# Propaganda Chief Takes Helm at NPR **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 10, 2019, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/propaganda-chief-takes-helm-at-npr/840009 "2019-09-10T21:13:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2019, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/propaganda-chief-takes-helm-at-npr/840009/141 "2019-09-16T23:41:26Z")
> [@IvoryTowerDenizen](#): > > How about if everyone in the area gives their input to help choose who should do these jobs, and instead everyone paying them directly, we each just kick in some money, and someone else distributes it to the people doing the work. Sounds good. See, the answer to all of this ultimately is to get a group of people together to perform these various public services that are essential for a civilized society to function at all, in order to support the free market entrepreneurs conducting business. Just don’t **call** it a government or you have tyranny again. Oh, and all those capitalists chip in a bit of their profits voluntarily to ensure the system can be maintained, and to compensate those public workers for their time and efforts. If businesses don’t opt in, though, you, uh… Hmm. I mean I guess the ones that don’t opt in will still benefit but without paying for it are at a clear advantage, which means that only an idiot with bad business sense would contribute. Why donate your profits at the expense of shareholders (and yourself for that matter)? But you can’t force everyone to contribute because again, tyranny, blah blah blah. Gosh, this free market utopian fantasy stuff is hard! ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2019, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/propaganda-chief-takes-helm-at-npr/840009/142 "2019-09-17T03:13:23Z")
[It needs to be posted now and then.](http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-9I_DTBJL3fE/U-GQSNlY96I/AAAAAAAAGvA/reBmtWUglqI/s1600/libety.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Knowed\_Out](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/knowed_out/32/7380_2.png) [@Knowed\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knowed_Out)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2019, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/propaganda-chief-takes-helm-at-npr/840009/143 "2019-09-17T03:47:06Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > If the property is in dispute, private courts will decide ownership. Same as now but much more efficient and with mechanisms that drive the best decision-makers to the top instead of the best politicians. You mean besides voting? Who would run these mechanisms? Corporations specializing in property disputes perhaps? I bet they’d want to get paid. That’s our only option if you don’t want the dreaded government involved. Either way, it results in you giving money to somebody if you want your property rights secured. You can either pay a lawyer a retainer, or pay government taxes. You don’t really think things through, do you? ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2019, 4:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/propaganda-chief-takes-helm-at-npr/840009/144 "2019-09-17T04:38:47Z")
> [@Knowed\_Out](#): > > Corporations specializing in property disputes perhaps? I bet they’d want to get paid. That’s our only option if you don’t want the dreaded government involved Ya know…I bet some of those corporations would like a fancy title to differentiate themselves from the hoi polloi. Maybe something like Polis or Domain or Kingdom or something like that. Those have a nice ring to them. And of course, they’ll need to hire some muscle to ensure their decisions are carried out if anybody decides they just don’t want to play anymore. Maybe call them, I dunno, an Army or something. Of course, the Army would only be employed against people who don’t want to abide by the decisions of the Kingdom. And ya know…maybe the head of the Kingdom has a feeling they were specially chosen…maybe their Rights are Divinely inspired, so they are the ‘best’ decision-makers after all! Nope, nothing like a government at all. And nothing like any form of government we’ve ever tried before. Nope. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2019, 5:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/propaganda-chief-takes-helm-at-npr/840009/145 "2019-09-17T05:01:43Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > If the property is in dispute, private courts will decide ownership. Same as now but much more efficient and with mechanisms that drive the best decision-makers to the top instead of the best politicians. Private courts? Oh, you mean like sharia courts and the like? ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2019, 7:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/propaganda-chief-takes-helm-at-npr/840009/146 "2019-09-17T07:06:46Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > Private courts? Oh, you mean like sharia courts and the like? IIRC, you agree on which private court when you initiate any contract. Sit down at a restaurant? Before checking the menu, check which private food inspector they use, which private court will arbitrate, and so on. (Check it even if you’ve been to the restaurant before — unscrupulous vendors often change their contractors.) Your smart-phone will have an App telling you what your private court and insurer think about the restaurant’s court and insurer. Make sure you verify the check-sums — the restaurant’s DNS server may be routing you to bogus info. (Everything is legal when there are no laws.) If you order fish, check the fine-print of the restaurant’s food inspector’s brochure: some don’t cover … Come to think of it, maybe you should just stay home and prepare a meal from your own garden. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2019, 7:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/propaganda-chief-takes-helm-at-npr/840009/147 "2019-09-17T07:23:06Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > … There was a time when people could travel between countries unmolested… It’s confusions like this that make me doubt **Farnaby** has ever read a history book. _ **Safe roads for travelers are routinely cited as a primary benefit of Europe’s early strong central governments.** _ ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2019, 7:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/propaganda-chief-takes-helm-at-npr/840009/148 "2019-09-17T07:57:51Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Your smart-phone will have an App telling you what your private court and insurer think about the restaurant’s court and insurer. But how do I go about ensuring the manufacturer of the smartphone and the apps are reliable? And how did I get to the restaurant in the first place since there aren’t any government-provided roads? Better question, since the goverment’s completely out of the picture, what am I using to get this nifty meal at the restaurant? Do I just roll on up with a wagonload, er, carload of stuff to barter? Yeah, I can see how this won’t go over well for a celebratory dinner. ---
**Author:** ![Folacin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folacin/32/3195_2.png) [@Folacin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folacin)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2019, 11:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/propaganda-chief-takes-helm-at-npr/840009/149 "2019-09-17T11:20:03Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > Better question, since the goverment’s completely out of the picture, what am I using to get this nifty meal at the restaurant? Do I just roll on up with a wagonload, er, carload of stuff to barter? Presumably shiny metal and or stones. Check the web-site for what they accept, and hope their in-house appraiser accepts the quality you claim for your payment method. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2019, 11:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/propaganda-chief-takes-helm-at-npr/840009/150 "2019-09-17T11:27:04Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > Better question, since the goverment’s completely out of the picture, what am I using to get this nifty meal at the restaurant? Do I just roll on up with a wagonload, er, carload of stuff to barter? 😕 You’re using _real money_. You know — _ **Bitcoins!** _ ETA: Like a stopped-clock that’s correct twice a day, **Farnaby** may be right about one thing. The nearly half-century of success for modern fiat money is anomalous. Following the recent Bubbles of Asian Debt, Dotcoms, and Housing, Donald Amstad now thinks we’re in a "bubble of ‘risk-free assets’ "! For the first time in my life, I’m taking a significant position in precious metals. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2019, 12:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/propaganda-chief-takes-helm-at-npr/840009/151 "2019-09-17T12:14:20Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > It’s confusions like this that make me doubt **Farnaby** has ever read a history book. _ **Safe roads for travelers are routinely cited as a primary benefit of Europe’s early strong central governments.** _ Bah. Just more NPR propaganda. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2019, 12:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/propaganda-chief-takes-helm-at-npr/840009/152 "2019-09-17T12:27:43Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > That would be up to the owners of the roads… When you speak to people in real life, is the response often giggling? ---
**Author:** ![WillFarnaby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/willfarnaby/32/514_2.png) [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2019, 12:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/propaganda-chief-takes-helm-at-npr/840009/153 "2019-09-17T12:34:27Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > It’s confusions like this that make me doubt **Farnaby** has ever read a history book. _ **Safe roads for travelers are routinely cited as a primary benefit of Europe’s early strong central governments.** _ Europe had no early strong central governments unless you’re going back quite a bit. Italy and Germany were decentralized and ahead of backwaters like France. ---
**Author:** ![WillFarnaby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/willfarnaby/32/514_2.png) [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2019, 12:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/propaganda-chief-takes-helm-at-npr/840009/154 "2019-09-17T12:36:51Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > Since completely free immigration would cause the collapse of the world economy, You win. Not even septicmus will be able to top this dimwitted reply. ---
**Author:** ![WillFarnaby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/willfarnaby/32/514_2.png) [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2019, 12:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/propaganda-chief-takes-helm-at-npr/840009/155 "2019-09-17T12:40:04Z")
The structure of civil society has been so eroded by authoritarian governments that supposedly literate individuals can not conceive of a society that is not forced by the threats of the government. Very sad situation. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2019, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/propaganda-chief-takes-helm-at-npr/840009/156 "2019-09-17T12:46:28Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > The structure of civil society has been so eroded by authoritarian governments that supposedly literate individuals can not conceive of a society that is not forced by the threats of the government. Very sad situation. Do you have an example of such a society in human history? ---
**Author:** ![Wolf333](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolf333/32/3460_2.png) [@Wolf333](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wolf333)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2019, 12:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/propaganda-chief-takes-helm-at-npr/840009/157 "2019-09-17T12:56:52Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > That would be up to the owners of the roads. I would assume there would be some sort of credential. What we wouldn’t have would be armed gangs in clown cars harassing people and escalating situations needlessly. Oh, there would still be armed gangs harassing people. It would just be a different gang every couple of miles. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2019, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/propaganda-chief-takes-helm-at-npr/840009/158 "2019-09-17T13:22:39Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Do you have an example of such a society in human history? I got this one. The glorious Principality of Sealand! ETA: They’re led by a Prince and sell titles of nobility, and have an “army” of “knights”, so maybe they’re not so free of authoritarianism after all. ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2019, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/propaganda-chief-takes-helm-at-npr/840009/159 "2019-09-17T13:29:16Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > The structure of civil society has been so eroded by authoritarian governments that supposedly literate individuals can not conceive of a society that is not forced by the threats of the government. Very sad situation. So, no answers to any of my questions then. Ok. ---
**Author:** ![WillFarnaby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/willfarnaby/32/514_2.png) [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2019, 1:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/propaganda-chief-takes-helm-at-npr/840009/160 "2019-09-17T13:33:21Z")
> [@Wolf333](#): > > Oh, there would still be armed gangs harassing people. It would just be a different gang every couple of miles. Yes roving gangs are a problem in the aisles of Wal Mart. The statist never stops to think that the problems on public property are because of poor govt management. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/propaganda-chief-takes-helm-at-npr/840009.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/propaganda-chief-takes-helm-at-npr/840009.md?page=9)