# Puzzler Will Shortz' favorite word **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 3, 2016, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puzzler-will-shortz-favorite-word/758996 "2016-07-03T13:00:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2016, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puzzler-will-shortz-favorite-word/758996/21 "2016-07-03T18:38:33Z")
> [@Ukulele\_Ike](#): > > I would have figured Shortzseses’ favorite word was NENE, ERTE, OMOO, EMU, or LEI. Actually, one of Shortz’s innovations was to try to avoid using such “crossword puzzle words.” And if they were used, they would have unusual clues. I much preferred the Times crossword after he took over because he got rid of most of those trite and hackneyed words. ---
**Author:** ![Ukulele\_Ike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/df788c/32.png) [@Ukulele\_Ike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ukulele_Ike)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2016, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puzzler-will-shortz-favorite-word/758996/22 "2016-07-03T19:05:13Z")
Really? It seems no better to me than when Maleska was the editor. I’ve seen all the words I cited within the past week or two. And Rex Parker, the guy who blogs the puzzle, is constantly calling Shortz out on shit fill. > **[Rex Parker Does the NYT Crossword Puzzle](https://rexwordpuzzle.blogspot.com/)** > > A Crossword Blog Granted, the constructors are at fault, but Shortz is supposed to be a guiding light. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2016, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puzzler-will-shortz-favorite-word/758996/23 "2016-07-03T20:55:25Z")
> [@Roderick\_Femm](#): > > To be clear, when you say that “antepenultimate” means “second from last,” you mean third from the end, yes? Considering a row of 10 objects, “ultimate” would be #10, “penultimate” would be #9, and “antepenultimate” would be #8. To quote, ¿Qué? The ultimate is the end. The penultimate is the first from the end. The antepenultimate is the second from the end, i.e. the second from last. It is not the third from the end, unless you live in a world in which the end is past the ultimate. > [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > Well, not everywhere, but certainly places like MAUI, OAHU, and LANAI. You forget the Maunas KEA and LOA. I put in the \_\_A and then go back to search for a clue to get one of the other letters, since having one I have the other. Note that the K in KEA and the L in LOA are the antepenultimate letters. They are not third from the end unless you’re counting from a punctuation mark, normally missing from crossword puzzles. > [@terentii](#): > > My rule of thumb as a professional translator and editor: If you pronounce the possessive ending, write it. > > I’m perfectly happy with “Mel Brooks’ movies,” but not “Jesus’ disciples.” WTF is a “Jesus’ disciple”??? 😕 The Chicago Manual of Style says, IIRC, that 's is normally added to biblical names - Jesus’s, Moses’s - but that it can be left off other words. Probably just a sop to tradition. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2016, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puzzler-will-shortz-favorite-word/758996/24 "2016-07-03T21:09:24Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > The ultimate is the end. The penultimate is the first from the end. The antepenultimate is the second from the end, i.e. the second from last. It is not the third from the end, unless you live in a world in which the end is past the ultimate. The end of the sequence is #10, the ultimate. The penultimate is #9. The antepenultimate is #8, unless you live in a world where the end of the sequence is not the end of the sequence. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2016, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puzzler-will-shortz-favorite-word/758996/25 "2016-07-03T21:11:35Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > The Chicago Manual of Style says, IIRC, that 's is normally added to biblical names - Jesus’s, Moses’s - but that it can be left off other words. Probably just a sop to tradition. Others I’ve looked at say DO NOT use with Jesus, which just plain baffles me. :mad: ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2016, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puzzler-will-shortz-favorite-word/758996/26 "2016-07-03T21:14:04Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > The end of the sequence is #10, the ultimate. What if it goes to 11? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2016, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puzzler-will-shortz-favorite-word/758996/27 "2016-07-03T22:16:54Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > …but others had you use a bare apostrophe on names ending in s, z, or x. Well, they’re wrong. It’s become convention, but, holy heck, it drives me nuts. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2016, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puzzler-will-shortz-favorite-word/758996/28 "2016-07-03T22:47:18Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > What if it goes to 11? :dubious: That would be the transultimate. ---
**Author:** ![Ellis\_Aponte\_Jr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@Ellis\_Aponte\_Jr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ellis_Aponte_Jr)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2016, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puzzler-will-shortz-favorite-word/758996/29 "2016-07-04T01:01:00Z")
> [@Ukulele\_Ike](#): > > And Rex Parker, the guy who blogs the puzzle, is constantly calling Shortz out on shit fill. > > [http://rexwordpuzzle.blogspot.com/](http://rexwordpuzzle.blogspot.com/) Not about shit fill per se, but there was a big controversy last Friday (July 1) over the Shortz-approved clue, “Teasers, in older usage” for the word LOLITAS. Rex Parker basically refused to blog about that puzzle in protest. ---
**Author:** ![Isamu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/7c8e57/32.png) [@Isamu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isamu)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2016, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puzzler-will-shortz-favorite-word/758996/30 "2016-07-04T01:10:56Z")
nm ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2016, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puzzler-will-shortz-favorite-word/758996/31 "2016-07-04T01:27:17Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Except that people are increasing eliding the /ɪz/ in speaking. I heart it all the time. I UN-heart it all the time. Lazy-ass fuckers. :mad: ---
**Author:** ![Ukulele\_Ike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/df788c/32.png) [@Ukulele\_Ike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ukulele_Ike)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2016, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puzzler-will-shortz-favorite-word/758996/32 "2016-07-04T01:44:10Z")
> [@Ellis\_Aponte\_Jr](#): > > Not about shit fill per se, but there was a big controversy last Friday (July 1) over the Shortz-approved clue, “Teasers, in older usage” for the word LOLITAS. Rex Parker basically refused to blog about that puzzle in protest. Rex Parker has a wild hair up his ass. I agree that the NYT crossword skews old, male, and white. Probably because that reflects its audience. It COULD try to be more up-to-date, but I personally am more likely to get an answer for a Rudy Vallee or Clark Gable clue that one for a contemporary singer or actor. And when I think of a “harem” I am more likely to picture a classic cartoon out of THE NEW YORKER or PLAYBOY than to think of sex slavery. LOLITA is a brilliant modern novel. Sixty years ago, social conservatives said not to read it because it was about a middle-aged man having sex with a pubescent girl. SEX. Today, leftists say not to read it because it is about a middle-aged man having sex with a pubescent girl. RAPE. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2016, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puzzler-will-shortz-favorite-word/758996/33 "2016-07-04T02:47:03Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > The end of the sequence is #10, the ultimate. The penultimate is #9. The antepenultimate is #8, unless you live in a world where the end of the sequence is not the end of the sequence. Are you agreeing with me or disagreeing with me? ---
**Author:** ![Ellis\_Aponte\_Jr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@Ellis\_Aponte\_Jr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ellis_Aponte_Jr)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2016, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puzzler-will-shortz-favorite-word/758996/34 "2016-07-04T02:55:52Z")
> [@Ukulele\_Ike](#): > > Rex Parker has a wild hair up his ass. > > I agree that the NYT crossword skews old, male, and white. Probably because that reflects its audience. It COULD try to be more up-to-date, but I personally am more likely to get an answer for a Rudy Vallee or Clark Gable clue that one for a contemporary singer or actor. > > And when I think of a “harem” I am more likely to picture a classic cartoon out of THE NEW YORKER or PLAYBOY than to think of sex slavery. > > LOLITA is a brilliant modern novel. Sixty years ago, social conservatives said not to read it because it was about a middle-aged man having sex with a pubescent girl. SEX. Today, leftists say not to read it because it is about a middle-aged man having sex with a pubescent girl. RAPE. The mentality that causes someone to get bent out of shape by something like that LOLITA clue is a mentality that I’m afraid I will never relate to for the rest of my life. It seems to come down to an unbridgeable generational difference. Although I appreciate the millennial generation for their progressiveness on many social issues, there always comes a point at which I think they’re acting like ninnies. I don’t know how old Rex Parker is, but I associate his attitudes with millennials. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2016, 4:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puzzler-will-shortz-favorite-word/758996/35 "2016-07-04T04:23:53Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > Are you agreeing with me or disagreeing with me? Is #8 the third from the end? ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2016, 7:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puzzler-will-shortz-favorite-word/758996/36 "2016-07-04T07:03:25Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > What if it goes to 11? :dubious: Actually, for the current discussion, we don’t even need the first 7. So #3 is the ultimate, #2 is the penultimate, and #1 is the antepenultimate. And regarding Rex Parker: Crossword clues are CLUES, not complete definitions or exhaustive sociological treatises. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2016, 7:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puzzler-will-shortz-favorite-word/758996/37 "2016-07-04T07:04:27Z")
> [@GuanoLad](#): > > Well, they’re wrong. It’s become convention, but, holy heck, it drives me nuts. Well, it’s an older convention. The modern style guides generally don’t do it, so you should be seeing less and less of it. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2016, 7:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puzzler-will-shortz-favorite-word/758996/38 "2016-07-04T07:06:58Z")
> [@Roderick\_Femm](#): > > To be clear, when you say that “antepenultimate” means “second from last,” you mean third from the end, yes? Considering a row of 10 objects, “ultimate” would be #10, “penultimate” would be #9, and “antepenultimate” would be #8. Yes, “next to next to last.” I was thinking: last, first from last, second from last, but I see how that could be ambiguously phrased. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2016, 10:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puzzler-will-shortz-favorite-word/758996/39 "2016-07-04T10:39:17Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > Is #8 the third from the end? Oh, come on **Exapno** , don’t leave us hanging! I \*think \*you guys are saying the same thing but appreciate the approach you both are taking. Hilarious that the OP is about Shortz’s’s’s’s favorite word, but has become a gathering place for general crossword- and grammar-geekiness. There’s gotta be a word for that. 😉 ETA: from upthread, yes, _callipygian_. a fine word. I am also big on _snood_. For very different reasons of course. But a callipygian Rosie the Riveter WW2 type wearing a snood could work, right? ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2016, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puzzler-will-shortz-favorite-word/758996/40 "2016-07-04T13:23:15Z")
Then there’s words I like for the little nuggets of trivia or just quriks about them. For example, I like “facetious” because it has all the vowels in order in it (or “facetiously,” if you want to include “y.” There’s also “abstemious/abstemiously” that fits the bill.) Or how “bookkeeper” has three sets of double letters in a row. Or “queueing” for its five vowels in a row. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puzzler-will-shortz-favorite-word/758996.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/puzzler-will-shortz-favorite-word/758996.md?page=3)