# Pub Closures **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [March 19, 2008, 12:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pub-closures/441926 "2008-03-19T12:03:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Sal\_Ammoniac](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/8dc957/32.png) [@Sal\_Ammoniac](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sal_Ammoniac)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2008, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pub-closures/441926/21 "2008-03-20T19:37:54Z")
I find myself wondering if changing gender attitudes are driving the decline. Here in the States, things like bowling leagues and social clubs (Elks, Odd Fellows, etc.) are in steep decline, and part of the reason is that those places used to be where men went to escape their wives. To the extent that pub patrons used to be mostly men, I’d guess that pubs would be affected by the same phenomenon. In short, I guess men just like their wives better these days. ---
**Author:** ![muldoonthief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldoonthief/32/3188_2.png) [@muldoonthief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/muldoonthief)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2008, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pub-closures/441926/22 "2008-03-20T20:17:49Z")
[QUOTE=Sal Ammoniac] I find myself wondering if changing gender attitudes are driving the decline. Here in the States, things like bowling leagues and social clubs (Elks, Odd Fellows, etc.) are in steep decline, and part of the reason is that those places used to be where men went to escape their wives. To the extent that pub patrons used to be mostly men, I’d guess that pubs would be affected by the same phenomenon. In short, I guess men just like their wives better these days. [/QUOTE] Nah, it’s just that now that we let them wear shoes, they keep following us out of the house. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2008, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pub-closures/441926/23 "2008-03-20T23:18:44Z")
I haven’t witnessed too many fights in Manhattan bars. At least not compared to when I lived in Boston. I would guess the reason is that in Boston, the bars tend to be clustered in certain neighborhoods - Landsdown St near Fenway, Faniel Hall area, Alston/Brighton. They also close around 2am. So basically, at the end of the evening, you suddenly get hundreds of pissed off drunk dudes who didn’t hook up all thrust out onto the street together. Outside of the cities in the suburbs, I’m not sure how much of a pub culture there is. Drunk driving seems to be frowned apon as is coming home to your family late at night reeking of alchohol. Bars seem to be mostly for guys grabbing an after work beer or young people looking to hook up. ---
**Author:** ![Moirai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/96bed5/32.png) [@Moirai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moirai)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2008, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pub-closures/441926/24 "2008-03-21T00:28:51Z")
I have a friend who shuttered his pub in Co. Leitrim recently. He thought it would be the smoking ban that did it, but it was the drink tax. He got too pissed off to do business anymore and bailed. Now he has a couple of chippies. Less hassle, good money. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2008, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pub-closures/441926/25 "2008-03-21T03:26:03Z")
Pubs have _always_ been full of lager louts. They’re _pubs_. That’s what they’re for. Pubs are closing because people suddenly have other shit to do (the internet, more than four TV channels, nightclubs that aren’t the Mecca, etc.), not because people are scared of drunk yobbos. ---
**Author:** ![toadspittle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c0e974/32.png) [@toadspittle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/toadspittle)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2008, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pub-closures/441926/26 "2008-03-21T04:36:27Z")
[QUOTE=EJsGirl] Now he has a couple of chippies. Less hassle, good money. [/QUOTE] What does this mean? In our parlance, “chippies” means young, attractive women. (Or chipmunks.) Is he a pimp? Or is “chippies” slang for fish-and-chips shops, or something? ---
**Author:** ![Audrey\_Levins](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/73ab20/32.png) [@Audrey\_Levins](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Audrey_Levins)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2008, 8:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pub-closures/441926/27 "2008-03-21T08:12:30Z")
[QUOTE=Lust4Life] My own opinion of this is that in the U.S. if things get out of hand or someone starts on someone purely out of drunken bravado you never know if the victim is going to produce a firearm. But as I say that is only my guess. [/QUOTE] It is illegal to carry a gun into any establishment that serves or even sells alcohol; now of course you could argue that “surely people do it anyway” but I’ve never even met someone who carries a gun on their person. I do know one guy who has a gun in his car but that’s because he does a lot of traveling through very remote areas. More people have guns for “home security” reasons but that isn’t what we’re talking about, as those are not carried about to whip out at a bar in the event of a fight. I think some people overseas greatly overestimate the average American’s fondness for firearms…like just because we can buy them and–with a permit–carry them around means that lots of us do. The idea is a bit absurd. I’m sure there are shady bars in less desirable areas where you might not want to assume that nobody’s “packing,” but in the average neighborhood bar? Seriously? This isn’t the Old West. I’ve seen my fair share of bar fights because I’ve worked in them for years and they’re de-escalated by bouncers, male bartenders, and cops. Not because of the perps’ fear of getting shot. I find the idea quite silly. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2008, 9:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pub-closures/441926/28 "2008-03-21T09:54:56Z")
[QUOTE=toadspittle] What does this mean? In our parlance, “chippies” means young, attractive women. (Or chipmunks.) Is he a pimp? Or is “chippies” slang for fish-and-chips shops, or something? [/QUOTE] The last: fish and chip shops. ---
**Author:** ![chowder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/977dab/32.png) [@chowder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chowder)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2008, 10:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pub-closures/441926/29 "2008-03-21T10:03:24Z")
My local watering hole was virtually empty following the smoking ban. The gaffer had a sort of gazebo erected for us filthy smokers and gradually the place started to fill up. Unfortunately the latest increases have meant that it’s getting back to as it was and nobody stays in a pub if you walk in and there are only a couple of other blokes there ---
**Author:** ![Meurglys](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/258eb7/32.png) [@Meurglys](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meurglys)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2008, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pub-closures/441926/30 "2008-03-21T13:10:23Z")
It used to be every drinker’s dream to live in a flat above (or very close to) a pub. Now, with the floating crowd of often noisy smokers hanging about on the pavement outside, I’d never move close to a pub. But at least you can see some of the clientele outside and tell from a distance which pubs to avoid! When I worked slightly further out of town I often went for a drink after work; now I work in the centre (The Grassmarket, if you know Edinburgh) I never do - it quickly becomes a horrible place to try to have a quiet drink, or the one bar I do like is often far too busy to actually relax in… We tend to drink in the 3rd closest pub to our flat and even then we sometimes give it a miss (and go to the 11th closest) as it’s often full of v.noisy sports fans… practically every pub has TVs on all the time and they never show anything but sport, which can get boring if you’re not a fan. If there’s a big match on, we sometimes just stay in and avoid the crush and noise - and these are relatively well-behaved folk, not the neds and chavs, stags and hens, etc… We’re slowly joining the ‘bottle of wine at home’ brigade… Old farts, us! ---
**Author:** ![An\_Gadai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@An\_Gadai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/An_Gadai)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2008, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pub-closures/441926/31 "2008-03-21T13:22:36Z")
A lot of pubs in Ireland are closing down. There are various reasons cited. The smoking ban, tighter drink/driving legislation, demographics (that is the clientele of country pubs getting older and dying and not being adequately replaced), and the price of alcohol have all been blamed. I’ve heard from several publicans who had pubs with an older clientele that their customers hate standing outside to smoke because the weather here is generally shit and they might be “seen”. ---
**Author:** ![Lust4Life](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ecc23a/32.png) [@Lust4Life](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lust4Life)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2008, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pub-closures/441926/32 "2008-03-21T18:01:04Z")
Actually I can see the point made in the increased choice of things to do of a night other then watch Corrie on the telly and going to the pub but one indicator that seems to show that there is at least something in my point is the number of “ordinary” pubs as opposed to night out pubs that now employ bouncers on the door at W/Es. I cant see pub owners/managers spending from the profits without a very good reason. An unrelated point but of interest I think is when a real ale/wine bar opened up in my area several years ago now,right next door to a soccer pub and with four others in close proximity the chavs decided to make it one of their watering holes. The owners started playing classical music in the background which promptly got rid of the yobs. It is now an incredibly successful bar judging by the number of customers even during the week and has a great,really friendly feeling there.They’ve actually bought the neighbouring premises and expanded the place. ---
**Author:** ![GorillaMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/50afbb/32.png) [@GorillaMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GorillaMan)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2008, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pub-closures/441926/33 "2008-03-21T18:14:17Z")
[QUOTE=Lust4Life] Actually I can see the point made in the increased choice of things to do of a night other then watch Corrie on the telly and going to the pub but one indicator that seems to show that there is at least something in my point is the number of “ordinary” pubs as opposed to night out pubs that now employ bouncers on the door at W/Es. [/quote] There is something to this, but there can also be other reasons for employing bouncers, anything from checking IDs to a blanket requirement for it from the local authority. > [@](#): > > An unrelated point … It is now an incredibly successful bar judging by the number of customers even during the week and has a great,really friendly feeling there.They’ve actually bought the neighbouring premises and expanded the place. I don’t think it’s unrelated at all. What you describe fits in with what I said earlier, about how it’s the badly-run pubs which are likely to fail, and this sounds like a very well-run place doing exactly the opposite. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2008, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pub-closures/441926/34 "2008-03-21T20:09:39Z")
The pub up the road from me is for sale. I doubt it’s anything to do with the smoking ban. Shitty food, shitty service, and a shitty clientele discouraging the more general customer are more likely to blame. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2008, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pub-closures/441926/35 "2008-03-22T03:28:31Z")
The smoking ban hasn’t seemed to affect New York bars. People just go hang outside and smoke. It’s also apparently a good way for single smokers to meet each other. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pub-closures/441926.md?page=1)