# PULP FICTION and the "N" word. **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 17, 2003, 5:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pulp-fiction-and-the-n-word/189076 "2003-07-17T05:26:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Bruce\_Daddy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/85f322/32.png) [@Bruce\_Daddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bruce_Daddy)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pulp-fiction-and-the-n-word/189076/21 "2003-07-17T12:54:39Z")
IIRC from S. Jackson’s Playboy interview, when asked about using “nigger” in the movie he said something along the lines of “What? Spike can use it in his movies and Quentin can’t? That seems like a double standard to me.” I’ll have to find that Playboy and do some . . . research. "When you drove up did you see a sign that said “Dead Nigger Storage”? “No.” “That’s right, ‘cause storin’ dead niggers ain’t my business!” Oh, that kills me. ---
**Author:** ![Shade](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2bfe46/32.png) [@Shade](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shade)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pulp-fiction-and-the-n-word/189076/22 "2003-07-17T13:03:11Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by pkbites \*I can’t imagine Pulp Fiction on regular television! Oh God!😛 \*\* I hope the mods will forgive me for posting the script in its entirety: [quote] mothermothermother/quote] ---
**Author:** ![Dung\_Beetle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dung_beetle/32/7945_2.png) [@Dung\_Beetle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dung_Beetle)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pulp-fiction-and-the-n-word/189076/23 "2003-07-17T13:05:46Z")
I always find it interesting that when I run across Blazing Saddles on TV, most times the n-word is left in and the campfire scene is censored. Of course, the movie’d be pretty hard to understand if it were the other way around. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pulp-fiction-and-the-n-word/189076/24 "2003-07-17T13:20:27Z")
> [@](#): > > Tarrentino’s character on the other hand…he was a bit harsh. I think the difference is that, obviously, this character was not meant to be a racist, being a good friend of Jules, but as circumstance would have it, it was a term he used in everyday life. Whether that means his character was constantly surrounded by black people, or just the area he lived in was rather more “urban” in their speach, it didn’t seem to phase Jules once, so I take it it’s a non issue. If you pay attention, Jimmy’s wife is black. You see her in the scene where they imagine her coming home from work only to find them dragging a dead body through the house. He married a black woman, it’s safe to say he’s not racist. Happy ---
**Author:** ![Fretful\_Porpentine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fretful_porpentine/32/2873_2.png) [@Fretful\_Porpentine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fretful_Porpentine)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pulp-fiction-and-the-n-word/189076/25 "2003-07-17T13:51:13Z")
> [@](#): > > IIRC from S. Jackson’s Playboy interview, when asked about using “nigger” in the movie he said something along the lines of “What? Spike can use it in his movies and Quentin can’t? That seems like a double standard to me.” > > I’ll have to find that Playboy and do some . . . research. > > "When you drove up did you see a sign that said “Dead Nigger Storage”? > > “No.” > > “That’s right, ‘cause storin’ dead niggers ain’t my business!” As an interesting side note, I own a Spanish translation of _Pulp Fiction_ in which the line in question is rendered as “_Almacen de negros muertos_”: Warehouse of dead blacks. Somehow it loses something in translation. ---
**Author:** ![Baldwin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baldwin/32/7264_2.png) [@Baldwin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baldwin)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pulp-fiction-and-the-n-word/189076/26 "2003-07-17T15:12:10Z")
> [@](#): > > But maybe I’m being optomisic. I did hear that the NAACP was a little upset, and that Spike Lee said something like “Why does Quentin use that word so much?? It’s like he wants to be an honorary black person.” i.e. Spike wasn’t hopping mad about it, but he didn’t like it either. Makes me think of the pimp in _True Romance_. I’ve heard the word “nigger” in regular tv shows (like “NYPD Blue”), but never used so casually. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Elvis\_Rojo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/898d66/32.png) [@El\_Elvis\_Rojo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Elvis_Rojo)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pulp-fiction-and-the-n-word/189076/27 "2003-07-17T16:04:51Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Happy Lendervedder \* > \*\*If you pay attention, Jimmy’s wife is black. You see her in the scene where they imagine her coming home from work only to find them dragging a dead body through the house. > > He married a black woman, it’s safe to say he’s not racist. > \*\* Thanks, **Happy**. I thought they hinted at that as well, but it’s been a while since I’d seen the movie, and after butchering Tarantino’s name, I figured one big flub was enough for me. ---
**Author:** ![MovieMogul](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f08c70/32.png) [@MovieMogul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MovieMogul)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pulp-fiction-and-the-n-word/189076/28 "2003-07-17T18:40:36Z")
[This](http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2003/05/23/1053585696568.html) was Spike Lee’s issue with Tarantino and the “N”-word: > [@](#): > > I never said that Quentin Tarantino should not be allowed to use the word ‘nigger’. My contention was that his use of it was excessive. You know, Harvey Weinstein [co-founder of Miramax, _Jackie Brown_’s financiers] called me up and said he wished I’d leave this thing alone. And I said, 'Harvey - would you ever release a film that on so many occasions used the word ‘kike’? He just cleared his throat and said, ‘No.’ So, it’s like, ‘Oh - you can’t say ‘kike’ but ‘nigger’ is OK?’" > > He lets the question hang. But he’s not done yet. “And then of course they say, ‘But Tarantino’s an artist, he’s just expressing himself.’ Well, if we’re talking about artists, let’s talk about …” Everything slows with the realisation of what’s coming next. “Michael Jackson. Because, forgetting all that other shit for a minute, in the song _They Don’t Care about Us_, Michael Jackson > said ‘Sue me, Jew me … Kick me, Kike me.’ What happened? He was ripped apart by [Steven] Spielberg and David Geffen, and the record was pulled from the stores. So, Quentin Tarantino says ‘nigger’ and he’s an artist, but Michael Jackson says ‘kike’ and it can’t be exposed to the public?” > > So what’s he saying? Are they both acceptable, or neither? “All I’m saying is why is it OK for Quentin Tarantino to say ‘nigger’ and not for Michael Jackson to say ‘kike’?” His point, at least what I think is his point, is well taken: I really am starting to wish he’d stop saying ‘kike’. “So that’s the question,” he says. “Why is one OK and one not? That’s my deal with Quentin Tarantino.” I’m not a big fan of the recent MJ (but I am of _JB_), but it’s a double standard that’s a little hard to argue with. ---
**Author:** ![ElwoodCuse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/edb3f5/32.png) [@ElwoodCuse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElwoodCuse)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pulp-fiction-and-the-n-word/189076/29 "2003-07-17T18:43:48Z")
I don’t know if this is still the norm, but I once saw _Blazing Saddles_ on TV and they left all the “niggers” in. They cut out the “shits” and some of the innuendo in Lilly’s scene. Interestingly, they also added some scenes that were not in the original release (That happened with the TV broadcast of The Naked Gun that I saw once, too). And a clarificiation: I think the distinction that South Park holds is swear words per minute (since the movie is only like 90 minutes long). Scarface, Pulp Fiction, and Casino are all lengthy bohemoths with plenty of time for bad words. ---
**Author:** ![Pashnish\_Ewing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8797f3/32.png) [@Pashnish\_Ewing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pashnish_Ewing)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pulp-fiction-and-the-n-word/189076/30 "2003-07-17T19:33:10Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by ArchiveGuy \* > \*\*I’m not a big fan of the recent MJ (but I am of _JB_), but it’s a double standard that’s a little hard to argue with. \*\* I’d say it’s rather easy to argue with. The word “nigga” has been embraced by many black Americans as a non-offensive term of endearment. It’s a real life situation for that word to be used as it was in **Pulp Fiction**. AFAIK, “kike” is not used in casual conversation as a term of endearment amoung Jewish Americans. Using it excessivly in a film like **Pulp Fiction** would not be a reflection of real life in any way. I’m no Spike Lee basher, but I think the example he gave to Harvey Weinstein is way off base. Pash ---
**Author:** ![greck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/7ab992/32.png) [@greck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/greck)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pulp-fiction-and-the-n-word/189076/31 "2003-07-17T19:45:46Z")
I’ll defend Tarantino’s use of the word as art for one reason: The Zed character’s use of is was in wonderful contrast to Jules’s and Tarantino’s. Same word, WAY different meaning. This contrast greatly enriched the movie experience. Zed’s use of the word puts Tarantino’s and Jules’s into perspective. It wasn’t done haphazardly or just for shock value, and I think this was the first time such a thing was done with that word in a movie. That’s what makes it art. Besides, Michael Jackson is a real person (kind of) saying “kike” in the real world. Zed was a fictional character in a make believe world. ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Tambo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/76d3ee/32.png) [@Mr\_Tambo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr_Tambo)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pulp-fiction-and-the-n-word/189076/32 "2003-07-17T20:00:04Z")
So the characters in _Pulp Fiction_ murder, cheat, threaten, torture, extort and steal. They’re not _rascists_, though, are they? That would be bad. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Intaglio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/71e660/32.png) [@Intaglio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Intaglio)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pulp-fiction-and-the-n-word/189076/33 "2003-07-17T21:28:13Z")
Marcelous Wallace - Ving Rhames calls his Employees N\*\*\*\*\*, all the time, Vincent Vega, Butch - I recall MW - VR saying My N\*\*\*\*\* or You My N\*\*\*\*\*. It seems to me it is a Power Thing, a Black Man calling White Guys N\*\*\*\*\*. ---
**Author:** ![MovieMogul](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f08c70/32.png) [@MovieMogul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MovieMogul)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pulp-fiction-and-the-n-word/189076/34 "2003-07-17T21:49:12Z")
> [@](#): > > _Pashnish Ewing says:_ I’d say it’s rather easy to argue with. The word “nigga” has been embraced by many black Americans as a non-offensive term of endearment. It’s a real life situation for that word to be used as it was in Pulp Fiction. I would hardly call “Dead N----- Parking” an endearment reference. Do you think QT’s character would’ve used the same word if Marvin was white? Uh-uh. He didn’t even know Marvin, so it wasn’t even a respect-for-the-dead usage; he just saw a dead black guy. This argument’s pretty weak > [@](#): > > _greck says:_ Besides, Michael Jackson is a real person (kind of) saying “kike” in the real world. Zed was a fictional character in a make believe world. So, songs are automatically excluded from employing the technique of “dramatic voice”, huh? If MJ uses, “I”, then he must be talking about himself, all the time. That’s news to me. Also, MJ (dramatic voice or not), is using the word in a rant–being provocative in his effort to make a statement about an industry he finds problematic. Whether he’s right or not, it wasn’t just an invective-for-invective sake. I think the double standard still holds. ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pulp-fiction-and-the-n-word/189076/35 "2003-07-17T23:27:37Z")
I think that songs are a very different case from movies. In a (typical) movie, it is 100% clear that the offensive word is being used by a fictitious character. It is entirely possible to have onscreen characters tell horribly offensive jokes, molest children, be involved in the holocaust, etc., without the movie itself being offensive. A song, on the other hand, is much more amorphous. Unless the song goes way way way out of its way to imply that the words in the song are being spoken by a particular character, there is a presumption that they are being sung by the artist. And it’s always easier to misunderstand a song, turn it on partway through, etc., than it is to get confused about a movie. (Not to say that movies have carte blanche… but if a character in a movie uses the N word, and it’s deemed offensive, it’s likely not because the word was used, but because the movie was felt to glorify or support the use of the word, or the character who used it…) ---
**Author:** ![jackelope](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a6a055/32.png) [@jackelope](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jackelope)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2003, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pulp-fiction-and-the-n-word/189076/36 "2003-07-17T23:56:56Z")
The difference between Michael Jackson’s song quoted above (‘Sue me, Jew me … Kick me, Kike me.’) and the N-word in _Pulp Fiction_ is that Jackson is deliberately using slurs to to put down Jews. In _Pulp Fiction_, characters don’t use the N-word derogatorily; it’s got no more emotional baggage (for them) than “black person.” And by the way, I saw _Pulp Fiction_ on broadcast TV back in 1996 or '97, in a version that had offensive terms dubbed over with non-offensive terms. It was _hilarious_. Alas, the only one I still recall was Samuel Jackson vehemently calling someone a melon-farmer. ---
**Author:** ![psychomonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/dec6dc/32.png) [@psychomonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/psychomonkey)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2003, 6:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pulp-fiction-and-the-n-word/189076/37 "2003-07-18T06:39:31Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Justin\_Bailey \* > \*\*Actually this is untrue, the current champion is Casino which came out in 1993, before Pulp Fiction and way before South Park. \*\* Records were made to be broken, give me a cite. > [@](#): > > SCARFACE uses the word “fuck” 206 times which held the record until GOODFELLAS added some with 246. Years later, they were trumped by PULP FICTION with a whopping 257 times, but when SOUTH PARK: BIGGER, LONGER, UNCUT beat the record silly with 399, a new benchmark for f word greatness was achieved. from:[Here](http://www.x-entertainment.com/messages/278.html) ---
**Author:** ![BizarroRonJeremy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4da419/32.png) [@BizarroRonJeremy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BizarroRonJeremy)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2003, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pulp-fiction-and-the-n-word/189076/38 "2003-07-18T13:34:22Z")
Weren’t the lyrics MJ sang in reference to a financial dispute he had with Sony? If so, then he’s using a derogatory stereotype about jews (and not a very subtle one, at that) in the context of a real-life situation. If he were telling a story about some fictional person who felt they got screwed over by someone and used these words, the context would be much different. The N references in Pulp Fiction is an entirely different thing. Firstly, it’s a work of fiction. Secondly, it’s a work of fiction. In the movie, Jimmy has been thrust into a very difficult situation. He’s panicking. He’s going to lose it. He’s going to say things which aren’t PC. Who doesn’t? Do you really think he cares if he offends Jules by saying Dead N\*\*\*\*\* Storage? I’m sure offending an acquaintance is the last thing on his mind. Do you think Jules would hold it against him for saying that? Jeez, if anything, Jules should be apologizing. Personally, I think the dialogue is brilliant. It’s shocking (back then, it was). It helps to paint a complete picture of the chaotic situation at hand. Spike Lee thinks QT doesn’t have the artistic license to use the N-word because QT is not african-american? I’m not Italian, but I found his unbelievably stereotypical portrayal of Italian Americans in Do The Right Thing and Son of Sam pretty hardcore. The actors didn’t seem to mind, though. ---
**Author:** ![refusal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ac91a4/32.png) [@refusal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/refusal)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2003, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pulp-fiction-and-the-n-word/189076/39 "2003-07-18T14:27:16Z")
According to [IMDb](http://us.imdb.com/Trivia?0158983)’s page for South Park: Bigger Longer and Uncut trivia > [@](#): > > The film contains 399 profane words (the word “fuck” appears 133 times), 128 offensive gestures and 221 acts of violence. The figures quoted above for Scarface, Goodfellas and Pulp Fiction match those at IMDb, but [Casino](http://us.imdb.com/Trivia?0112641) has 422. Even Quentin can’t compare to the true master of the F-word. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2003, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pulp-fiction-and-the-n-word/189076/40 "2003-07-18T14:53:27Z")
refusal beat me to it. Thanks. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pulp-fiction-and-the-n-word/189076.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pulp-fiction-and-the-n-word/189076.md?page=3)