# Quantum Matter Influence on Normal Matter **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 27, 2003, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quantum-matter-influence-on-normal-matter/221309 "2003-12-27T21:43:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Crown\_Prince\_of\_Irony](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ed655f/32.png) [@Crown\_Prince\_of\_Irony](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crown_Prince_of_Irony)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quantum-matter-influence-on-normal-matter/221309/41 "2003-12-30T00:32:51Z")
I must say I posted before I saw your recent link to the explanation of wavefunction collapse, **Question**. Wavefunction collapse affects particles on a quantum level, that is on the subatomic level at which quantum mechanics applies. If you start applying it to life on a macro scale, then you must believe that before you woke up this morning, you were both dead and alive, in Albuquerue and Paris, and both a frog and a human. It falls apart once you apply it to anything larger than a molecule. At least, so my non-physicist understanding of the subject tells me. ---
**Author:** ![Joe\_Random](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e8c25b/32.png) [@Joe\_Random](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joe_Random)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quantum-matter-influence-on-normal-matter/221309/42 "2003-12-30T00:39:02Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Question \* > **anyway… according to the reputedly factual physics books i have read what we call reality is a collapsed wavefunction. apparently, measurement(perception in the case of humans) is required to collapse the wave function** My understanding of this concept is not a deep as I would like, so someone with more knowledge is free to correct me at any time. However, based on my level of understanding… It’s not our observation that collapses the wave function, but interaction with other particles/wavefunctions. In the case of our perceptions, it is those interaction that result in the release of a photon that we can perceive with our eyes. It may _appear_ that our observation collapsed the wavefunction, but in reality, our observation was made possible by the _prior_ collapse of the wave function and the resultant release of a photon. > [@](#): > > **basically, observation creates reality. so when you look at something it is created as you observe it, not before.** Just to reiterate, our (visual) observations are based on intercepting photons with our eyes. For a photon to be produced by an interaction, the wavefunction must have already collapsed. > [@](#): > > \*\*there aren’t any scientists studying reincarnation anywhere? \*\* I’d imagine that there’s not enough evidence to even warrant a study. ---
**Author:** ![Question](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/ecc23a/32.png) [@Question](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Question)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quantum-matter-influence-on-normal-matter/221309/43 "2003-12-30T01:11:15Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Crown Prince of Irony \* > \*\*This is really only in response to the last question, but I left your post intact to maintain context. > > If reincarnation is defined as: the concept of some conscious essence of one sentient being passing through time and space in a non-corporeal state to be deposited in another being after the first being has died - then, no. No scientist can study that which by definition generates only anecdotal, and not empirical, data. > > It’s a long stretch to go from a **possible** (but impossible to confirm with absolute certainty) link between the behavior of two isolated particles (quantum non-locality) to the idea of coherent thought patterns and distinct memories passing from one being to another. Aside from the fact that the first has to do with simultaneous action, and the second has to do with action across time - two wholly unrelated presumptions - to study reincarnation would be to ignore the scientific evidence that our conscious minds (or “souls” if you will) are formed by specific neural patterns and organic chemical reactions that remain contained within one’s cranium. Thought patterns and memories are not capable of existence independent from the brain matter from which they arose. > > Let’s go over some of the scientific terms used in this discussion: > Quantum mechanics dictate the bahavior of particles at a subatomic level. > Dark matter is that matter which makes up a significant portion of the universe, which scientists can detect due to it’s gravitational effect, but cannot detect otherwise. > Dark energy is postulated as being a heretofore unknown force believed (by some) to make up the balance of the universe’s mass not accounted for by standard and dark matter. (If you ask me, I think it’s a cheap way out of a very complex problem - personally, I believe that the weak and strong forces have measurable cumulative mass that is unaccounted for with our current understanding of physics, but will not remain so as the science of physics progresses. But then again, I’m no Stephen Hawking, it’s just an idea I had years ago when I was high.) > > But do these scientific terms by their definitions lend themselves to explaining anything to do with human consciousness - reincarnation, or otherwise? No. Dark matter has no bearing on activity at human scale and dark energy seems but a placeholder in astrophysical theory till a better explanation comes along. Quantum mechanics is the only one of these terms that has any potential bearing on a human scale - but while it may dictate which electron goes where in the neural network, quantum mechanics have no impact on a larger scale. Even taking quantum non-locality into account (which only has to do with the interaction of two particles), quantum mechanics can be seen to describe either: A) the interaction, behavior and probablities of multiple particles on a subatomic level (only within a corresponding subatomic sphere of influence); or B) the interaction, behavior and probabilities of two particles separated by distance. If you are postulating that complex thought and memory patterns can be carried by a single subatomic particle, then go ahead and run with it, but you may as well be talking about Aristotle’s Aether. > > I’d love to keep this discussion going, but I’ve got a higher plane to catch. 😃 \*\* reincarnation is just something i latched onto for personal reasons. it is just one thing that is possible if you accept that “consciousness” exists outside of space and time … according to physics we exist in a state that is not subject to the influence of time, right? i guess you could call it a quantum state, but the key fact is that it is what is before the collapse of the wavefunction that creates time. more scienece; apparently our long-term memories are based on synaptic density, shape and whatever other factors are involved… it’s not improbable that the force that scientists refer to as “dark energy” could influence how matter groups before the collapse of the wavefunction, thus influencing our memory of any event. all i am saying is that i believe this is material for “General Questions” and i think that science should at least try to see if reincarnation(and other “superstitions”) exist. ---
**Author:** ![Question](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/ecc23a/32.png) [@Question](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Question)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quantum-matter-influence-on-normal-matter/221309/44 "2003-12-30T01:16:26Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Joe Random \* > \*\*My understanding of this concept is not a deep as I would like, so someone with more knowledge is free to correct me at any time. However, based on my level of understanding… > > It’s not our observation that collapses the wave function, but interaction with other particles/wavefunctions. In the case of our perceptions, it is those interaction that result in the release of a photon that we can perceive with our eyes. It may _appear_ that our observation collapsed the wavefunction, but in reality, our observation was made possible by the _prior_ collapse of the wave function and the resultant release of a photon. > \*\* exactly! this means that something must observe an event before the collapse. god maybe? the hive mind? i don’t know, but that is what i’ve been trying to elucidate… ---
**Author:** ![Joe\_Random](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e8c25b/32.png) [@Joe\_Random](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joe_Random)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quantum-matter-influence-on-normal-matter/221309/45 "2003-12-30T01:23:13Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Question \* > \*\*it’s not improbable that the force that scientists refer to as “dark energy” could influence how matter groups before the collapse of the wavefunction, thus influencing our memory of any event. \*\* Unless I’m very mistaken (and I don’t think I am), any interaction at all will cause the wavefunction to collapse. Thus, any interaction with “dark energy” would necessarily result in the collapse of the wavefunction as part of that interaction. > [@](#): > > \*\*i think that science should at least try to see if reincarnation(and other “superstitions”) exist. \*\* So we need a team of scientists to research things like whether the Tooth Fairy exists or not, or whether breaking a mirror _really_ causes seven years of bad luck? Many things do not lend themselves to scientific research, like God or the soul. Many other things have insufficient evidence to warrant research in the first place, like the Tooth Fairy. I suspect that reincarnation fits into both of those categories. ---
**Author:** ![Joe\_Random](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e8c25b/32.png) [@Joe\_Random](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joe_Random)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quantum-matter-influence-on-normal-matter/221309/46 "2003-12-30T01:28:11Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Question \* > \*\*exactly! this means that something must observe an event before the collapse. \*\* No, nothing has to observe the event. The event _itself_ causes the collapse. No observation is necessary. I think the confusion comes from the fact that many of our methods of observation include, as part of their nature, an interaction that causes a collapse of the wavefunction. However, it is _not_ the observation that causes the collapse, nor is any observation _necessary_ to cause a wavefunction to collapse. ---
**Author:** ![Question](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/ecc23a/32.png) [@Question](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Question)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quantum-matter-influence-on-normal-matter/221309/47 "2003-12-30T01:43:43Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Joe Random \* > \*\*No, nothing has to observe the event. The event _itself_ causes the collapse. No observation is necessary. > > I think the confusion comes from the fact that many of our methods of observation include, as part of their nature, an interaction that causes a collapse of the wavefunction. However, it is _not_ the observation that causes the collapse, nor is any observation _necessary_ to cause a wavefunction to collapse. \*\* but measurement is observation. even if you record the sound of a tree falling the tape recorder was there to observe it. the act of observing collapses the wave function. ---
**Author:** ![Question](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/ecc23a/32.png) [@Question](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Question)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quantum-matter-influence-on-normal-matter/221309/48 "2003-12-30T02:24:14Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Question \* > \*\*but measurement is observation. even if you record the sound of a tree falling the tape recorder was there to observe it. the act of observing collapses the wave function. \*\* this leads to the “god question” … if in order to for something to exist it must be observed than there had to be something there to observe the reality before it could possibly be created. we know that reality did not suddely spring into existence upon our observation of it. so, something else is observing it for us and we are just interpreting it. ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quantum-matter-influence-on-normal-matter/221309/49 "2003-12-30T02:27:44Z")
> [@](#): > > **Joe Random** : Joe Random: So we need a team of scientists to research things like whether the Tooth Fairy exists or not, or whether breaking a mirror really causes seven years of bad luck? This comment indicates to me that you did not understand the nature of the question. [quote] **Joe** : Many things do not lend themselves to scientific research, like God or the soul. Many other things have insufficient evidence to warrant research in the first place, like the Tooth Fairy. I suspect that reincarnation fits into both of those categories. Your analogy is extremely poor. The Tooth Fairy is not out of the range of scientific study because of insufficient evidence! There is plenty of evidence that the Tooth Fairy is fiction. No further evidence is needed! That is very _unlike_ adult religious experiences and beliefs, although I do agree that scientific research is at least somewhat limited. (An exception would be the work of Persinger.) A good skeptic remains open-minded until the evidence is overwhelming – as in the Tooth Fairy. To say that there is no solid evidence of something, therefore it does not exist, is not very scientific. > [@](#): > > **Crown Prince** : to study reincarnation would be to ignore the scientific evidence that our conscious minds (or “souls” if you will) are formed by specific neural patterns and organic chemical reactions that remain contained within one’s cranium. Thought patterns and memories are not capable of existence independent from the brain matter from which they arose. I disagree. To study reincarnation would be to examine the scientific evidence “that our conscious minds are formed by specific neural patterns and organic chemical reactions that remain contained within one’s cranium” _and to question if it is possible_ that thought patterns and memories are capable of existence independent of the brain matter from which they arose. > [@](#): > > Or it could be proof (as some of the quacks say), that the human “consciousness” is interconnected with “reality” in some inexplicable way that lends itself to the type of observations noted, as well as to the burning of stinky candles and the listening of awful New Age music. Ha! Love this description! And the shoe fits, I confess. Just keep in mind that just because a quack says it, that doesn’t mean that it is false. You explanation is excellent. You should be a teacher. **Question** , I understand your question and take a more optimistic view of the potential for science to answer some of these questions eventually. ---
**Author:** ![Question](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/ecc23a/32.png) [@Question](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Question)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quantum-matter-influence-on-normal-matter/221309/50 "2003-12-30T02:54:28Z")
> [@](#): > > **Question** , I understand your question and take a more optimistic view of the potential for science to answer some of these questions eventually. it’s good to know that some people think like me… it assures me that i’m not yet totally crazy 🙂 i was thinking that we are in communication with some higher power. our reality is really a quantum state, sort of a slice of reality… i think our minds our our interpret this quantum state and make sense of associations between energy so that we can go about our daily existence… if all matter is interconnected and time and the pervasive ego and our sense of being somehow different from everything else is just an illusion then it makes sense that the physical brain is able recall past existences because its job is to understand how things relate to each other… ---
**Author:** ![Joe\_Random](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e8c25b/32.png) [@Joe\_Random](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joe_Random)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quantum-matter-influence-on-normal-matter/221309/51 "2003-12-30T02:59:30Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Question \* > **but measurement is observation.** Not exactly. All observations are measurements, but not all measurements are observations. > [@](#): > > \*\*even if you record the sound of a tree falling the tape recorder was there to observe it. the act of observing collapses the wave function. \*\* You’re hung up on this “observer” notation. An observer is not necessary to collapse a wavefunction. _Measurement_ is necessary, but all measurement is is the interaction of a wavefunction with another wavefunction in such a way that a measurable change of one or both of the wavefunctions is the result. We use the term “measurement” because our measurement techniques all result in the collapse of the wavefunction, but it would better be termed “interaction”. “Interaction” collapses the wavefunction. So in short, we must measure to observe, and all of our measurement techniques change the system being measured in such a way that the wavefunction collapses. Yet you cannot say that observation collapses the wavefunction. For example: In order to eat a steak, we must first (hopefully) cook it. Let’s pretend that all of our cooking techniques involve preheating an oven. Now, even though you will _have_ to preheat an oven in order to eat a steak, you cannot say “eating steak preheats ovens”. It’s just that, if we want steak, we have to preheat the oven to cook it. Likewise, if we want to observe something, we must collapse the wavefunction to measure it. The observation isn’t the cause, it’s the _result_. ---
**Author:** ![Joe\_Random](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e8c25b/32.png) [@Joe\_Random](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joe_Random)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quantum-matter-influence-on-normal-matter/221309/52 "2003-12-30T03:21:04Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Zoe \* > **This comment indicates to me that you did not understand the nature of the question.** I was not responding to a question. I was responding to a [_statement_. Specifically: > [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Question_ > i think that science should at least try to see if reincarnation( **and other “superstitions”** ) exist Bolding mine. **Question** is proposing that scientists put effort into researching superstitions, and that is what I responded to. > [@](#): > > **say that there is no solid evidence of something, therefore it does not exist, is not very scientific.** I always assume _everything_ to not exist until some evidence of its existence is presented. The amount of evidence I require to change my mind from “doesn’t exist” to “does exist” is directly proportional to how much the entity in question deviates from everything else I have concluded “does exist”. If you said, “I have a red couch at my house”, that would be enough to convince me that the red couch exists (assuming that you have no history of dishonesty when telling me things". However, if you said “I have a red couch that walks around the room on its own”, I would inquire further as to the nature of its locomotion. If you are unable to provide enough supporting evidence – such as “A friend of mine designs animatronics for Disney World, and he rigged my couch. See? Here’s a picture of the couch showing the exposed pneumatic legs, and here’s the control mechanism.” – then I would not be inclined to believe that such a couch exists. > [@](#): > > **I disagree. To study reincarnation would be to examine the scientific evidence “that our conscious minds are formed by specific neural patterns and organic chemical reactions that remain contained within one’s cranium” _and to question if it is possible_ that thought patterns and memories are capable of existence independent of the brain matter from which they arose.** I quite believe that thought patterns and memories are **capable** of existence independent of the brain matter from which they arose. For instance, if I were to run a perfect simulation of my brain on a computer, it would, for all intents and purposes, be _me_ in that computer. However, the problem is that there is no evidence whatsoever that thought patterns and memories actually **have** an existence independent of the brain matter from which they arose. Nor is there any proposed mechanism for how this might work. Thus there is no starting point for any sort of scientific research. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quantum-matter-influence-on-normal-matter/221309/53 "2003-12-30T03:47:26Z")
To oversimplify a bit, the notion that an observation of some type is needed to collapse the wave function is an outgrowth of the Copenhagen Interpretation of Quantum Theory. However, there are other interpretations (the Many-Worlds Theory is one gaining acceptance) that do **not** require this and provide other mechanisms for the wave functions collapse. All of these Interpretations are mathematically equivalent to one another, so it is a metaphysical choice at the present to choose one over the others. There is also no good explanation at present for why the quantum world sees effects that are not apparent in the macro world, like non-locality. This is also a matter of much argument and controversy. But the consensus is that one cannot use quantum explanations for macro world behaviors. And let’s not even get into consciousness or the way the brain works. For all the wordage spilled on this, nobody has any compelling argument that has gained the high ground. We need to get a grip on how our current lives happen before we can start throwing around mechanisms for a past life recurring. ---
**Author:** ![Punoqllads](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d2c977/32.png) [@Punoqllads](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Punoqllads)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quantum-matter-influence-on-normal-matter/221309/54 "2003-12-30T04:02:44Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Crown Prince of Irony \* > When one simultaneously observes two separate but dependent particles (say a photon singlet) separated by some distance, and changes the state of one particle, the other is observed to undergo a corresponding change, **seemingly** instantaneously. This “communication” between particles seems to violate a basic physical law, that nothing can travel faster than light. I believe you are speaking about [Bell’s Inequality](http://math.ucr.edu/home/baez/physics/Quantum/bells_inequality.html), but the change in state that you mention does not get communicated across the distance as you say. What happens is that you get information about a system at a distance, which then theoretically collapses the wave equation of that distant system. This would seem to imply that either you are causing this collapse at a distance by faster-than-light means, which is unlikely, or that there are some “hidden variables” that fully describe each system’s state, and the wave equation is merely a mathematical construct. Here, physicists usually lose me in explaining how the collapse of the distant system doesn’t really contradict special relativity, but in any case, by measuring the local system, you are in no way altering the remote system, just altering your knowledge of the remote system. ---
**Author:** ![Question](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/ecc23a/32.png) [@Question](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Question)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quantum-matter-influence-on-normal-matter/221309/55 "2003-12-30T04:09:04Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Joe Random \* > \*\*I was not responding to a question. I was responding to a [_statement_. Specifically: > > Bolding mine. > > **Question** is proposing that scientists put effort into researching superstitions, and that is what I responded to. > > I always assume _everything_ to not exist until some evidence of its existence is presented. The amount of evidence I require to change my mind from “doesn’t exist” to “does exist” is directly proportional to how much the entity in question deviates from everything else I have concluded “does exist”. > > If you said, “I have a red couch at my house”, that would be enough to convince me that the red couch exists (assuming that you have no history of dishonesty when telling me things". However, if you said “I have a red couch that walks around the room on its own”, I would inquire further as to the nature of its locomotion. If you are unable to provide enough supporting evidence – such as “A friend of mine designs animatronics for Disney World, and he rigged my couch. See? Here’s a picture of the couch showing the exposed pneumatic legs, and here’s the control mechanism.” – then I would not be inclined to believe that such a couch exists. > > I quite believe that thought patterns and memories are **capable** of existence independent of the brain matter from which they arose. For instance, if I were to run a perfect simulation of my brain on a computer, it would, for all intents and purposes, be _me_ in that computer. > > However, the problem is that there is no evidence whatsoever that thought patterns and memories actually **have** an existence independent of the brain matter from which they arose. Nor is there any proposed mechanism for how this might work. Thus there is no starting point for any sort of scientific research. \*\* there is a scientific starting point. science says that memory depends on the structure of synapses in our brain. our synapses exist in a quantum state and thus exist outside of time, which is just a concept of the mind anyway… the wavefunction collapses and reality is created… if memories are just the shape of synapses than it’s possible some of the raw data of reality could get past the ego and make us see how we existed previously and the synapse would alter its shape as a result, forming the long-term memory… ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 4:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quantum-matter-influence-on-normal-matter/221309/56 "2003-12-30T04:29:01Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Question \* > \*\*there is a scientific starting point. science says that memory depends on the structure of synapses in our brain. our synapses exist in a quantum state and thus exist outside of time, which is just a concept of the mind anyway… the wavefunction collapses and reality is created… if memories are just the shape of synapses than it’s possible some of the raw data of reality could get past the ego and make us see how we existed previously and the synapse would alter its shape as a result, forming the long-term memory… \*\* I know you’ve stopped responding to anything I say, but just for the record, not one word of this is true or in any way meaningful. As Wolfgang Pauli used to say, it’s not even wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Joe\_Random](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e8c25b/32.png) [@Joe\_Random](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joe_Random)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quantum-matter-influence-on-normal-matter/221309/57 "2003-12-30T04:37:22Z")
QUOTE]\*Originally posted by Question \* **our synapses exist in a quantum state and thus exist outside of time** [/quote] There is no indication that quantum states exist outside of time, though. > [@](#): > > **the wavefunction collapses and reality is created…** Cart before the horse. Reality causes the wavefunction to collapse (which would happen even if no one were there to see it), and we observe the result. > [@](#): > > \*\*if memories are just the shape of synapses than it’s possible some of the raw data of reality could get past the ego and make us see how we existed previously and the synapse would alter its shape as a result, forming the long-term memory… \*\* That’s _way_ to many assumptions and undefined terms. What is the “raw data of reality”? What is the “ego”, and how could this data be “get past it”? In fact, what does that even mean? What evidence is there that anyone “existed previously”, and what is the evidence that synapses are altering their shapes due to these time-traveling quantum wavefunctions? No offense, but you’re just throwing out a mishmash of pseudoscience (using the guise of real scientific terms) and metaphysics that make no sense together (or even separately). ---
**Author:** ![BraveNewSquirle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a9a28c/32.png) [@BraveNewSquirle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BraveNewSquirle)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 4:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quantum-matter-influence-on-normal-matter/221309/58 "2003-12-30T04:42:51Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Exapno Mapcase \* > \*\*No, sorry. **eburacum45** was making a joke. Your brain doesn’t give off light, true, so it is “dark”, but that is a different meaning to the word “dark.” If you scooped out your brain it would be completely visible, but the cosmological dark matter cannot be seen at all. > > Dark matter exists in large quantities in space but we have no current evidence that any of it is in, on, or around Earth in reasonable amounts or else we would have discovered it a long time ago. Certainly, there is absolutely nothing to suggest that dark matter in any way influences the day to day activities of the human brain. \*\* We don’t know that there is a huge quantity of dark matter out there. For all we know it might just be matter with an extraordinary gravitational pull. 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![Question](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/ecc23a/32.png) [@Question](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Question)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 4:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quantum-matter-influence-on-normal-matter/221309/59 "2003-12-30T04:58:12Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Exapno Mapcase \* > \*\*I know you’ve stopped responding to anything I say, but just for the record, not one word of this is true or in any way meaningful. > > As Wolfgang Pauli used to say, it’s not even wrong. \*\* i’m here so you can shoot holes in my theory. i enjoy thinking about the meaning of life and i am personally convinced in the truth of reincarnation. all of this is an attempt to put a logical spin on something i have already accepted. i am aware of the possibility that i’m wrong but that just means i need to go back to the drawing board not that i discard the belief that i have personally experienced past lives… ---
**Author:** ![Baldwin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baldwin/32/7264_2.png) [@Baldwin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baldwin)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 6:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quantum-matter-influence-on-normal-matter/221309/60 "2003-12-30T06:09:24Z")
**Question** , look, if you believe you’ve been reincarnated, fine. However all the information that’s been offered in this thread boils down to this: no, current scientific thinking doesn’t include any mechanism that could achieve reincarnation, nor is there any good evidence that reincarnation has ever happened. It’s hard to accept the idea that everything that makes up our minds, our memories, our thoughts, feelings and dreams, exists in the physical (normal matter) structure of our brains. Three pounds of soft tissue. If it’s destroyed, we go out like a light. If a belief in some sort of afterlife gives you comfort, I’m not going to try and argue you out of it; but you’ve got nothing that qualifies as a scientific theory. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quantum-matter-influence-on-normal-matter/221309.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quantum-matter-influence-on-normal-matter/221309.md?page=4)