# Puppy-pitching Bosnia girl found **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [September 27, 2010, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puppy-pitching-bosnia-girl-found/555235 "2010-09-27T16:15:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![TruCelt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/trucelt/32/523_2.png) [@TruCelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TruCelt)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 9:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puppy-pitching-bosnia-girl-found/555235/121 "2010-10-21T09:35:14Z")
A little perspective: For months a mouse in my house has been the bane of my existence. (Well, he was never my _only_ bane, or even my #1 bane, but a bane nonetheless.) I’ve spent fortunes and missed work to meet the exterminators trying to get rid of him, and whatever cohorts he might have wandering around, to no avail. I hate this little sucker in a very up-close and personal manner. Last week I caught it a mousetrap. The mouse was completely unharmed by the trap, and struggling to get out. I thought long and hard about how to kill it. My conclusion was that I really didn’t have anything in the house which would do the job quickly and humanely. The closest thing I could think of was either freezing or flushing, neither of which sounded sure to be quick. So I loaded the Celtling and the mousetrap into the car, and we drove down to the no man’s land by the railroad tracks to let him go. I dumped the trap, the mouse bounded off joyfully. It was galling. I was galled. If I’d had some ether on hand I would have popped both into a ziplock bag without a second thought. But there’s no way I could have dropped a living creature, however obnoxious, into the toilet when a more humane option was available. And whatever I did, I wasn’t going to grin and film it. ---
**Author:** ![Gestalt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/90ced4/32.png) [@Gestalt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gestalt)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 11:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puppy-pitching-bosnia-girl-found/555235/122 "2010-10-21T11:10:54Z")
> [@rhubarbarin](#): > > I’d stop what was going on, that’s for sure. I like puppies and bunnies, it would be tough for me to see someone doing that right in front of me, and why allow it to when I could take them down the block to my local excellent and mostly empty animal shelter where they have a good chance at becoming someone’s pet? > > But I’ve seen that sort of thing happen enough times in my life to realize that enjoying or having no regrets over killing animals, and not doing in the quickest way possible doesn’t make someone evil or damaged, especially when that person is a child who might only have engaged in this sort of behavior in unusual circumstances, or might just have been raised very differently than you or I. I used to be the tomboy that punched the neighbor boys when I caught them shooting birds with their BB guns. Those boys all grew up to be decent people, and I rightfully was punished for lashing out at people just because I had a soft heart and didn’t grow up in a family where I had exposure to animal death. See, I’m pretty sure animal cruelty, even at age 12 (which isn’t super young, btw), is considered something that should be worrying to parents. ---
**Author:** ![TruCelt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/trucelt/32/523_2.png) [@TruCelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TruCelt)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 11:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puppy-pitching-bosnia-girl-found/555235/123 "2010-10-21T11:44:02Z")
> [@rhubarbarin](#): > > I’d stop what was going on, that’s for sure. I like puppies and bunnies, it would be tough for me to see someone doing that right in front of me, and why allow it to when I could take them down the block to my local excellent and mostly empty animal shelter where they have a good chance at becoming someone’s pet? > > But I’ve seen that sort of thing happen enough times in my life to realize that enjoying or having no regrets over killing animals, and not doing in the quickest way possible doesn’t make someone evil or damaged, especially when that person is a child who might only have engaged in this sort of behavior in unusual circumstances, or might just have been raised very differently than you or I. I used to be the tomboy that punched the neighbor boys when I caught them shooting birds with their BB guns. Those boys all grew up to be decent people, and I **rightfully** was punished for lashing out at people just because I had a soft heart and didn’t grow up in a family where I had exposure to animal death. “rightfully” I have to disagree with that word. ---
**Author:** ![rhubarbarin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/eb9ed0/32.png) [@rhubarbarin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rhubarbarin)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 12:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puppy-pitching-bosnia-girl-found/555235/124 "2010-10-21T12:31:23Z")
I think that getting away with physically assaulting another person because you don’t agree with what they are doing (and it’s not like they were torturing birds - they were shooting to kill, and taking the birds home) isn’t a good life lesson for a little kid. I had a natural tendency towards bullying as a child, I’m glad my parents stayed on top of it. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puppy-pitching-bosnia-girl-found/555235/125 "2010-10-21T15:28:10Z")
> [@Gestalt](#): > > See, I’m pretty sure animal cruelty, even at age 12 (which isn’t super young, btw), is considered something that should be worrying to parents. I don’t necessarily see it as cruelty. She grew up (presumably) knowing that this was the accepted way to get rid of unwanted pups. (And, apparently, some people in that neck of the world just bury them in a ditch.) So that’s the way she got rid of them. Yes, she needlessly had it taped and put a little “style” into the execution, but I chalk that up to teenaged stupidity. Like I said, given the circumstances, I can imagine myself doing something that stupid in such a scenario and, so far as I know, I’m not a psycho- or socio-path. ---
**Author:** ![TruCelt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/trucelt/32/523_2.png) [@TruCelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TruCelt)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puppy-pitching-bosnia-girl-found/555235/126 "2010-10-21T15:39:15Z")
> [@rhubarbarin](#): > > I think that getting away with physically assaulting another person because you don’t agree with what they are doing (and **it’s not like they were torturing birds - they were shooting to kill, and taking the birds home)** isn’t a good life lesson for a little kid. I had a natural tendency towards bullying as a child, I’m glad my parents stayed on top of it. Ah, yes, you’re right; I misunderstood. Getting food is very different thing than what I was picturing. ---
**Author:** ![Nzinga\_Seated](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5ac83/32.png) [@Nzinga\_Seated](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nzinga_Seated)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puppy-pitching-bosnia-girl-found/555235/127 "2010-10-21T15:56:55Z")
> [@TruCelt](#): > > Ah, yes, you’re right; I misunderstood. Getting food is very different thing than what I was picturing. What are your thoughts on folks who hunt for sport? ---
**Author:** ![Gestalt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/90ced4/32.png) [@Gestalt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gestalt)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puppy-pitching-bosnia-girl-found/555235/128 "2010-10-21T18:15:51Z")
I know you didn’t ask me, **Nzinga** , but I’ll throw my two cents in anyways. I have no problem with hunting, either for sport or food. I think it is a legitimate sport (well, it can be, as long as you don’t use a ton of cheats). Most hunters I know (and I know a lot, growing up in the deep South) are very respectful and knowledgeable about nature, and many of them are conservationists. Also, animals can only legally be hunted in season, and many of the hunted animals are pests and hunting is a form of population control. Most relevantly to this debate, hunting is not cruel to the animals (well, you could argue that killing overall is cruel, but I have stated that that is not part of my, or most people’s, definition of animal cruelty). Most hunters take one or two shots to take the animal down and try to ensure it’s not in pain. ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puppy-pitching-bosnia-girl-found/555235/129 "2010-10-21T19:10:53Z")
I think if this we a boy in his early teens, we’d be having a different conversation. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puppy-pitching-bosnia-girl-found/555235/130 "2010-10-21T19:49:29Z")
> [@even\_sven](#): > > I think if this we a boy in his early teens, we’d be having a different conversation. How so? I’d come to the same conclusion if it were a 12-year-old boy doing the puppy pitching. ---
**Author:** ![Nzinga\_Seated](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5ac83/32.png) [@Nzinga\_Seated](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nzinga_Seated)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puppy-pitching-bosnia-girl-found/555235/131 "2010-10-21T22:37:45Z")
Gestalt, I understand your position. I directed the question to TruCelt because she seemed unhappy with the idea of boys shooting at birds until she figured it was for food. So it was really kind of a hijack question from the issue at hand in this thread. To **even sven** , I don’t think I would be having a different conversation if it were a boy. I try not to let my emotions do my thinking. As I have said, when I first saw this video, my gut reaction was that the girl must be psycho. That was my emotions talking. After being educated a bit by those on this board in another thread, I am much slower to judge. ---
**Author:** ![TruCelt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/trucelt/32/523_2.png) [@TruCelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TruCelt)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2010, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puppy-pitching-bosnia-girl-found/555235/132 "2010-10-22T01:20:38Z")
> [@Nzinga\_Seated](#): > > What are your thoughts on folks who hunt for sport? There are many good reasons to hunt. Food is the number one, and the only reason I would accept for hunting myself. Herd control is another good reason. I’m too tired to come up with all of them tonight. But there are other reasons I can respect as well. Even someone who does it because there is no mechanical means by which one can get the same level of shooting and tracking practice (i.e. developing skills one may really not ever need) is less OK to me, but OK in general. Someone who just gets a thrill or a control rush by killing things and giggles at the opportunity would still be a sickie though. And I do object to the “I’ve never killed a rhino/walrus/etc, I need to check that box . . .” mindset. ---
**Author:** ![rhubarbarin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/eb9ed0/32.png) [@rhubarbarin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rhubarbarin)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2010, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puppy-pitching-bosnia-girl-found/555235/133 "2010-10-22T02:00:14Z")
The vast majority of the many people in the USA who hunt do it because they find it fun, entertaining, and a rush. Many of them take outright joy in shooting and killing an animal, and almost none of them are ‘sickos’. The free meat is just a bonus, and many hunters don’t eat a lot of what they kill. They’re not grimly donning their camo to dutifully provide population control. It’s a fun and exciting sport that happens to involve stalking other living beings and killing them, something humans and our ancestors have engaged in and thoroughly enjoyed for millennium. > [@Nzinga\_Seated](#): > > Hmm. I appreciate the answers, but I don’t know that I am convinced yet. > > Have patience with me, lawd, cause I tried to google this up myself and the results are just all over the place. > > My real question is do NEW BORN puppies feel pain in the same way humans do. I know intaking water accidentally in a pool caused me distress, but I’m not a newborn puppy. > > I get the feeling that maybe these rural folks that I have heard drown puppies either know something I don’t, or are just ignorant about the pain the newborns feel. If they are ignorant to the pain, then that means she isn’t cruel or psycho or whatever. > > If they know something I don’t, then maybe that is why they do it. I don’t think you’ll get an answer that aligns with your own moral code. Most people who kill animals on a regular basis don’t fuss much about the fact that killing causes pain, they feel it’s necessary and that animal pain, death, and ‘rights’ have little to do with people’s. Although most are decent people and do their best to avoid causing pain that is excessive or unnecessary, their definition of both is probably way different than yours. ---
**Author:** ![rhubarbarin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/eb9ed0/32.png) [@rhubarbarin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rhubarbarin)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2010, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puppy-pitching-bosnia-girl-found/555235/134 "2010-10-22T02:03:15Z")
> [@TruCelt](#): > > Ah, yes, you’re right; I misunderstood. Getting food is very different thing than what I was picturing. Well, I wouldn’t say they were getting food. Most like eliminating pesty small birds with very little meat on them, and taking the bodies home for what I don’t know. Feeding the barn cats? Making fertilizer? Taxidermy? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puppy-pitching-bosnia-girl-found/555235.md?page=6)