# Punishing everyone for the sins of a few \[purchasing drugs previously available OTC\] **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [May 29, 2018, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/punishing-everyone-for-the-sins-of-a-few-purchasing-drugs-previously-available-otc/815064 "2018-05-29T16:05:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2018, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/punishing-everyone-for-the-sins-of-a-few-purchasing-drugs-previously-available-otc/815064/41 "2018-05-30T21:17:37Z")
> [@drewder](#): > > Says someone who hasn’t tried to buy a gun recently I think. I think we can all agree that our right to feel safe trumps their archaic right to clear sinuses. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2018, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/punishing-everyone-for-the-sins-of-a-few-purchasing-drugs-previously-available-otc/815064/42 "2018-05-30T22:03:09Z")
> [@CelticKnot](#): > > The human brain is very capable of ignoring the same instructions repeated over and over if said owner of the brain chooses to because of a incorrect feeling of invincibility or superiority. … And you seem fairly certain that this is a cause that can be put down to stupid people. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2018, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/punishing-everyone-for-the-sins-of-a-few-purchasing-drugs-previously-available-otc/815064/43 "2018-05-30T22:18:06Z")
> [@CelticKnot](#): > > aking otc Claritin and montelukast for allergies, plus too much D and various cough remedies. Nothing worked. > My doctor has bypassed all that and started me on steroids. Which is appropriate - if all those other remedies were insufficient then prescribing steroids is the next step. > [@](#): > > Steroids needed none of the paperwork that pseudoephedrine needs. I guess people haven’t been able to figure out how to abuse them yet.:dubious: Steroids can’t be cooked into meth utilizing amateur chemistry that carries a risk of explosion, fire, and leaving behind a super-fund site. Also, the effects of steroid abuse (of the sort used to treat allergies) tend not to be ones people seek out: weight gain, cataracts, diabetes, high blood pressure, fragile bones, muscle weakness, and vulnerability to infection, for the most part. (There’s also things like moodiness or worse.) None of those encourage people to use them recreationally. Actually, you can get all of the above with therapeutic doses, too. > [@kopek](#): > > On cost – as **kayaker** said it did go up but there are some cheap options around here; Sam’s Club for example is just over $5 for their brand where CVS is just over $10 for their brand. Yeah - generic is so much cheaper than name brand, and it’s the same damn thing. > [@CelticKnot](#): > > The best example of this “protecting everyone because some people are stupid” is Seldane. > The best allergy medicine I ever used. But somehow, some people managed to ignore the ubiquitous warnings to NEVER, EVER take Seldane with antibiotics. > The warnings were in magazines, newspapers, and TV news. The doctor warned you. The pharmacist warned you. The package warned you. Yet still, some people committed suicide by stupidity, and I get to suffer from allergies. Actually, most of the deaths occurred BEFORE the risk of combining Seldane with antibiotics was known. Toxic interactions weren’t just with a particular class of antiobiotics (the macrolides) but also with the fungicide ketoconazole and grapefruit. So it was a bit more than just “don’t take erythromycin with this drug”. The liver converts Seldane (terfenadine) into fexofenadine which does NOT have the toxic interactions of Seldane, so the pharmaceutical industry started producing fexofenadine for the same therapeutic effect but skipping over the hazardous item. It is sold both generically and as the brand name Allegra. If Seldane worked for you, you should get the same results from Allegra. ---
**Author:** ![CelticKnot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/celticknot/32/3392_2.png) [@CelticKnot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CelticKnot)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2018, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/punishing-everyone-for-the-sins-of-a-few-purchasing-drugs-previously-available-otc/815064/44 "2018-06-01T14:58:15Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Which is appropriate - if all those other remedies were insufficient then prescribing steroids is the next step. > Steroids can’t be cooked into meth utilizing amateur chemistry that carries a risk of explosion, fire, and leaving behind a super-fund site. > > Also, the effects of steroid abuse (of the sort used to treat allergies) tend not to be ones people seek out: weight gain, cataracts, diabetes, high blood pressure, fragile bones, muscle weakness, and vulnerability to infection, for the most part. (There’s also things like moodiness or worse.) None of those encourage people to use them recreationally. Actually, you can get all of the above with therapeutic doses, too. > Yeah - generic is so much cheaper than name brand, and it’s the same damn thing. > Actually, most of the deaths occurred BEFORE the risk of combining Seldane with antibiotics was known. Toxic interactions weren’t just with a particular class of antiobiotics (the macrolides) but also with the fungicide ketoconazole and grapefruit. So it was a bit more than just “don’t take erythromycin with this drug”. > > The liver converts Seldane (terfenadine) into fexofenadine which does NOT have the toxic interactions of Seldane, so the pharmaceutical industry started producing fexofenadine for the same therapeutic effect but skipping over the hazardous item. It is sold both generically and as the brand name Allegra. If Seldane worked for you, you should get the same results from Allegra. I don’t. Taking Allegra was like taking nothing. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2018, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/punishing-everyone-for-the-sins-of-a-few-purchasing-drugs-previously-available-otc/815064/45 "2018-06-01T16:24:02Z")
It is also possible your issues have worsened and nothing OTC is going to help… which might be why your doctor prescribed steroids? Of course, not everyone gets the same results from the same medication so if your results vary it’s not like I’m going to dispute your experience. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2018, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/punishing-everyone-for-the-sins-of-a-few-purchasing-drugs-previously-available-otc/815064/46 "2018-06-01T16:27:31Z")
Pretty sure that heroin has made a roaring comeback and is outpacing demand for meth and is at a much lower price point. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2018, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/punishing-everyone-for-the-sins-of-a-few-purchasing-drugs-previously-available-otc/815064/47 "2018-06-01T16:46:57Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > Pretty sure that heroin has made a roaring comeback and is outpacing demand for meth and is at a much lower price point. That’s great, but have you seen gas prices? ---
**Author:** ![Jennshark](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Jennshark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jennshark)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2018, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/punishing-everyone-for-the-sins-of-a-few-purchasing-drugs-previously-available-otc/815064/48 "2018-06-01T19:15:16Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > Are you really being punished? Or are you just enduring a minor inconvenience in exchange for helping alleviate a public health and safety problem that is causing incredible suffering to thousands of your fellow human beings? > > In other words, instead of thinking of it as “bad people need to be punished,” think of it more as “spreading out the burdens so they don’t fall heavily on any one person is making the community and the world I live in happier, safer, and less expensive.” Yes, as a matter of fact, it IS an imposition to wait in a long line at the pharmacy with my eyes streaming, a sinus headache, and cough to get price-gouged for 10 pills at a time. I’ve never touched a street drug in my life and, frankly, I don’t care if the approximately .3% (one million+/-) of meth-addicted Americans buy ephedrine by the truckload. I don’t care what adult people choose to put in their bodies – but no, let’s create a burden for people who have allergies. Surely the number of Americans with allergies that OTC drugs address must be exponentially more than .3%? If we REALLY wanted to address a deadly drug that ruins the lives of 15+ million, alcohol would not be OTC and citizens would be severely limited in purchase amount. I don’t drink, but I’m sure the 86.4% of Americans who do would find these laws very inconvenient. I predict that Immodium-like OTC drugs will soon be behind the counter because four people in the last 10 years took 120 at one time and died. You know what’s worse than waiting in a pharmacy line for Claritin? Shitting your pants while waiting in a pharmacy line for Immodium. Just where does the nanny law insanity end? Making Tide Pods a Schedule III drug? ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2018, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/punishing-everyone-for-the-sins-of-a-few-purchasing-drugs-previously-available-otc/815064/49 "2018-06-01T20:28:30Z")
The Founding Fathers never imagined decongestants that could be put to such heinous purposes. ---
**Author:** ![Jennshark](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Jennshark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jennshark)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2018, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/punishing-everyone-for-the-sins-of-a-few-purchasing-drugs-previously-available-otc/815064/50 "2018-06-02T13:01:00Z")
> [@Scumpup](#): > > The Founding Fathers never imagined decongestants that could be put to such heinous purposes. “The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the ephedrine of patriots and tyrants.” -Tommy Jeffs “They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary Claritin deserve neither liberty nor sneezing.” -Benny Franks ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2018, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/punishing-everyone-for-the-sins-of-a-few-purchasing-drugs-previously-available-otc/815064/51 "2018-06-02T13:23:47Z")
> [@Scumpup](#): > > The Founding Fathers never imagined decongestants that could be put to such heinous purposes. Heinous? You on the Special Victims Unit now? ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2018, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/punishing-everyone-for-the-sins-of-a-few-purchasing-drugs-previously-available-otc/815064/52 "2018-06-02T13:41:34Z")
> [@Jennshark](#): > > Yes, as a matter of fact, it IS an imposition to wait in a long line at the pharmacy with my eyes streaming, a sinus headache, and cough to get price-gouged for 10 pills at a time. Have you tried purchasing the generic version? You’ll still have to wait in line with your symptoms, but at least it will cost you less. > [@](#): > > I’ve never touched a street drug in my life and, frankly, I don’t care if the approximately .3% (one million+/-) of meth-addicted Americans buy ephedrine by the truckload. While I’m with you in the “don’t care what adults put into their bodies” area, I and many of my neighbors were getting a bit upset what with the trailers, houses, hotel rooms, and occasional cars blowing up due to amateur chemical factories trying to cook meth. Yes, we had instances where folks were driving down the road and **\>BOOM!\<** the car next to them had its trunk blow up because of the meth crap in it. We’ve had fewer fires since the OTC requirement for pseudoephedrine and, sorry, I regard that as an overall improvement. And yes, I’m waiting in line with you for my pseudoephedrine and having to show my ID and sign the register. I’m not thrilled with the notion, but like I said, fewer housefires and things blowing up. I can live with it as a compromise. > [@](#): > > If we REALLY wanted to address a deadly drug that ruins the lives of 15+ million, alcohol would not be OTC and citizens would be severely limited in purchase amount. I don’t drink, but I’m sure the 86.4% of Americans who do would find these laws very inconvenient. We tried banning alcohol but the side effects were intolerable so we unbanned it. The side effects of requiring you to talk to a pharmacist to get pseudoephedrine is a bit of inconvenience on your part and fewer things blowing up and/or catching on fire. Sorry, although I feel your annoyance and share it, it’s not the horrible imposition you’re trying to imply it is. And if your symptoms are that out of control you need to see a doctor because clearly you need more than OTC help. Which, I gather, you have done. > [@](#): > > Just where does the nanny law insanity end? Making Tide Pods a Schedule III drug? Oh, wow - you have to show an ID and sign a register. Horrors! Meanwhile, although it hasn’t stopped meth abuse the law has reduced secondary harms from amateurs trying cook their own meth. Sorry, I can’t get aboard that outrage train. ---
**Author:** ![Turble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8dc957/32.png) [@Turble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Turble)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2018, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/punishing-everyone-for-the-sins-of-a-few-purchasing-drugs-previously-available-otc/815064/53 "2018-06-02T14:39:43Z")
The restrictions may have reduced the danger posed by trailer park meth cookers in the USA but have not reduced the actual use of illegal meth; in fact meth use is on the upswing. It is not a matter of fewer people being injured or killed by meth cookers – we have simply outsourced the manufacture to Mexico, substantially increasing the overall number of deaths overall and increasing the corruption and danger to our neighbors to the south. A search for ‘meth from Mexico’ brings up many examples. Here are a couple of recent ones: [Meth cuts lethal path through Minnesota](http://www.startribune.com/meth-crisis-roaring-back-how-cartels-infiltrated-meth-s-lethal-path-to-state/480680891/) [Mexican drug cartels saturate U.S. with deadliest meth ever](https://www.courier-journal.com/story/news/crime/2018/05/03/meth-resurgence-drug-epidemic-fentanyl/447191002/) IMHO the real best answer is to legalize all drugs, have the government provide assurance of purity, let those who choose to use take their chances, and punish those who commit real crimes with real victims. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/punishing-everyone-for-the-sins-of-a-few-purchasing-drugs-previously-available-otc/815064.md?page=2)