# Proper use of "i.e." **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [January 5, 2016, 5:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proper-use-of-i-e/742200 "2016-01-05T05:16:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![JBGUSA](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/258eb7/32.png) [@JBGUSA](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JBGUSA)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2016, 5:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proper-use-of-i-e/742200/1 "2016-01-05T05:16:21Z")
If you’re starting a sentence with “I.e.” should the initial “I” be capitalized? ---
**Author:** ![zombywoof](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/9e8a1a/32.png) [@zombywoof](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zombywoof)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2016, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proper-use-of-i-e/742200/2 "2016-01-05T05:19:37Z")
I can’t think of a proper use of “i.e.” at the start of a sentence - can you give an example? ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2016, 5:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proper-use-of-i-e/742200/3 "2016-01-05T05:23:55Z")
I think it could be done. It would be like starting a sentence with a conjunction. I.e., it would be incorrect formally, but probably acceptable as informal usage. (The second sentence in this message should really end with a comma.) ---
**Author:** ![Carl\_Pham](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9a140/32.png) [@Carl\_Pham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carl_Pham)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2016, 5:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proper-use-of-i-e/742200/4 "2016-01-05T05:26:26Z")
If you want to start a sentence with a Latin phrase, you should spell it out, not use the abbreviation. The abbreviations are reserved for interior use. Exempli gratia, if you want to begin a sentence with the Latin for “in other words” you write “id est,” while if it occurs as an introduction to a subordinate clause “i.e.” is fine. If you want to begin a sentence with the Latin for “for example” you write “exempli gratia,” while if it occurs midsentence you write “e.g.” And so on. I would say it falls under the same kind of logic that has you writing out numbers when they begin a sentence (“Four score and seven years ago…”).f ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2016, 5:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proper-use-of-i-e/742200/5 "2016-01-05T05:30:55Z")
[A page that partially asks this about e.g.](http://english.stackexchange.com/questions/156735/should-the-word-after-e-g-be-capital) I feel like I _have_ seen e.g. capitalized but can’t remember where. I.e. makes less sense without being clunky (although both are). ---
**Author:** ![bob\_2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bob_2/32/3341_2.png) [@bob\_2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bob_2)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2016, 10:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proper-use-of-i-e/742200/6 "2016-01-05T10:09:51Z")
Why not just use ‘For example’? ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2016, 10:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proper-use-of-i-e/742200/7 "2016-01-05T10:12:52Z")
Because “id est” means “that is”, not “for example”. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2016, 10:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proper-use-of-i-e/742200/8 "2016-01-05T10:37:46Z")
It is generally not considered good style to do this, but if you must use it to begin a sentence (such as for a quotation), the regular rules of capitalization apply. I don’t know where **Carl Pham** ’s idea about spelling out the Latin phrases out comes from, as I’ve never seen it. Practically no one even knows the underlying Latin for “e.g.” or “i.e.” anymore. It’s not like “etc,” which people read out loud as _et cetera_. ---
**Author:** ![Isilder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/cc9497/32.png) [@Isilder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isilder)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2016, 11:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proper-use-of-i-e/742200/9 "2016-01-05T11:52:44Z")
> [@Carl\_Pham](#): > > If you want to start a sentence with a Latin phrase, you should spell it out, not use the abbreviation. The abbreviations are reserved for interior use. > > Exempli gratia, if you want to begin a sentence with the Latin for “in other words” you write “id est,” I find it hard to imagine how a sentence could be started with “Id est” WHEN it couldn’t be “i.e…” The problem with starting an article , chapter , or true paragraph with “In other words”, is lack of definition of what the original words are. The “Other words” must come second, or else they would be “the words” and not " other words" ---
**Author:** ![JBGUSA](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/258eb7/32.png) [@JBGUSA](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JBGUSA)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2016, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proper-use-of-i-e/742200/10 "2016-01-05T13:07:49Z")
Thanks. Any suggestions for a good grammar site? ---
**Author:** ![CookingWithGas](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cookingwithgas/32/485_2.png) [@CookingWithGas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CookingWithGas)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2016, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proper-use-of-i-e/742200/11 "2016-01-05T14:58:39Z")
Note that your question is more closely to related to style than grammar. Grammar is what is correct as far as parts of speech and sentence structure. Style is a set of guidelines for good, clear writing. You can use perfect grammar and still not write well. Good, but not free. > **[The Chicago Manual of Style, 17th Edition](https://www.chicagomanualofstyle.org/home.html)** > > Find it. Write it. Cite it. The Chicago Manual of Style Online is the venerable, time-tested guide to style, usage, and grammar in an accessible online format. ¶ It is the indispensable reference for writers, editors, proofreaders, indexers,... > **[Associated Press Stylebook](https://www.apstylebook.com/)** > > The AP Stylebook is a writing and editing reference for newsrooms, classrooms and corporate offices worldwide. Here’s a list of free online style guides but the page is full of ads. > **[The Best Free Online Style-Guides in English](https://www.thoughtco.com/top-free-online-style-guides-in-english-1688760)** > > If you're not already using one particular code of style conventions, you may want to learn ahout and apply one of these free online style guides. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2016, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proper-use-of-i-e/742200/12 "2016-01-05T15:27:43Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > Because “id est” means “that is”, not “for example”. So he can start his sentence with “that is.” Or “in other words.” ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2016, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proper-use-of-i-e/742200/13 "2016-01-05T15:48:20Z")
> [@Giles](#): > > It would be like starting a sentence with a conjunction. “I.e.” is an adverb, used to show relation in manner, quality, or degree. I.e., it can be used anywhere one would use “namely.” Certainly, one can start a sentence with an adverb. ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2016, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proper-use-of-i-e/742200/14 "2016-01-05T16:46:04Z")
> [@Tom\_Tildrum](#): > > “I.e.” is an adverb, used to show relation in manner, quality, or degree. I.e., it can be used anywhere one would use “namely.” > > Certainly, one can start a sentence with an adverb. I would have thought that “i.e.” was a clause, since it contains a nominative-case pronoun (“i[d]”) and a verb (“e[st]”), just as “R.S.V.P.” is a sentence (containing two verbs in French). In any case, its normal usage is to link two words, phrases or clauses in much the same way as a conjunction does, saying that the second is the equivalent of the first. It always refers back to something (the “i[d]”), so I don’t think it could ever by a person who has said nothing for it to refer back to. It would be as if somebody opened their mouth, and started speaking with “Secondly …”: that’s an adverb, but where is the first thing that it refers back to? ---
**Author:** ![Me\_Billy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e480ec/32.png) [@Me\_Billy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Me_Billy)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2016, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proper-use-of-i-e/742200/15 "2016-01-05T17:10:45Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > …Practically no one even knows the underlying Latin for “e.g.” or “i.e.” anymore. It’s not like “etc,” which people read out loud as _et cetera_. My thinking as well. The idea is to communicate with the person reading your writing. So it should be something they understand or are likely to understand. i.e. I feel that is more important than being “correct”. Same goes for using foreign language phrases in a book written in English. People who know English do not necessarily know French, German , etc. phrases. If you must use foreign language phrases in a book written in English, please translate into English using parenthesis, after using the word or phrase. Then _all_ readers will understand what you are trying to communicate! ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2016, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proper-use-of-i-e/742200/16 "2016-01-05T17:13:35Z")
> [@Giles](#): > > It always refers back to something (the “i[d]”), so I don’t think it could ever by a person who has said nothing for it to refer back to. It would be as if somebody opened their mouth, and started speaking with “Secondly …”: that’s an adverb, but where is the first thing that it refers back to? People can say more than one sentence at a time, and the second refer to the first. You do it yourself right here. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2016, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proper-use-of-i-e/742200/17 "2016-01-05T18:38:16Z")
> [@Giles](#): > > I would have thought that “i.e.” was a clause, since it contains a nominative-case pronoun (“i[d]”) and a verb (“e[st]”), just as “R.S.V.P.” is a sentence (containing two verbs in French). > > In any case, its normal usage is to link two words, phrases or clauses in much the same way as a conjunction does, saying that the second is the equivalent of the first. It always refers back to something (the “i[d]”), so I don’t think it could ever by a person who has said nothing for it to refer back to. It would be as if somebody opened their mouth, and started speaking with “Secondly …”: that’s an adverb, but where is the first thing that it refers back to? My apologies; I did a little more digging, and you are just as right as I am. There is apparently a [recognized](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conjunctive_adverb) [category](http://www.chompchomp.com/terms/conjunctiveadverb.htm) of words and phrases called “conjunctive adverbs.” Hoist on my own pedantry. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2016, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proper-use-of-i-e/742200/18 "2016-01-05T18:40:56Z")
\*\*Proper use of “i.e.” \*\* Not after C. ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2016, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proper-use-of-i-e/742200/19 "2016-01-05T23:12:29Z")
> [@zombywoof](#): > > I can’t think of a proper use of “i.e.” at the start of a sentence - can you give an example? No, that would be “e.g.”. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2016, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proper-use-of-i-e/742200/20 "2016-01-05T23:49:05Z")
The general answer to questions like this is to re-write your sentence so it _doesn’t_ start with _i.e_. or any other awkward expression. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/proper-use-of-i-e/742200.md?page=2)