# Psychopaths **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [July 17, 2014, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psychopaths/693392 "2014-07-17T19:56:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Fuzzy\_Dunlop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/848f3c/32.png) [@Fuzzy\_Dunlop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fuzzy_Dunlop)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psychopaths/693392/21 "2014-07-18T03:25:19Z")
I was listening to a show - I think This American Life - about bad children. When they were talking to some expert on exceptionally bad children he jokingly said that toddlerhood is basically a stage of life that we parents survive because our kids are too small to hurt us. He was being glib, not literally making the same case as **Daz ‘the burner’ Rush** , and I don’t remember what qualified him as an expert anyway. His general point was that kids aren’t really bad or good, just that some don’t learn to empathize with others or become motivated by earning their parents praise the way normal kids do. It’s not an innate ability. ---
**Author:** ![EdwinAmi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5fc32e/32.png) [@EdwinAmi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EdwinAmi)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psychopaths/693392/22 "2014-07-18T04:22:00Z")
> [@](#): > > why would little empathy be difficult to buy into? Because the proposition of the psychopath theory is that they have NO empathy, NO ability to love or care about someone else, and are SOLELY driven by their own self-interest. Like, a sociopath all alone, if you left him stranded on an island where he felt no one could see him or what he did, would without trouble or hesitation strangle a puppy to death to eat it once he got hungry (and if there were a puppy there on the island), because the endearment we feel when we see something cute like that he’s actually incapable of feeling. Or whatever hypothetical example yu could come up with ---
**Author:** ![palacheck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a88e57/32.png) [@palacheck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/palacheck)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 7:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psychopaths/693392/23 "2014-07-18T07:34:57Z")
> [@EdwinAmi](#): > > Because the proposition of the psychopath theory is that they have NO empathy, NO ability to love or care about someone else, and are SOLELY driven by their own self-interest. Like, a sociopath all alone, if you left him stranded on an island where he felt no one could see him or what he did, would without trouble or hesitation strangle a puppy to death to eat it once he got hungry (and if there were a puppy there on the island), because the endearment we feel when we see something cute like that he’s actually incapable of feeling. Or whatever hypothetical example yu could come up with What? You do realize there are people who torture and kill animals for fun, yes? ---
**Author:** ![RaftPeople](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/6f9a4e/32.png) [@RaftPeople](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RaftPeople)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psychopaths/693392/24 "2014-07-18T14:21:14Z")
> [@EdwinAmi](#): > > Because the proposition of the psychopath theory is that they have NO empathy, NO ability to love or care about someone else, and are SOLELY driven by their own self-interest. No, like most things related to human attributes there is a range not simply an on/off value. From a brain imaging study of people with psychopathic tendencies: "Participants were assessed with the widely used PCL-R, a diagnostic tool to identify their degree of psychopathic tendencies. Based on this assessment, the participants were then divided in three groups of approximately 40 individuals each: highly, moderately, and weakly psychopathic. When highly psychopathic participants imagined pain to themselves, they showed a typical neural response within the brain regions involved in empathy for pain, including the anterior insula, the anterior midcingulate cortex, somatosensory cortex, and the right amygdala. The increase in brain activity in these regions was unusually pronounced, suggesting that psychopathic people are sensitive to the thought of pain. But when participants imagined pain to others, these regions failed to become active in high psychopaths. Moreover, psychopaths showed an increased response in the ventral striatum, an area known to be involved in pleasure, when imagining others in pain." Note the use of phrases like “degree of psychopathic tendencies”, and “highly psychopathic”, etc. ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psychopaths/693392/25 "2014-07-18T14:44:19Z")
> [@Daz\_the\_burner\_Rush](#): > > I never asked for it to be considered a statement of fact, please read my previous post again. I think you want to reconsider using the word ‘we’, I think other people have read and understood my post as intended. You’re best off disregarding any poster who simply posts lame-ass attempts at Socratic questions and/or nitpicky questions as a substitute for actually replying. It derails the thread and you can’t actually win, because no matter what your answer, there’ll just be more lame-ass questions. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psychopaths/693392/26 "2014-07-18T14:58:05Z")
> [@Fenris](#): > > You’re best off disregarding any poster who simply posts lame-ass attempts at Socratic questions and/or nitpicky questions as a substitute for actually replying. It derails the thread and you can’t actually win, because no matter what your answer, there’ll just be more lame-ass questions. The OP is asking for opinions based on unattributed(and wrong) definitions and “facts”, and I just happened to notice what forum he posted this thread in. Did you? ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psychopaths/693392/27 "2014-07-18T15:12:22Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > The OP is asking for opinions based on unattributed(and wrong) definitions and “facts”, and I just happened to notice what forum he posted this thread in. > Did you? I wasn’t addressing you. I was giving out general advice that had some relevance to this thread. Or didn’t you notice that? ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psychopaths/693392/28 "2014-07-18T15:17:35Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > The OP is asking for opinions based on unattributed(and wrong) definitions and “facts”, and I just happened to notice what forum he posted this thread in. > Did you? Why do you keep posting the word “fact” in quotes? The OP didn’t try to pass anything off as a fact, which is why the OP is better off ignoring every idiotic contribution you’ve made to this thread. On top of that, he’s right. According to the study, over 1% of the population shows potentiality for psychopathy, which isn’t materially different than saying 1% of the population has psychopathic traits, for the purposes of this discussion. If you have something to add other than snark that totally misses it’s mark, then by all means share with the group. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psychopaths/693392/29 "2014-07-18T15:18:25Z")
> [@Daz\_the\_burner\_Rush](#): > > Here’s a thought. > Is psychopathy a basic, unaltered human condition? > Please nobody answer who, after reading the word ‘psychopath’ thinks ‘mindless serial killers’. [ Since “psychopath” is a legal term rather than a medical term, and since legalities change from location to location, and since none of the laws that deal with “psychopathy” as they describe it get into its permanency there can be no factual answer to this question. > [@Daz\_the\_burner\_Rush](#): > > These days many of us are aware that psychopaths walk among us. In fact, it has been said that 1 in every 100 of us are psychopaths, or at the very least have psychopathic traits. > [@Daz\_the\_burner\_Rush](#): > > Those traits can be; lack of empathy, lack of ability to follow o ‘life plan’, unreliability. > I was thinking that these so-called psychopathic traits, and others, are traits that i think people are probably generally born with, and that it is learned behaviour that subsequently causes these traits to diminish. > Even the lack of fear thing, I know that people who know about this stuff put a lot down to an abnormality in the amygdala, but if an individual was never civilized, could he/she be considered a pychopath? Calls for individual opinions, probably best suited for Great Debates or IMHO? ---
**Author:** ![jtur88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e9c0ed/32.png) [@jtur88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jtur88)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psychopaths/693392/30 "2014-07-18T15:51:13Z")
Psychopath and Sociopath are used pretty much interchangeably by the mental health profession, but I tend to think of Psychopaths as people whose brutality can be contrasted with the subtlety of the Sociopath. If you know any women whose husbands are Sociopaths, you will probably have a pretty good picture, provided you know them well enough to know what is going on behind closed doors. Sociopaths are very skilled at knowing the boundaries of what they can get away with, so they often go their entire life without risk of prosecution, and privately gloat about it within themselves. They get psychological control of their family members, and never let go. I believe the disorder is relatively uncommon among women, with about 80% of diagnosed sociopaths being male. ---
**Author:** ![PlainJain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/5daacb/32.png) [@PlainJain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PlainJain)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psychopaths/693392/31 "2014-07-18T16:03:08Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Since “psychopath” is a legal term rather than a medical term, and since legalities change from location to location, and since none of the laws that deal with “psychopathy” as they describe it get into its permanency there can be no factual answer to this question. Calls for individual opinions, probably best suited for Great Debates or IMHO? Jeez man, just what is your problem with the OP? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psychopaths/693392/32 "2014-07-18T16:05:46Z")
[From the NIH site-](http://www.nimh.nih.gov/statistics/1antisocial.shtml)About 1% of the adult population of the Unite States has what they call “Antisocial Personality Disorder”, defined as "“…a pervasive pattern of disregard for, and violation of, the rights of others that begins in childhood or early adolescence and continues into adulthood.” The site says that men are effected by this more than women. Whether this is 80% or not may be answer in the pdf that I cannot open at work. If someone could please take a look and report back, I greatly appreciate it. ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psychopaths/693392/33 "2014-07-18T16:18:34Z")
Well the NIH site is all kajiggered up. I downloaded the pdf and all it is is the same graph that is above the link for the pdf. The “Prevelance” “Demographics” and “Treatment/Services Use.” ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psychopaths/693392/34 "2014-07-18T16:22:37Z")
> [@Drunky\_Smurf](#): > > Well the NIH site is all kajiggered up. I downloaded the pdf and all it is is the same graph that is above the link for the pdf. The “Prevelance” “Demographics” and “Treatment/Services Use.” Thanks for trying. Where did you get that “80%” stat from **jtur88**? ---
**Author:** ![Washoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ecae2f/32.png) [@Washoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Washoe)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psychopaths/693392/35 "2014-07-18T17:24:06Z")
> [@Daz\_the\_burner\_Rush](#): > > Is psychopathy a basic, unaltered human condition? The most recent information that I’ve seen on the subject indicates that sociopathy is believed to be about 40% genetic, and 60% environmental. I’ll see if I can find the cite, but I think I threw away the textbook. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psychopaths/693392/36 "2014-07-18T18:16:59Z")
> [@Fenris](#): > > You’re best off disregarding any poster who simply posts lame-ass attempts at Socratic questions and/or nitpicky questions as a substitute for actually replying. It derails the thread and you can’t actually win, because no matter what your answer, there’ll just be more lame-ass questions. **Moderator Note** Despite your disclaimer, this is a rather obvious jab at **Czarcasm**. Let’s refrain from personal attacks in General Questions. And let’s refrain from Junior Modding as well. No warning issued. Colibri General Questions Moderator ---
**Author:** ![PlainJain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/5daacb/32.png) [@PlainJain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PlainJain)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psychopaths/693392/37 "2014-07-18T18:47:40Z")
You mean like this? > [@Czarcasm](#): > > Calls for individual opinions, probably best suited for Great Debates or IMHO? ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psychopaths/693392/38 "2014-07-18T18:54:03Z")
> [@Daz\_the\_burner\_Rush](#): > > Why exactly does this matter, if you understand the general point i was trying to make? It could be some bloke at a bar, it was a glib statement used to make a point. > [@PlainJain](#): > > Jeez man, just what is your problem with the OP? " **Moderating** This being General Questions, I think it’s reasonable to ask the OP to define what he’s actually talking about before attempting to provide an answer. > [@Czarcasm](#): > > Calls for individual opinions, probably best suited for Great Debates or IMHO? If the OP was seeking to “make a point,” as he states, this perhaps would be better placed in GD or IMHO. However, there are factual aspects of the question that can be addressed in GQ. If the OP prefers, I can close this thread and you can open another in another forum. As it is it isn’t clear if you are seeking factual information or want to discuss your own ideas. Colibri General Questions Moderator ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psychopaths/693392/39 "2014-07-18T18:57:21Z")
> [@PlainJain](#): > > You mean like this? The OP does in fact appear to want to discuss his own “thoughts” about psychopathy, so that GD or IMHO may actually be a more appropriate forum. The OP’s intent, however, isn’t entirely clear. ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psychopaths/693392/40 "2014-07-18T19:06:32Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Thanks for trying. > Where did you get that “80%” stat from **jtur88**? When I was googling around looking for that stat all I found was that psycopathy affects 3% males and 1% females. From here: > **[What percentage of people are psychopaths/sociopaths?](https://www.quora.com/What-percentage-of-people-are-psychopaths-sociopaths)** > > Answer (1 of 19): These are all the widely available statistics for the prevalance of psychopathy and sociopathy in the general population as well as in specific areas. Also I have included statistics about associated personality disorders such as... The answerer says this: “According to Wikipedia, the DSM IV-TR gives the prevalence of psychopathy as 3% in males and 1% in females” and provides a link to wiki: > **[Antisocial personality disorder](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisocial_personality_disorder)** > > Antisocial personality disorder (ASPD) is a personality disorder defined by a chronic pattern of behavior that disregards the rights and well-being of others. People with ASPD often exhibit behavior that conflicts with social norms, leading to issues with interpersonal relationships, employment, and legal matters. The condition generally manifests in childhood or early adolescence, with a high rate of associated conduct problems and a tendency for symptoms to peak in late adolescence and early... but I could not find that claim in the wiki article. If the DSM IV-TR does indeed say that then a percantage can be made from that. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psychopaths/693392.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/psychopaths/693392.md?page=3)