# PSH \[Philip Seymour Hoffman\] has died; discuss drugs and addiction here **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 4, 2014, 5:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psh-philip-seymour-hoffman-has-died-discuss-drugs-and-addiction-here/680477 "2014-02-04T05:29:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Esox\_Lucius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/848f3c/32.png) [@Esox\_Lucius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esox_Lucius)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2014, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psh-philip-seymour-hoffman-has-died-discuss-drugs-and-addiction-here/680477/61 "2014-02-08T02:02:49Z")
I don’t see how legalization would have prevented Hoffman from being an addict to the point that he ODed. The legality of alcohol hasn’t prevented alcoholics from ruining, and even losing, their lives. ---
**Author:** ![scabpicker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scabpicker/32/8268_2.png) [@scabpicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scabpicker)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2014, 4:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psh-philip-seymour-hoffman-has-died-discuss-drugs-and-addiction-here/680477/62 "2014-02-08T04:23:08Z")
Well, Brand doesn’t seem to be advocating “go to the bar and get loaded” legalization, but rather a treatment system similar to the one in the [U.K.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heroin-assisted_treatment). I don’t see a down side to them, really. If Hoffman was getting his heroin from such a place, an overdose would be rare, and he’d have people treating him immediately if he did. ---
**Author:** ![Esox\_Lucius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/848f3c/32.png) [@Esox\_Lucius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esox_Lucius)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2014, 4:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psh-philip-seymour-hoffman-has-died-discuss-drugs-and-addiction-here/680477/63 "2014-02-08T04:45:42Z")
I guess the numbers don’t lie, and some addicts would benefit from it. From what I’ve read of Hoffman, he seemed to have been more of the “go to the bar and get loaded” kind of guy, but maybe not. At any rate, for his benefit it would have been good to at least have the option of a program like that. In your Wikipedia link, I found this humourous in a black kind of way: “For decades it [the heroin maintenance program] supplied a few hundred addicts nationwide, **most of whom were doctors themselves**.” ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2014, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psh-philip-seymour-hoffman-has-died-discuss-drugs-and-addiction-here/680477/64 "2014-02-28T22:27:53Z")
Coroner’s report is out. Cause of death due to a speedball (the intravenous injection of cocaine with heroin or morphine in the same syringe). Heroin, cocaine, amphetamines and benzodiazepines were found in his system. > **[Hoffman died from toxic drug mixture](https://nypost.com/2014/02/28/philip-seymour-hoffman-died-from-speedball-drug-mixture/)** > > Philip Seymour Hoffman died from a “speedball,” a concoction that has killed several other celebrities, the city’s Office of Chief Medical Examiner said Friday. Hoffman’s death in his Village apart… ---
**Author:** ![Melchior](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Melchior](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melchior)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2014, 4:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psh-philip-seymour-hoffman-has-died-discuss-drugs-and-addiction-here/680477/65 "2014-03-02T04:31:16Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > To avoid more sidetracking and tangents from this thread: [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=714759](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=714759) Is there anyone who does \*not \*know that heroin is addictive? If so, why do they start? ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2014, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psh-philip-seymour-hoffman-has-died-discuss-drugs-and-addiction-here/680477/66 "2014-03-02T18:32:42Z")
> [@Melchior](#): > > Is there anyone who does \*not \*know that heroin is addictive? If so, why do they start? There is no one who does not know that cigarettes are addictive. Why do they start? Everyone knows that alcohol is addictive, why do people drink? Caffeine is addictive, why do people start that? Because the perceived reward outweighs the perceived risk. The same can be said for anything dangerous. You know that driving a car carries inherent risks, but (I assume) you do it anyway. Your personal risk-reward calculus results in your decision to drive. People use drugs because they get something out of it, and their own evaluation of the risks of use versus the benefits of what they get out of it determines their use. It might be flawed reasoning. Hell, I agree that it is. But it’s pretty clear, to me at least, _why_ people use heroin. . ---
**Author:** ![babygoat666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/2acd7d/32.png) [@babygoat666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/babygoat666)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2014, 5:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psh-philip-seymour-hoffman-has-died-discuss-drugs-and-addiction-here/680477/67 "2014-03-04T05:34:05Z")
Look at all the high horses in here. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2014, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psh-philip-seymour-hoffman-has-died-discuss-drugs-and-addiction-here/680477/68 "2014-03-04T18:23:35Z")
> [@Rachellelogram](#): > > Yeah, you got lucky. I am similarly lucky, in that I have an addictive personality and am descended from a long line of alcoholics. But I’m not addicted to anything illegal or substantially-harming (caffeine, formerly tobacco). I’ve never tried illegal drugs beyond weed. I don’t think it’s a sign of character, it was just dumb luck. I, like you, have honestly never been tempted to try cocaine or meth or etc. So resisting their appeal was never a struggle for us, and thus no personal victory over such substances can be claimed. There is no dumb luck involved in not engaging in something known to be egregiously stupid. ---
**Author:** ![babygoat666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/2acd7d/32.png) [@babygoat666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/babygoat666)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2014, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psh-philip-seymour-hoffman-has-died-discuss-drugs-and-addiction-here/680477/69 "2014-03-04T21:41:34Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > There is no dumb luck involved in not engaging in something known to be egregiously stupid. How does your simple worldview reconcile the prevalence of drugs? ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2014, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psh-philip-seymour-hoffman-has-died-discuss-drugs-and-addiction-here/680477/70 "2014-03-05T01:46:25Z")
Lots of stupid people, apparently. ---
**Author:** ![Melchior](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Melchior](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melchior)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2014, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psh-philip-seymour-hoffman-has-died-discuss-drugs-and-addiction-here/680477/71 "2014-03-05T02:10:39Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > There is no dumb luck involved in not engaging in something known to be egregiously stupid. Precisely. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2014, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psh-philip-seymour-hoffman-has-died-discuss-drugs-and-addiction-here/680477/72 "2014-03-05T02:18:17Z")
> [@Melchior](#): > > Precisely. Precisely simplistic, you mean? ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2014, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psh-philip-seymour-hoffman-has-died-discuss-drugs-and-addiction-here/680477/73 "2014-03-05T05:20:37Z")
> [@andros](#): > > Lots of stupid people, apparently. [Yep.](http://newsfeed.time.com/2014/02/16/1-in-4-americans-thinks-sun-orbits-earth/) ---
**Author:** ![Grumman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/43a26b/32.png) [@Grumman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grumman)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2014, 6:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psh-philip-seymour-hoffman-has-died-discuss-drugs-and-addiction-here/680477/74 "2014-03-05T06:10:40Z")
> [@andros](#): > > Precisely simplistic, you mean? No. Heroin makes your life worse, one way or another. It might kill you directly. It might convince you that krokodil is a good idea. Or it might just throw all your money into a pit. If you try heroin, it’s because you were not smart enough to not try heroin. ---
**Author:** ![scabpicker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scabpicker/32/8268_2.png) [@scabpicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scabpicker)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2014, 12:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psh-philip-seymour-hoffman-has-died-discuss-drugs-and-addiction-here/680477/75 "2014-03-05T12:36:18Z")
Horseshit. I’ve known plenty of smart people who were hooked on heroin. Being smart isn’t some panacea that keeps you from making mistakes. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2014, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psh-philip-seymour-hoffman-has-died-discuss-drugs-and-addiction-here/680477/76 "2014-03-05T16:39:06Z")
> [@scabpicker](#): > > Horseshit. I’ve known plenty of smart people who were hooked on heroin. Being smart isn’t some panacea that keeps you from making mistakes. we disagree on what makes someone smart. I know people who got straight A’s in school and couldn’t make simple rational decisions. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2014, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psh-philip-seymour-hoffman-has-died-discuss-drugs-and-addiction-here/680477/77 "2014-03-05T16:46:02Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > we disagree on what makes someone smart. I know people who got straight A’s in school and couldn’t make simple rational decisions. Which is why “using heroin == stupid” is a terribly simplistic and deeply flawed idea. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2014, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psh-philip-seymour-hoffman-has-died-discuss-drugs-and-addiction-here/680477/78 "2014-03-05T17:14:17Z")
> [@andros](#): > > Which is why “using heroin == stupid” is a terribly simplistic and deeply flawed idea. how so? You’ve never heard the term “book smart”? If repeating back information was a harbinger of intelligence we would be giving diplomas to parrots. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2014, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psh-philip-seymour-hoffman-has-died-discuss-drugs-and-addiction-here/680477/79 "2014-03-05T17:27:33Z")
So you’re fine with the idea that “smart” manifests in different ways? Aren’t we going around in circles here? I’m pretty sure we discussed this in this thread already. Do you have the notion that anyone who makes a stupid choice is automatically a stupid person? ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2014, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psh-philip-seymour-hoffman-has-died-discuss-drugs-and-addiction-here/680477/80 "2014-03-05T17:42:35Z")
I don’t know if this is the case but if PSH suffered from depression and was using drugs to compensate, then what we really should be focusing on is mental health and better ways to treat it. I think it’s wrong to harshly judge PSH for using narcotics without knowing why he used them. Sure, it’s possible he was just trying to have fun and got sucked into an addiction. But what if his motivation was not quite so simple? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psh-philip-seymour-hoffman-has-died-discuss-drugs-and-addiction-here/680477.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psh-philip-seymour-hoffman-has-died-discuss-drugs-and-addiction-here/680477.md?page=5)