# Property owners rights and smokers. **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 20, 2003, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/property-owners-rights-and-smokers/214304 "2003-11-20T14:27:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 5\ **Page:** 12
**Author:** ![pervert](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/bbe5ce/32.png) [@pervert](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pervert)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2003, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/property-owners-rights-and-smokers/214304/221 "2003-12-04T19:34:46Z")
OK. And have one for me;) BTW when I said last post, I meant your post from 12-03-2003 02:35 PM. somehow I missed it. We were going back and for so fast, I skipped it somehow. See you in the next thread! ---
**Author:** ![Skyfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Skyfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skyfire)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2003, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/property-owners-rights-and-smokers/214304/222 "2003-12-04T22:59:24Z")
> [@](#): > > \*\*I don’t feel any need to get in a parting shot, pervert. I think we both made our points, so I’ll leave it at that. Perhaps I’ll go celebrate by having a drink at the local tavern and enjoying the smoke-free air.😉 \*\* You are right, Blowero. I behaved badly and I hope you will accept my apology. I’m old enough to know better than to behave like a hormonally-challenged adolescent. Please enjoy the drink. If I lived anywhere near you I’d buy you that drink and offer apologies in person. Your posts have been thought-provoking. Thank you for that. ---
**Author:** ![I\_m\_right](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b5e925/32.png) [@I\_m\_right](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_m_right)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 6:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/property-owners-rights-and-smokers/214304/223 "2003-12-05T06:29:36Z")
We also need to look at the negative effects these bans are having on small businesses, especially blue-collar resaurants and bars that cater to smokers. This seems unfair, not all businesses are impacted the same. While the bans are set up for the good purpose of protecting workers against second-hand smoke…they may also have unintended negative effects on local businesses. A respect for property rights should protect these establishments. If left up to the free market, customers could demand change on their own. ---
**Author:** ![blowero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/41988e/32.png) [@blowero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blowero)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/property-owners-rights-and-smokers/214304/224 "2003-12-05T20:30:35Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by I’m right \* > We also need to look at the negative effects these bans are having on small businesses, especially blue-collar resaurants and bars that cater to smokers. This seems unfair, not all businesses are impacted the same. \*\*While the bans are set up for the good purpose of protecting workers against second-hand smoke…\*\*they may also have unintended negative effects on local businesses. A respect for property rights should protect these establishments. If left up to the free market, customers could demand change on their own. [emphasis added] If you frame the argument that way, I disagree. If you concede that the purpose is to protect the workers, then that has to override the importance of profit. Almost all changes in the workplace that have occured in the history of the U.S. have been towards protecting the safety of workers, even if such remediation costs the business part of their profit; almost never towards _decreasing_ their safety. A business can always make more profit by disregarding the well-being of its employees, but ethically should never be allowed to do so. Skyfire, thanks for the very nice apology, and I’m sorry I overreacted to your previous post. I must be having nicotene withdrawal from spending so much time in smoking threads.😉 ---
**Author:** ![Skyfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Skyfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skyfire)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2003, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/property-owners-rights-and-smokers/214304/225 "2003-12-06T04:12:43Z")
> [@](#): > > \*\*Skyfire, thanks for the very nice apology, and I’m sorry I overreacted to your previous post. I must be having nicotene withdrawal from spending so much time in smoking threads.😉 \*\* Lol, that withdrawal is a bitch! [I know, I went through it 10 years ago. Still have strong cravings occasionally.] Secondhand withdrawal – that’s a good one. 🙂 I was being an obstinate butthead. Apology was in order. Hope you enjoyed that drink. Or drinks. See? You get to have fun while I get to go shovel snow now. So, when you have the next drink, have one for me. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/property-owners-rights-and-smokers/214304.md?page=11)