# "Pumpkin Eater" - judge says its a homophobic slur? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [May 26, 2023, 7:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pumpkin-eater-judge-says-its-a-homophobic-slur/984618 "2023-05-26T07:11:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2023, 7:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pumpkin-eater-judge-says-its-a-homophobic-slur/984618/1 "2023-05-26T07:11:23Z")
There has been some bemusement amongst my colleagues about a local decision (just overturned on appeal) wherein a judge, without input from either party, contended and ultimately found that referencing a person called Peter using the words “pumpkin eater” was a homophobic slur. [In his judgment](http://www.austlii.edu.au/cgi-bin/viewdoc/au/cases/cth/FedCFamC2G//2022/574.html), he says: > 1. There was some consternation at the Bar table when I expressed that the term “_pumpkin eater_” was a homophobic slur. Counsel, who may have had a somewhat sheltered existence, did not understand that this term could be used in this manner. > > 2. At the hearing, I did not wish to explain what the term means because it is quite disgusting and I believed that the use of this term was common enough knowledge. I have absolutely no doubt that it was meant as a homophobic slur to Mr Cullen. For an amusing read, check out a detailed judicial consideration of whether “pumpkin eater” was a horrible slur or a reference to a nursery rhyme (see paras 42 and following). Googling the term seems to turn up precisely nothing to support His Honour’s experience, other than references to this case itself. But my FQ is - has anyone ever heard of this usage of “pumpkin eater”? 'Cos I sure haven’t. ---
**Author:** ![Asuka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@Asuka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asuka)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2023, 8:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pumpkin-eater-judge-says-its-a-homophobic-slur/984618/2 "2023-05-26T08:04:10Z")
I haven’t either, my only guess is that it normally goes “Peter Peter Pumpkin Eater” and Peter is a slang term for a Penis in some areas. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2023, 8:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pumpkin-eater-judge-says-its-a-homophobic-slur/984618/3 "2023-05-26T08:08:42Z")
I suspect the ?learned judge was under the impression that “pumpkin” referred to another part of the anatomy. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2023, 8:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pumpkin-eater-judge-says-its-a-homophobic-slur/984618/4 "2023-05-26T08:26:37Z")
This judge does indeed have a pumpkin, but it’s on top of his shoulders and largely hollow. ---
**Author:** ![TwoCarrotSnowman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/twocarrotsnowman/32/15879_2.png) [@TwoCarrotSnowman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TwoCarrotSnowman)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2023, 10:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pumpkin-eater-judge-says-its-a-homophobic-slur/984618/5 "2023-05-26T10:12:20Z")
> [@PatrickLondon](#): > > I suspect the ?learned judge was under the impression that “pumpkin” referred to another part of the anatomy. In case you missed it, Annex 1 of the judgement linked to in the OP explains in detail what the judge thinks it means. ---
**Author:** ![penultima\_thule](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penultima_thule/32/3833_2.png) [@penultima\_thule](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/penultima_thule)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2023, 10:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pumpkin-eater-judge-says-its-a-homophobic-slur/984618/6 "2023-05-26T10:12:57Z")
It’s slang beyond my ken. Bites pillows … eats pumpkins? Que? I hear faint vestiges of the [judge skit](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xi-agPf95M) by the inimitable Peter Cook ---
**Author:** ![Mean\_Mr.Mustard](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mean_mr.mustard/32/3865_2.png) [@Mean\_Mr.Mustard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mean_Mr.Mustard)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2023, 10:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pumpkin-eater-judge-says-its-a-homophobic-slur/984618/7 "2023-05-26T10:23:30Z")
Well, he _did_ have a wife but couldn’t keep her. mmm ---
**Author:** ![bryanmaguire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/d07c76/32.png) [@bryanmaguire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bryanmaguire)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2023, 10:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pumpkin-eater-judge-says-its-a-homophobic-slur/984618/8 "2023-05-26T10:36:55Z")
Urban dictionary seems to agree with the judges definition. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2023, 10:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pumpkin-eater-judge-says-its-a-homophobic-slur/984618/9 "2023-05-26T10:42:42Z")
I don’t see it as gay thing per se. It could be hetero just as easily ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2023, 10:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pumpkin-eater-judge-says-its-a-homophobic-slur/984618/10 "2023-05-26T10:56:32Z")
> [@TwoCarrotSnowman](#): > > > [@PatrickLondon](#): > > > > I suspect the ?learned judge was under the impression that “pumpkin” referred to another part of the anatomy. > > In case you missed it, Annex 1 of the judgement linked to in the OP explains in detail what the judge thinks it means. > **here it is, spoilered, because it is kinda gross** > > When a person commits an act of anal cunnilingus upon another, the stimulation of the muscles of the receiver of this act, will sometimes lead to an accidental release of faecal material. > > A “pumpkin eater” is a person who, when committing an act of anal cunnilingus upon another, will not cease that act even if there is an involuntary discharge of faecal material by the receiver of the act. Also, I’ve led a sheltered existence, and have never heard this before. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2023, 11:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pumpkin-eater-judge-says-its-a-homophobic-slur/984618/11 "2023-05-26T11:05:10Z")
I’m deeply skeptical that that’s a homophobic slur in this context, and the judge’s reasoning seems flawed–but good God those guys were a pack of assholes. I can’t even tell what they were up to. For folks who haven’t read the complaint, they were legit site inspectors visiting a construction site run by the company they worked for, but they refused to show their permits to the people onsite, instead mocking them and wandering around the site without permission until, a couple hours later when some government inspectors showed up and they started acting like normal human beings. At least, that’s what I think happened. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2023, 11:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pumpkin-eater-judge-says-its-a-homophobic-slur/984618/12 "2023-05-26T11:07:49Z")
Yes, having just read the complaint, i have to agree. What a bizarre and obnoxious interaction. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2023, 11:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pumpkin-eater-judge-says-its-a-homophobic-slur/984618/13 "2023-05-26T11:33:38Z")
Huh. I thought I’d checked Urban Dictionary. Maybe I didn’t read down far enough. Anyway, we have established that most of us know fewer disgusting epithets than Justice Vasta. ---
**Author:** ![TwoCarrotSnowman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/twocarrotsnowman/32/15879_2.png) [@TwoCarrotSnowman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TwoCarrotSnowman)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2023, 11:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pumpkin-eater-judge-says-its-a-homophobic-slur/984618/14 "2023-05-26T11:35:52Z")
> [@Princhester](#): > > Anyway, we have established that most of us know fewer disgusting epithets than Justice Vasta. I think we all know what _he_ likes doing in his spare time. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2023, 11:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pumpkin-eater-judge-says-its-a-homophobic-slur/984618/15 "2023-05-26T11:38:59Z")
[Some background.](https://insidestory.org.au/judging-vasta/) And [his father](https://www.afr.com/politics/vasta-knew-of-false-accounts-inquiry-told-19890307-k3b69), who came under fire in relation to… wait for it… toilet paper ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2023, 11:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pumpkin-eater-judge-says-its-a-homophobic-slur/984618/16 "2023-05-26T11:45:57Z")
> [@Princhester](#): > > Huh. I thought I’d checked Urban Dictionary. Maybe I didn’t read down far enough. Anyway, we have established that most of us know fewer disgusting epithets than Justice Vasta. I don’t really trust that Urbandictionary definition, as it has 35 upvotes and 65 downvotes. That ratio makes it quite suspect that this is any sort of usual slang. From using UD, I completely disregard anything with a ratio that has more ~~upvotes than downvotes~~ [edit:] downvotes than upvotes. That makes it, as the kids say, quite sus. In fact, if it’s much less than a 2:1 ratio, I tread with caution in trusting it. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2023, 11:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pumpkin-eater-judge-says-its-a-homophobic-slur/984618/17 "2023-05-26T11:49:33Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > From using UD, I completely disregard anything with a ratio that has more upvotes than downvotes. You mean more downvotes than upvotes, right? ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2023, 11:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pumpkin-eater-judge-says-its-a-homophobic-slur/984618/18 "2023-05-26T11:53:24Z")
Um…yeah. Damn caffeine hasn’t kicked in yet. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2023, 11:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pumpkin-eater-judge-says-its-a-homophobic-slur/984618/19 "2023-05-26T11:55:25Z")
Well, _that_ puts a damper on the notion of pumpkin pie. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2023, 12:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pumpkin-eater-judge-says-its-a-homophobic-slur/984618/20 "2023-05-26T12:17:03Z")
“Candlestick jumper”, on the other hand… [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pumpkin-eater-judge-says-its-a-homophobic-slur/984618.md?page=2)