far more than they can reproduce by experiment. I can’t make and observe a Big Bang, do you know someone who has? I’m on your side, I’m just saying… ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2016, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proof-that-god-exists-an-open-debate-for-the-existence-of-god/764578/373 "2016-09-14T04:07:56Z")
> [@Sitnam](#): > > Scientists hold dear, and extrapolate off of, far more than they can reproduce by experiment. I can’t make and observe a Big Bang, do you know someone who has? > > I’m on your side, I’m just saying… If you think that if you can’t make it or observe it, it isn’t “Science”, then you have a very limited understanding of the term. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2016, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proof-that-god-exists-an-open-debate-for-the-existence-of-god/764578/374 "2016-09-14T04:08:48Z")
> [@Sitnam](#): > > Scientists hold dear, and extrapolate off of, far more than they can reproduce by experiment. I can’t make and observe a Big Bang, do you know someone who has? > > I’m on your side, I’m just saying… Grin! Valid point. It’s not all “reproducible.” (And some of the results that are reproducible would be impossible for small, independent researchers. Like finding the Higgs boson. The physics department at San Diego City College isn’t gonna be duplicating CERN’s results any time soon!) ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2016, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proof-that-god-exists-an-open-debate-for-the-existence-of-god/764578/375 "2016-09-14T04:48:52Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > If you think that if you can’t make it or observe it, it isn’t “Science”, then you have a very limited understanding of the term. I guess it’s a good thing I didn’t say that then. ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2016, 7:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proof-that-god-exists-an-open-debate-for-the-existence-of-god/764578/376 "2016-09-14T07:16:55Z")
> [@Sitnam](#): > > Scientists hold dear, and extrapolate off of, far more than they can reproduce by experiment. I can’t make and observe a Big Bang, do you know someone who has? > > I’m on your side, I’m just saying… What needs to be reproducible is not the hypothesis, it is the observation. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2016, 8:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proof-that-god-exists-an-open-debate-for-the-existence-of-god/764578/377 "2016-09-14T08:53:34Z")
> [@Sitnam](#): > > Scientists hold dear, and extrapolate off of, far more than they can reproduce by experiment. I can’t make and observe a Big Bang, do you know someone who has? Scientists, as we speak are reproducing the conditions of the early universe and testing their hypothesis regarding the periods immediatly after the “big bang”. If you mean we cannot run back time and re-start the universe then you may be correct but scientists are not extrapolating from a mere idea or a comforting thought or a poetic phrase. They are using observations, maths and physics to check if they are right and modifying their hypothesis accordingly. Science works backwards from what we see to understand the underlying causes. Religions declares a supernatural cause by fiat and retrofits everything in the world to that. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2016, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proof-that-god-exists-an-open-debate-for-the-existence-of-god/764578/378 "2016-09-14T22:53:35Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > Grin! Valid point. It’s not all “reproducible.” (And some of the results that are reproducible would be impossible for small, independent researchers. Like finding the Higgs boson. The physics department at San Diego City College isn’t gonna be duplicating CERN’s results any time soon!) Reproducible does not mean any guy with a lab in the basement can reproduce it, it just means that enough information is given about the procedure that anyone who wants to reproduce it - with enough money - can. And that subsequent runs will turn up the effect also. Look at cold fusion - Pons and Fleishmann correctly gave enough information for their experiment to be reproduced - and the results refuted. 99.5% of all results (probably) never get reproduced because no one cases enough to do so. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proof-that-god-exists-an-open-debate-for-the-existence-of-god/764578.md?page=18)